How good is geographical knowledge amongst rail staff?

AlexS · 6 Oct 2013

If you're in a customer facing role then knowing at least regional and major national connections is essential. I know where you can get to, roughly, from every station my station's trains stop at (with the exception of some of the East Anglian ones, Needham Market threw me the other day - I knew roughly where it was, but not which out of Peterborough/Ely/Cambridge to change at!). Obviously not so easy at somewhere like New Street. When I've been on my East Midlands area customer service desk, I've had enquiries for everywhere from Nottingham to Bridge of Allan!

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Essexman · 6 Oct 2013

I had to spell Worcester in order that the booking clerk at our local station could find it on his machine to sell me a ticket. We used to have staff there who knew the railway system. Now half of them struggle to sell any ticket that isn't on our local line.

krus_aragon · 6 Oct 2013

Gwenllian2001 said:
A couple of weeks ago I asked the Booking Clerk, at Bridgend, whether it was possible to book a ticket to Tredegar. She immediately quoted Newport as the nearest station. I pointed out that Rhymney is only a couple of miles from Tredegar and that there is a bus link shown in the timetable. She just shrugged and said;

'I can book you to Rhymney, if you'd prefer'.

I got the impression that she had no idea where Rhymney or Tredegar are.

Just to play devil's advocate, there is Tredegar House and Tredegar Park on the outskirts of Newport...

Sir_Clagalot · 6 Oct 2013

I had one to Haslemere the other day, completely flummoxed me as to how to spell it so I had to search for it!! I had heard of it just never had to spell it before!!
I do get some stations that I have to ask "where's that?"!

TheEdge · 6 Oct 2013

This does seem a little unfair to be honest. If you are born and bred in East Anglia how would you be expected to know where Caersws is?

Or could everyone on here instantly reel of the changes for any journey between any two stations in the UK from memory?

ChiefPlanner · 6 Oct 2013

Oswyntail said:
Hope that was the right Cwmtwrch

That will do nicely , thank you. Just trying to think of an unlikely question to be asked of the staff at (say) Hoxton.

I find the London based staff I see every day , very good at the complexities of the South East - especially links off the Bedford - Brighton route. They have access if not directly to the journey planner - then via the Service Control Centre (information desk)

dk1 · 6 Oct 2013

Was once asked at Great Yarmouth for a return to Betws-y-Coed by a smug pensioner who said "that's thrown you hasn't it" I looked back just as smug & said "obviously your changing at Llandudno Junction but do you want via London or cross country" :lol:

trentside · 6 Oct 2013

dk1 said:
Was once asked at Great Yarmouth for a return to Betws-y-Coed by a smug pensioner who said "that's thrown you hasn't it" I looked back just as smug & said "obviously your changing at Llandudno Junction but do you want via London or cross country"

I must admit to being in similar situations on a few occasions. I've had a few instantly start spelling it - and look put out when I've told them I know how to spell it (or know its CRS code). Now who's the smug one :lol:

TheKnightWho · 6 Oct 2013

starmill said:
It's helped me out loads (and I bet staff get this feeling sometimes too, esp ones on here who are the most likely to be interested)!

Meeting loads of new people for the first time, as you do in Freshers' week, many are astonished that you've heard of their town.

"Where you from?"
"Northumberland"
"Oooh, interesting, where exactly?"
"Oh, you won't know it, someplace near Newcastle."
"Go on, Try me!"
"Umm, Hexham."
"Oh yeah, its sort of in the middle, between Newcastle and Carlisle."
*Shocked face*

I have to say, you threw me a little just now by using my own home town as an example

harz99 · 6 Oct 2013

trentside said:
I must admit to being in similar situations on a few occasions. I've had a few instantly start spelling it - and look put out when I've told them I know how to spell it (or know its CRS code). Now who's the smug one

CRS codes - now your talking!

When I take a list of CRS coded journeys for seat reservations into my local station I have to be cautious as to which member of staff is on duty; one is an old hand and knows most of the codes, another is much newer and is making a conscious effort to learn the codes, and the rest day relief has knowledge of most of the major routes but needs an occasional explanation for more obscure stations.

