Great Western Electrification Progress

LNW-GW Joint · 19 Oct 2015

Some stats after a run round the GW route today (Newport to Pad via Bath and back via Badminton).
If we are looking at Swindon as the first objective (65 miles of new wiring) I reckon the status is:
- bases 76% complete
- masts 44%
- portals 32%

There are still 15 miles of missing bases.
These are west of Uffington, through Sonning Cutting, 3 miles west of Maidenhead, and through most stations.
28 miles of route east of Didcot East Jn has masts, but there are about 160 missing.
Where there are masts, about 200 are missing portals.
I can't see any wiring going up before Christmas.

West of Swindon, there are 3 patches of bases, around Wootton Bassett, at Pilning and Llanwern.
No sign of any electrification work on the Bath route, except stacks of piles in Bristol East Depot yard.
No sign either of resignalling work on this route, after Thingley Jn.
Plenty of activity on Filton Bank, presumably linked to the 4-tracking project.
As there is signalling kit on the old trackbed, presumably they will have to resignal first before doing any remodelling.

RailUK Forums

TommyJ · 19 Oct 2015

Thanks for such a clear and concise update. Pls keep em coming!

HowardGWR · 19 Oct 2015

TommyJ said:
Thanks for such a clear and concise update. Pls keep em coming!

Indeed, echoed. Since the locations are so widespread, I can only assume that there is a very sophisticated plan behind all this seemingly somewhat random effort. Being flippant, it's almost as though they meet at the beginning of the day and someone says 'where shall we go today chaps?'.

Ironside · 20 Oct 2015

Good to see that so many of the bases are in as that's the work that upset the signalling and more visually dramatic work, ie mast erection must follow soon.

hassaanhc · 20 Oct 2015

Ironside said:
Good to see that so many of the bases are in as that's the work that upset the signalling and more visually dramatic work, ie mast erection must follow soon.

Engineering overrun this morning though between Reading and Slough :P

Philip Phlopp · 20 Oct 2015

HowardGWR said:
Indeed, echoed. Since the locations are so widespread, I can only assume that there is a very sophisticated plan behind all this seemingly somewhat random effort. Being flippant, it's almost as though they meet at the beginning of the day and someone says 'where shall we go today chaps?'.

It depends where they can get to and then back from before the start of service each day - tends to be fairly consistent Tuesday to Thursday, more ECS early morning on Monday, more ECS late evening Friday, and there's other engineering works at weekends to contend with (since HOPS and other piling trains are rail vehicles, a deficit in the number of rails present tends to stop their progress).

When foundations are in, RRVs can do mast, TTC and gantry/portal erection and SPS fitment, so there can be a bit of a push to get foundations in before some closures which allows other teams to make use of a possession.

It looks random and occasionally is a bit random, but the vast majority is planned very tightly (or was, a long, long, long time ago).

LNW-GW Joint · 20 Oct 2015

Philip Phlopp said:
It looks random and occasionally is a bit random, but the vast majority is planned very tightly (or was, a long, long, long time ago).

What do we make of the many piles around Slough which have been left standing proud vertically for many weeks instead of being driven home?
Some of them are within sight of Balfour's depot at Langley!
This is outside the HOPS area, being in the Crossrail section.
And why is nothing going on between MP 24-27 west of Maidenhead, a section you would think was critical to any electric operation?

In many ways the most impressive part of the recent electrification works is that around Kensal Green, Acton and Stockley where much new trackage has been built and electrified for access to the new train depots and the Heathrow branch.

Phil. · 20 Oct 2015

LNW-GW Joint said:
What do we make of the many piles around Slough which have been left standing proud vertically for many weeks instead of being driven home?
Some of them are within sight of Balfour's depot at Langley!
This is outside the HOPS area, being in the Crossrail section.
And why is nothing going on between MP 24-27 west of Maidenhead, a section you would think was critical to any electric operation?

