The Planner
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So what do we do to allow for ESR/TSRs in schedules then, if everything apart from a raw sectional running time is "padding" we might as well all go home now.
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Midland Main Line, 125 mph from 8 December 2013
- Thread starter shinkansen1966
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So what do we do to allow for ESR/TSRs in schedules then, if everything apart from a raw sectional running time is "padding" we might as well all go home now.
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Martin222002
Member
That could be true, if it weren't for the fact I use the MML daily and still see plenty of TSR signs along the route.
I too use the MML fairly reguarley, and I wasn't saying there aren't any TSRs. The fact that trains are running late, predominate due to the TSRs currently in place along the MML, shows even further that it is the higher line speeds, which should be in operation, are what have aloud the journey time reductions.
asylumxl
Established Member
I'm sorry I do not use the terminology you do, but to a laymen like myself any "allowances" are padding (required or otherwise) to me even if that is not the correct term. Maybe you should go home now and have a nap?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
On the southern half of the MML it seems to me that they are able to keep time despite the TSRs. I assume this is due to the effects of the speed increases being more pronounced the longer the journey.
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edwin_m
Veteran Member
Just for a bit of balance, the 1515 from St Pancras got into Nottingham about 5 early today. I was working so didn't pay too much attention to its running but there were a couple of what felt like signal checks on the way.
222001
Member
I'm sorry I do not use the terminology you do, but to a laymen like myself any "allowances" are padding (required or otherwise) to me even if that is not the correct term. Maybe you should go home now and have a nap?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
On the southern half of the MML it seems to me that they are able to keep time despite the TSRs. I assume this is due to the effects of the speed increases being more pronounced the longer the journey.
That does seem to be the case on the Sheffield fasts going north-bound. A lot seem to run on time until the Market Harborough area - there just doesn't seem to be enough time in the timetable to get from Market Harborough to Leicester on time. Which is funny as that area had very small speed increases... I haven't seen a single Sheffield fast arrive on time in Leicester based on the working timetable - which is leaving London at xx58 and arriving Leicester at xx59.
The fact is though there are two minutes of allowance between London and Leicester, so in effect you should be arriving 2 minutes early in Leicester based on the working timetable if it was a 'perfect' run.
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Hairy Bear
Member
Market Harboro' to Leicester has had no speed increases. There has been a 50 restriction at Newton Harcourt due to re-laying. There are 4 TSR's on the section Radlett to Bedford which are causing the odd minute to be lost up to Leicester but the working timetable does not reflect what takes place on each trip. Regulating issues by West Hampstead and the EMCC(Derby) are the main causes of the delays to most services along with over station time at some stops.
asylumxl
Established Member
Reasonably long TSRs still I assume/
222001
Member
I bet XC Birmingham services are a bit of a problem at Wigston, it's very tight between a 170 crossing over towards Birmingham and then the Sheffield fast coming up from London.
The speed increases I mentioned between Market Harborough and Leicester are ones quoted by Network Rail in Modern Railways last summer, obviously things have changed since back then...
I also took note the other day how the 125 sign just after Loughborough is still covered up and hasn't been commissioned...
Qwerty133
Established Member
They won't stick to the public timetable while they continue to have same minute departures at Leicester, or while they continue to allow multiple bikes on during the peak.
The LNE Sectional Appendix has been updated again (public copy).
The linespeed increases are reflected in the document, although the stretch between Kettering and Loughborough seems to be unchanged.
The linespeed increases are reflected in the document, although the stretch between Kettering and Loughborough seems to be unchanged.
222001
Member
That's because these speeds haven't been commissioned yet. The speed boards still have bags over them. I'm hoping that these will be done from Easter when there is a massive block on the MML from Leicester to Bedford...
Class 170101
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Avoid MML on this day I think. Trains between Kettering to Sheffield also diverted via Corby and Oakham and not calling at Leicester. Sheffield also reduced to two platforms in operation.
CallySleeper
Established Member
Yes - in the last year, there was a full weekend of diversions avoiding Leicester completely, and HSTs sometimes find themselves working one of the handful of weekday trains north of Corby (0930 ex-Corby seems favourite at the moment, during the Unstone works).
Class 170101
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MML HSTs have used them. UK Railtours have used them on occasion as well with HSTs.
asylumxl
Established Member
From what I see on my commute, the majority of TSR from south of Luton are still in place.
43074
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I understand the change in May is only to create a more reliable service... by removing the TSRs and launching a non-TSR'd MML. Recently a new TSR has appeared before Leicester South Junction (where the freight loop around Leicester station diverges from the main line) and there are also a few 110mph TSRs between Loughborough & Leicester.
Hairy Bear
Member
HSt services Nott's to London remain timed at 110mph. with just a few minutes shaved off.
The 07.50 Robin Hood is the only marginally improved one, well thats when it gets a decent run.
Class 170101
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Is there any reason for leaving HSTs timed at 110mph? They run at 125mph on the East Coast Main Line and Great Western Main Line where permitted after all.
andythebrave
Member
Don't know, but I have been on a 125 at 125 on this line recently so, presumably, they do have permission to run at the higher speed.
Hairy Bear
Member
There just not powerful enough to make any serious reduction in times.
Althoiugh timed at 110 if we get late theres a couple of places where we can take advantage of the new speeds. But it's rare to be able to reach above 120.
Northbound currently possible, Radlett to St.Albans, Bedford to Sharnbrook jn and downhill Sharnbrook. Nowhere Southbound currently
But we ned a healthy set.
Althoiugh timed at 110 if we get late theres a couple of places where we can take advantage of the new speeds. But it's rare to be able to reach above 120.
Northbound currently possible, Radlett to St.Albans, Bedford to Sharnbrook jn and downhill Sharnbrook. Nowhere Southbound currently
But we ned a healthy set.
swt_passenger
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The description of the MML line speed improvements in the CP4 enhancements plan does explain that it is mainly all about Meridian timings to Sheffield, with a reduction of only 5 minutes for HSTs to Nottingham.
Reading it again just now, I can't really see why anyone would expect any major improvements...
Reading it again just now, I can't really see why anyone would expect any major improvements...
RichmondCommu
Established Member
Just a quick question! Why are all sets not healthy? I'm assuming here that they all head back to Neville Hill at night for servicing. I know their acceleration is nothing like as good as the Meridians but never the less I am surprised by this.
Hairy Bear
Member
A fair porportion don't develop full amps or take too long to develop full amps from idle . Get two together and your in for a sedate ride.
And they dont all go back to NL each night. 3 stay at Derby and one out at London.There not bothered about the low power problems as long as they go out each morning.
shinkansen1966
Member
According to the East Midlands Trains 5 December 2013 press release:
http://www.eastmidlandstrains.co.uk...-Trains-Prepares-for-Launch-of-New-Timetable/
"Once the scheme has been fully completed by Network Rail, East Midlands Trains will look to make further improvements to journey times during 2014."
So what exactly will the "further improvements" be during 2014 ? Don't see any further improvements in the May 2014 timetable.
http://www.eastmidlandstrains.co.uk...-Trains-Prepares-for-Launch-of-New-Timetable/
"Once the scheme has been fully completed by Network Rail, East Midlands Trains will look to make further improvements to journey times during 2014."
So what exactly will the "further improvements" be during 2014 ? Don't see any further improvements in the May 2014 timetable.
Class 170101
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December 2014 is still (just) in 2014 so maybe we will see changes then.
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