Even with todays computer systems CRS code knowledge must help shave seconds off many transactions, which all helps to reduce Q times.

ChiefPlanner · 6 Oct 2013

Strawberry Hill used to confuse some (Cambrian Conductors...)

Gwenllian2001 · 6 Oct 2013

ChiefPlanner said:
Strawberry Hill used to confuse some (Cambrian Conductors...)

Only if they were Protestant .....

TheEdge · 6 Oct 2013

dk1 said:
Was once asked at Great Yarmouth for a return to Betws-y-Coed by a smug pensioner who said "that's thrown you hasn't it" I looked back just as smug & said "obviously your changing at Llandudno Junction but do you want via London or cross country"

I had a similar one recently from Yarmouth, more impressed with the fact I could spell and knew where Blaenau Ffestiniog was!

sarahj · 6 Oct 2013

TheKnightWho said:
I have to say, you threw me a little just now by using my own home town as an example

Hexham, thats an easy one, mind I did used to live between Hexham and Carlisle.

I think I know most major places. We used to have a board game called, the great game of Britain, where you visited places by train. I used to know the stations on the game which were not even marked.

But somedays can throw you.

The other week while waiting for my horsham stopper to leave London Bridge, a woman came up and asked where the train to Hayes was. All I could think was Hayes and Harlington on the GWML. Had to look it up and found Hayes (kent). Got her to the right train.

And a few weeks ago, came across a woman on the train going from Lemmington to Seaford. Only issue was her ticket was for Sleaford. Had to look that one up. (change at Grantham). Anyway, let her travel and told her to speak to the ticket office at Seaford to sort it out (for her return) and called the ticket office at Seaford, so they were ready for her..

A few weeks ago I was off track and was at Gatwick, and was somehow left running the info desk at Gatwick Airport station for about 5 hours alone during rush hour, with only an advantix as company. It was non stop questions, including, I need to get to Paris (an easy one TBH). With the only person going away miffed was when FGW cancelled their Reading-Gatwick service at Redhill (again) and i could not do exactly as she wanted.

But there is always gonna be some who is miffed cause of the top off your head you dont know what time the next SWT at Clapham is going to get into Tolworth just as your shutting the doors on your train.

SJ

Matt Taylor · 6 Oct 2013

Despite checking hundreds of tickets daily it's been a few weeks since I saw one I didn't know, and that was Craigendoran (400 miles away).

ANorthernGuard · 6 Oct 2013

(imho) most staff know where roughly most stations are (if given the county) we are not computers and yes some people make silly mistakes or do not have a clue where somewhere is. If I don't know I will be honest and say so! Surely if passengers want to have exact locations there is something called a Map! lol

Sadsmileyface · 6 Oct 2013

Matt Taylor said:
Despite checking hundreds of tickets daily it's been a few weeks since I saw one I didn't know, and that was Craigendoran (400 miles away).

Everyone should know Craigendoran! That's where the Mallaig / Oban trains split/join!

Kind of sums up the OP's question.

Edit: of course I mean Crianlarich. So yes, it's getting worse.

455driver · 6 Oct 2013

Staffs geographical knowledge is about as good as most enthusiasts mechanical and rules knowledge!

Llanigraham · 6 Oct 2013

455driver said:
Staffs geographical knowledge is BETTER THAN most enthusiasts mechanical and rules knowledge!

Corrected that for you!!

455driver · 6 Oct 2013

Llanigraham said:
Corrected that for you!!

I was going to put that but thought better of it!

route:oxford · 6 Oct 2013

Sadsmileyface said:
Edit: of course I mean Crianlarich. So yes, it's getting worse.

A' Chrìon Làraich Surely?

In an independent Scotland you can be sure that the Gaelic names will be first and foremost on tickets and signage.

harz99 · 6 Oct 2013

route:oxford said:
A' Chrìon Làraich Surely?

In an independent Scotland you can be sure that the Gaelic names will be first and foremost on tickets and signage.

That would be more money wasted, as many stations have only recently been rebranded with bilingual English first signs. Despite living/staying in different parts of Scotland over the years I have never ever heard Gaelic spoken. Which is different to my experiences in Wales.