In many ways the most impressive part of the recent electrification works is that around Kensal Green, Acton and Stockley where much new trackage has been built and electrified for access to the new train depots and the Heathrow branch.

Trackage?
For heaven's sake...........

Philip Phlopp · 20 Oct 2015

LNW-GW Joint said:
What do we make of the many piles around Slough which have been left standing proud vertically for many weeks instead of being driven home?
Some of them are within sight of Balfour's depot at Langley!
This is outside the HOPS area, being in the Crossrail section.
And why is nothing going on between MP 24-27 west of Maidenhead, a section you would think was critical to any electric operation?

In many ways the most impressive part of the recent electrification works is that around Kensal Green, Acton and Stockley where much new trackage has been built and electrified for access to the new train depots and the Heathrow branch.

They're usually left standing because the normal MOVAX piling unit can't get the pile fully into the ground, they're usually left waiting for a heavier duty unit to come and finish them off.

MP24-27 isn't a dramatic issue at this stage, as long as the wiring gangs can do complete wire runs, fitting in foundations, masts and steelwork erection for one or two complete wiring runs at another time doesn't hold things up, and there's often a good reason - possession or other - which explains why something has been done early, something else is missing, or a combination of both.

The Rules of the Route are available on Network Rail's site somewhere, have a look at where possessions have been planned, what work has been going on, what parts of the line are off limits to electrification and it suddenly looks a lot less haphazard (OK, a bit less haphazard).

Ploughman · 20 Oct 2015

From the BBC local Berks web page.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-34581751

Goring Gap 'ugly scar' railway gantries removal call.

Campaigners want Network Rail to remove metal gantries in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty (AONB) they call an "ugly scar on the landscape".
The "huge metal goalposts" installed near Goring Gap in the Chilterns, are the latest step in the electrification of the Great Western Railway.
Residents claim they have not been properly consulted.
Network Rail said it was "working actively" to address any concerns through a series of drop-in sessions.

Andrewlong · 20 Oct 2015

Ploughman said:
From the BBC local Berks web page.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-34581751

Goring Gap 'ugly scar' railway gantries removal call.

Campaigners want Network Rail to remove metal gantries in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty (AONB) they call an "ugly scar on the landscape".
The "huge metal goalposts" installed near Goring Gap in the Chilterns, are the latest step in the electrification of the Great Western Railway.
Residents claim they have not been properly consulted.
Network Rail said it was "working actively" to address any concerns through a series of drop-in sessions.

i saw this on the TV tonight and yes the gantries are not pretty but I hardly think Network Rail are going to replace them with something more sympathetic just because line passes through an AONB. NR will consult but looks like it's a done deal as they haven't got funds or time to replace it,

QueensCurve · 21 Oct 2015

LNW-GW Joint said:
In many ways the most impressive part of the recent electrification works is that around Kensal Green, Acton and Stockley where much new trackage has been built and electrified for access to the new train depots and the Heathrow branch.

What is "trackage"?

swt_passenger · 21 Oct 2015

Ploughman said:
Campaigners want Network Rail to remove metal gantries in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty (AONB) they call an "ugly scar on the landscape".

Another campaigner has been campaigning about this (with little or no sympathy) within this thread for weeks if not months. The BBC seem to be something of a soft touch for unreasonable locals, whatever and wherever the complaint.

I'd expect the usual platitudes from NR and then they'll carry on as is.

AM9 · 21 Oct 2015

swt_passenger said:
Another campaigner has been campaigning about this (with little or no sympathy) within this thread for weeks if not months. The BBC seem to be something of a soft touch for unreasonable locals, whatever and wherever the complaint....

The BBC see it as a cheap news item which they can embellish when NR are asked to provide a non-technical response. Interestingly, apart from a few high-profile mouthpieces, the campaigners are all local and really only concerned about their view of the Goring Gap and their house prices. As far as any natural beauty goes, they don't care, they just want to set whatever is there in aspic, e.g. victorian bridges, farmed fields, a marina, houses and plantation trees.

LNW-GW Joint · 21 Oct 2015

Phil. said:
Trackage?
For heaven's sake...........

QueensCurve said:
What is "trackage"?

What's the approved UK railway term for a lot of track then?
https://www.bing.com/search?q=track...=AJV64nMRuC3D1DVwKnuKPYnerNeXvu3RT*FKteE8EWle

backontrack · 21 Oct 2015

Just 'track'. You wouldn't refer to lots of sheep as 'sheepage'.

NSEFAN · 21 Oct 2015

Ploughman said:
Campaigners want Network Rail to remove metal gantries in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty (AONB) they call an "ugly scar on the landscape".

Not gonna be removed now. The price of houses that overlook the railway in that area would be swamped by the cost of having to run all trains on diesel over that section of line. Nonetheless, I expect the people of Bath will have a similar response to those in Goring when similar structures go up on the bridge and through Sydney gardens (quietly ignoring the increase in their house prices thanks to a better train service!)

OxtedL · 21 Oct 2015

backontrack said:
Just 'track'. You wouldn't refer to lots of sheep as 'sheepage'.

But you could refer to lots of bags as baggage - your example is more than slightly bogus.

'Trackage' in the North American sense of that bing definition has a slightly wider useage of almost being the route as well as the track - for instance, an operator can have trackage rights on another operators' route/over its tracks. I'm thus kind of hesitant to say that new tracks and pointwork at a location can be described as trackage. I'm not American though, and this is a hazy issue anyway, so I am happy to be proved wrong.

swt_passenger said:
Another campaigner has been campaigning about this (with little or no sympathy) within this thread for weeks if not months. The BBC seem to be something of a soft touch for unreasonable locals, whatever and wherever the complaint.

It is a local news story rather than a national one, so you can expect it to creep outside stricter editorial standards you might try and have on national news.

swt_passenger · 21 Oct 2015

AM9 said:
The BBC see it as a cheap news item which they can embellish when NR are asked to provide a non-technical response. Interestingly, apart from a few high-profile mouthpieces, the campaigners are all local and really only concerned about their view of the Goring Gap and their house prices. As far as any natural beauty goes, they don't care, they just want to set whatever is there in aspic, e.g. victorian bridges, farmed fields, a marina, houses and plantation trees.

I saw lots of very tall white things a bit like gantries when I passed through by train. A couple of fields full of Rugby goalposts.

They'll have to go too I suppose? But perhaps they could use ice hockey goals instead?

Philip Phlopp · 21 Oct 2015

AM9 said:
The BBC see it as a cheap news item which they can embellish when NR are asked to provide a non-technical response. Interestingly, apart from a few high-profile mouthpieces, the campaigners are all local and really only concerned about their view of the Goring Gap and their house prices. As far as any natural beauty goes, they don't care, they just want to set whatever is there in aspic, e.g. victorian bridges, farmed fields, a marina, houses and plantation trees.

There will be a BBC producer or two living in the area, hence the coverage. I still remember the awful biased piece John Craven was permitted to do on the subject of HS2 because it was going to encroach on the bottom of the garden of the house he had just sold.

MidlandMainlie · 21 Oct 2015

From the BBC

Great Western rail electrification cost 'up to £2.8bn'

The cost of electrifying the Great Western railway line between Swansea and London could reach £2.8bn, the boss of Network Rail has said.
Chief executive Mark Carne told MPs the estimate had been £874m in January 2013 and £1.5bn in September 2014.

He said the "cost base was out of date" because significant electrification had not been carried out for 20 years.

Mr Carne also blamed "inadequate planning and scope definition of the project in the early stages".

WatcherZero · 21 Oct 2015

He said that the estimate was now £2.5-2.8bn in 2013 prices.