TheEdge · 6 Oct 2013

route:oxford said:
A' Chrìon Làraich Surely?

In an independent Scotland you can be sure that the Gaelic names will be first and foremost on tickets and signage.

An independent Scotland that can be quickly removed from the UK fares database. Or maybe have an international travel levy attached to fares.

route:oxford · 6 Oct 2013

TheEdge said:
An independent Scotland that can be quickly removed from the UK fares database. Or maybe have an international travel levy attached to fares.

Or a bit like Belgium. Either a ticket to Edinburgh or "Any Scottish Station"

Well, and independent Scotland shouldn't be on a UK fares database as it won't be in the UK...

158801 · 6 Oct 2013

I would be able to tell you where about 99% of stations are. There are very few that I have never heard off.

When I started on the railway there were no computers. It was all done the old fashioned way - with timetables.

Then, when computers were introduced they would always send you on the quickest route - whether it was valid or not. So Paddington to Sheffield with 1 change could throw up a change a Bristol !

Staff now work at stations with very little training. Some use the TOPS/TRUST system - like those at the information point at Manchester Piccadilly. Like those early computers (how many remember CATE ?) they send you any way they like. Then those passengers travelling from Manchester to Chester get pulled up on the train because they have been given times via Preston (OK - I know maybe a bad example).

Avantix on the train uses the same out of date technology.

It's a bit like SatNavs. Who need to be able to read a map when they have a SatNav - and then go down a road with a height restriction - because they rely 100% on technology.

As mentioned earlier. Do TOC's employ someone who know how to get from Peartree to Cherry Tree off the top of their head or someone who can smile and "look" the part ?

306024 · 6 Oct 2013

I quite enjoy having my geographical knowledge tested by passengers. Hopefully you know where they want, but there's no shame in not knowing every station in the UK.

It was good fun during the Olympics at Stratford with so many people asking for all sorts of obscure destinations. My favourite though was the guy that asked which platform for Cyprus. I'll leave that as a test for you

Starmill · 6 Oct 2013

306024 said:
I quite enjoy having my geographical knowledge tested by passengers. Hopefully you know where they want, but there's no shame in not knowing every station in the UK.

It was good fun during the Olympics at Stratford with so many people asking for all sorts of obscure destinations. My favourite though was the guy that asked which platform for Cyprus. I'll leave that as a test for you

Oh, very good!

Darren R · 6 Oct 2013

306024 said:
I quite enjoy having my geographical knowledge tested by passengers. Hopefully you know where they want, but there's no shame in not knowing every station in the UK.

It was good fun during the Olympics at Stratford with so many people asking for all sorts of obscure destinations. My favourite though was the guy that asked which platform for Cyprus. I'll leave that as a test for you

Good job he asked you and not his SatNav! :lol:

Roverman · 6 Oct 2013

158801 said:
I would be able to tell you where about 99% of stations are. There are very few that I have never heard off.

When I started on the railway there were no computers. It was all done the old fashioned way - with timetables.

Then, when computers were introduced they would always send you on the quickest route - whether it was valid or not. So Paddington to Sheffield with 1 change could throw up a change a Bristol !

Staff now work at stations with very little training. Some use the TOPS/TRUST system - like those at the information point at Manchester Piccadilly. Like those early computers (how many remember CATE ?) they send you any way they like. Then those passengers travelling from Manchester to Chester get pulled up on the train because they have been given times via Preston (OK - I know maybe a bad example).

Avantix on the train uses the same out of date technology.

It's a bit like SatNavs. Who need to be able to read a map when they have a SatNav - and then go down a road with a height restriction - because they rely 100% on technology.

As mentioned earlier. Do TOC's employ someone who know how to get from Peartree to Cherry Tree off the top of their head or someone who can smile and "look" the part ?

I think you have hit the nail on the head and it is very similar in my industry, I have newbies coming back from 5 weeks 'intensive' training and they haven't got the first idea what we do or how we do it and I then spend the next 6 months teaching them myself.

Starmill · 7 Oct 2013

Or like when I used Google Maps to find a bank branch in a city centre and ended up being directed to the eponymous Mediterranean city...

How good is geographical knowledge amongst rail staff?

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