LNW-GW Joint · 21 Oct 2015

It was at the Commons Public Accounts Committee session today.
The video (2.5 hours of it) should appear here soon under "Recently Archived": http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Commons
Subject: Network Rail 2014-19 rail investment programme

fflint · 21 Oct 2015

As to trackage see OED entry:

2. ˈtrackage, n

...The tracks or lines of a railway system collectively. Also attrib.trackage charge...

The price of all these electrification projects seems to rise week on week. Today another bit of the smoke and mirrors that is the Goverment and National rail electrification policy has been stripped away. Whatever happened to those who used to complain about BR's lack of financial accumen. Since the fragmentation of the railways post privatisation the only people to do well seem to be the franchises. It would seem that the present and past management of Network Rail couldn't run a P*** up in a brewery and certainly not an electrification project. As has been mentioned before by those like Roger Ford, they seem to inhabit a different world to Civils of years gone by. Have we not any real railwaymen left or are we in the hands of graduates of business schools, without real experience, who rely on PR to make them look good (until the chickens come home to roost as today).

Who Cares · 21 Oct 2015

AM9 said:
The BBC see it as a cheap news item which they can embellish when NR are asked to provide a non-technical response. Interestingly, apart from a few high-profile mouthpieces, the campaigners are all local and really only concerned about their view of the Goring Gap and their house prices. As far as any natural beauty goes, they don't care, they just want to set whatever is there in aspic, e.g. victorian bridges, farmed fields, a marina, houses and plantation trees.

AM9

Thats about the 3rd or 4th time youve made some sarcastic and offensive comments about the residents of the Goring Gap, none of whom you know neither those involved in the Railway Action Group nor any of the 5,000 or so residents who live in the Goring Gap.

You have viewed and read the website of the Railway Action Group therefore I can only assume that you are either ( 1 ) blind or ( 2 ) deaf or ( 3 ) a card carrying, class warrior member of the Workers Revolutionary Party.

And these high-profile mouthpieces who you refer toNames please ?

aylesbury · 21 Oct 2015

Sorry we all have to put up with the modern world and electrification of the GWR is an important project to put the great back in GB.Listening to the residents of Goring on tv I felt that they seemed to want NR to run steam through the station, the woman from the tree huggers was totally barmy how can o/l gantries cause problems to flora and fauna yet she seemed to think it would destroy them.Certainly the gantries are not winners of a beauty contest but they are an EU product and will enable trains to run at 140mph in the future so this will save money when this happens.But these people will not complain at being whisked to the city at a high speed so as they earn enough money to live were they do.It is quite a pleasant part of the world but no wonderful the bridge over the river is nice but the area around the station is not I used to drive through here six days a week in the course of my work and believe me cars are more of a problem than gantries.

AM9 · 21 Oct 2015

Who Cares said:
AM9

Thats about the 3rd or 4th time youve made some sarcastic and offensive comments about the residents of the Goring Gap, none of whom you know neither those involved in the Railway Action Group nor any of the 5,000 or so residents who live in the Goring Gap.

Why would I need to know them, either personally or as a group, over and above how they have described themselves on their website. There are people living all over the UK near railways, roads where what RAG describe as "Devastating environmental damage" has happened.
I just don't agree with their arguments which seem to ignore the technical requirements of a 140mph electrified mainline. I can imagine NR's frustration with the repeated lay-comparison of the current design of a system based on experience (series 1) and the technically flawed MKIIIb cat's cradle of headspans. The reliability (and safety) of the scheme has a higher priority than the aesthetic style. Those with far more relevant engineering knowledge than me have also commented here similarly. The style and presentation of the arguments is not unlike some of those put forward by the StopHS2 group.

Who Cares said:
You have viewed and read the website of the Railway Action Group therefore I can only assume that you are either ( 1 ) blind or ( 2 ) deaf or ( 3 ) a card carrying, class warrior member of the Workers Revolutionary Party.

Those assumptions are your own of course but I don't understand why you are airing them here, - so no further comment from me.

Who Cares · 21 Oct 2015

Philip Phlopp said:
There will be a BBC producer or two living in the area, hence the coverage. I still remember the awful biased piece John Craven was permitted to do on the subject of HS2 because it was going to encroach on the bottom of the garden of the house he had just sold.

PHILIP P

Wrong in this case.Everyone knows that BBC producers live either in Islington or Maidenhead.

However, Ill tell you how the BBC became involved.

About 25 years ago, a local Housing Association acquired the Grade 2 Listed Brunel designed / built hotel and station in Moulsford and the adjoining gardens....They converted the hotel into shared ownership apartments and also built about 25 new, social housing units in the gardens.A couple of weeks ago, NR undertook three successive nights of overnight piling directly outside these homes without the required ( but frequently forgotten by NR ) notification to affected residents.One of the residents, fed up with being unable to sleep properly and unable to contact anyone in NR to receive clarification / confirmation of how much longer these overnight works would be continuing, contacted the local BBC Radio Oxford to air his complaints about the noise and disturbance on the morning news not about the Electrification Project.

Hearing the conversation on his radio, a resident of an apartment inside the old building called the BBC to add that the vibrations caused by the previous nights piling had resulted in cracks to the internal walls of his flat inside the old building.The reason ? The piling is being undertaken to put up a pylon and gantry next to the safety fence and just 12 metres from the external walls of this Grade 2 Listed Building, itself listed due to its connection with Brunel and the GWR.BBC Question, resident answer, disbelief.Another question, another answer, more disbelief. At which the resident referred the BBC to the Railway Action Group for the full, gory details of NRs disregard for the AONB, statutory requirements, absence of consultation, etc.

Maybe the BBC were having a slow news day, but at least theyve shown themselves not to be NIMBYSIDGAFs.

By the way.NR have promised to send a Vibration Specialist to assess the damage to the Listed Building before restarting the remaining piling, and the Housing Association have appointed Structural Engineers to check on their behalf that there is no invisible damage to both the old and the new buildings.

Philip Phlopp · 22 Oct 2015

Who Cares said:
By the way.NR have promised to send a Vibration Specialist to assess the damage to the Listed Building before restarting the remaining piling, and the Housing Association have appointed Structural Engineers to check on their behalf that there is no invisible damage to both the old and the new buildings.

That's nice. You would be amazed at how many people claim not to have received notification of works letters, when we know letters have been hand delivered to houses, and when we send someone round to speak to a homeowner who has concerns or a complaint, you get a 'oh yes, I saw that, thought it was junk mail from the local takeaway' type response.

We can only push letters through letter boxes, we can't physically stand over someone, holding their eyelids open whilst forcing them to read what we give them.

You know what else never ceases to amaze us - the number of people who complain about cracks appearing in plaster, of broken windows, of things falling of window ledges and mantelpieces. We're somehow able to pile OLE masts next to 150 year old railway stations and offices without doing any damage, but when we move near a small number of houses, we manage to do a better job than Safedem.

We do know, as our colleagues at HS2 have found out, there's a fairly small but not insignificant number of people who are sharing tips and tricks for extracting compensation and compensatory works from NR and HS2, when we know or suspect they're pulling a fast one.

I do accept there are a small number of houses that will genuinely be impacted by our works, but such buildings are going to be at risk of damage from other essential works, such as water or gas main replacement, carriageway resurfacing and such like. We will continue to look after those people who have suffered as a direct result of the GWEp.

The rest, of course, is your usual intolerable drivel. Headspans instead of portals indeed. Not bloody happening. Ever.

mwmbwls · 22 Oct 2015

fflint said:
Have we not any real railwaymen left or are we in the hands of graduates of business schools, without real experience, who rely on PR to make them look good (until the chickens come home to roost as today).

From this astute but never the less slightly inacurate observation we can assume you are not familiar with the genus "claudus anatis" - as in "the sky is black with lame ducks coming home to roost.

Great Western Electrification Progress

Veteran Member

RailUK Forums

Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Member

Member

Member

Veteran Member

Member

Established Member

Member