Cheshire & Warrington LEP rail aspirations

pemma · 2 Nov 2015

Crewe & Warrington- Chester-Holyhead Electrification and Journey Time
improvements by 2024 at cost of £340m

Crewe-Stoke-Derby Line Upgrade by 2027 at cost of £150m

Western Access to Manchester Airport: Western Rail Extension & Mid-Cheshire Line improvements by 2024 at cost of £500m

Liverpool to Manchester (via Warrington Central) electrification by 2024 at cost of £180m

http://moderngov.cheshireeast.gov.u...ansport for the North Update - Appendix B.pdf

Interesting that they are prioritising Warrington-Chester and Chester-Crewe for electrification when the Rail North Electrification Task Force didn't see either as priorities: http://www.railnorth.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/EFT_Final_Report_FINAL_web.pdf (P53) The CLC line between Liverpool and Warrington was a high priority in that report so the inclusion of that as a CP6 scheme makes sense.

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catfordbags · 2 Nov 2015

I would hold the electrification and crack on with western airport link ... it would completely transform that rail line.

stockport1 · 2 Nov 2015

catfordbags said:
I would hold the electrification and crack on with western airport link ... it would completely transform that rail line.

seconded. the link would not be needed if metrolink had not seconded the heavy rail route into manchester.

the rail network in cheshire is a joke.

winsford - hartford and acton have a good service to liverpool and southwards to crewe (class 350's every 30 mins or so) yet no direct link to warrington, wigan or manchester.

the mid cheshire line and middlewich link considered as some kind of rail backwater despite having fair sized towns along the route. i bemoan the loss of the chester-manchester semi fast service. today a chester-northwich-knutsford-atrincham-sale-oxford road - airport would be most welcome.

a crewe - sandbach-middlewich-gadbroke park-northwich and on to manchester service would also be great.

A proper park and ride at lostock grahlam would be nice also.

until the airport link is built the single line section a navigation road will probably be the limiting factor for any additional routes on this line.

CdBrux · 2 Nov 2015

stockport1 said:
the single line section a navigation road will probably be the limiting factor for any additional routes on this line.

Tram / trains may also be a solution for this

pemma · 2 Nov 2015

stockport1 said:
the link would not be needed if metrolink had not seconded the heavy rail route into manchester.

For the amount of money the link would cost the benefits have to extend to more than just the Cheshire towns on the line.

For instance, we might be in a situation where the Wales & Borders franchise would like to run a regular service to the Airport but they get told there is no path available. If the western link was built an alternative option could exist for extending a TPE service to North Wales after the Airport, hence not requiring an additional Piccadilly-Airport path.

For a different idea you could have a Liverpool circular service which goes to Manchester via Chat Moss or Warrington Central but returns via the Airport. Then if the service runs in both directions you can speed up Liverpool to Airport journeys without making people wanting central Manchester go via a longer route.

Xenophon PCDGS · 2 Nov 2015

jcollins said:
Western Access to Manchester Airport: Western Rail Extension & Mid-Cheshire Line improvements by 2024 at cost of £500m

How long has that particular aspiration now been on their wish-list? Was there not some other recently issued rail document which made reference to this line and which expressed doubts as to how the HS2 project route to Manchester Airport would affect such a Mid-Cheshire Line propsed extension to Manchester Airport?

pemma · 2 Nov 2015

Paul Sidorczuk said:
How long has that particular aspiration now been on their wish-list?

Cheshire County Council first came up with it in 1994. Network Rail do have it on their radar and said it would be looked at as a potential CP6 scheme.

Was there not some other recently issued rail document which made reference to this line and which expressed doubts as to how the HS2 project route to Manchester Airport would affect such a Mid-Cheshire Line propsed extension to Manchester Airport?

No the proposed HS2 route doesn't interfere with the proposed site of a western link. The Airport said in their recent long term development plans they didn't think a western link would be required because of HS2 serving the Airport and wanted to be allowed to develop on the site reserved for the link. No-one apart from the Airport shares that view and I understand the Airport were asked to send someone to a Transport Select Committee session to explain their view on future public transport development but declined.

adrock1976 · 2 Nov 2015

Regarding the Warrington BQ - Chester electrification, this should also in my view include Helsby - Ellesmere Port too, so as to eliminate diesel workings in this middle section.

Helsby - Ellesmere Port could be done to a lower specification, such as the tramwire type electrification between Wolverhampton and Oxley Depot. Alternatively, it could be done in a similar style to how either Shields Depot/Corkerhill Depot to Paisley Canal was done recently.

As there seems to be a large recent-ish residential development south of Ince & Elton station, the present Liverpool LS - Warrington BQ via Liverpool & Manchester Railway could be extended to Ellesmere Port every 2 hours as an experimental service to start off with, before increasing the frequency to every 60 minutes in the future.

pemma · 2 Nov 2015

adrock1976 said:
Regarding the Warrington BQ - Chester electrification, this should also in my view include Helsby - Ellesmere Port too, so as to eliminate diesel workings in this middle section.

Well from December 2017 there should be peak time Ellesmere Port to Leeds via Bradford services, so if Calder Vale and Warrington-Chester is wired, tagging on Ellesmere Port will make sense unless some IPEMU or bi-mode trains are available to run the service.

snowball · 2 Nov 2015

jcollins said:
No the proposed HS2 route doesn't interfere with the proposed site of a western link. The Airport said in their recent long term development plans they didn't think a western link would be required because of HS2 serving the Airport and wanted to be allowed to develop on the site reserved for the link. No-one apart from the Airport shares that view and I understand the Airport were asked to send someone to a Transport Select Committee session to explain their view on future public transport development but declined.

See this document recently linked by Greybeard in the "No Welsh trains to the airport" thread:

http://www.mcrua.org.uk/chairmansbl...RUA-response-to-MIA-Sustainable-Devt-Plan.pdf

This is the response to the consultation on Manchester Airport’s Sustainable Development Plan
from the Mid Cheshire Rail Users Association (MCRUA). MCRUA is the rail user group
supporting the Mid Cheshire Line, the Manchester-Chester via Knutsford railway. MCRUA has
been established for 25 years and has over 500 paying members, making it one of the largest rail
user groups in the north of England. This response focuses on rail services to and from the airport
via the projected Western Rail Link.

Executive Summary

1. Manchester Airport's Draft Sustainable Development Plan says that previously an
alignment for a Western Rail Link has been safeguarded through the airport site, but that this “has
been overtaken by HS2” and so the safeguarding may be withdrawn.

2. The Western Rail Link is a projected 3½ mile railway which would link the existing
Airport railway station to the Mid Cheshire Line at Mobberley, allowing trains from Manchester
Piccadilly to run through the Airport to Knutsford, Northwich, Runcorn, Chester and North Wales.

3. None of these places has a regular train service to Manchester Airport today.

4. HS2 does not serve any of these places, so we do not see how the proposed construction of
HS2 can be considered to have overtaken this need.

5. The planned HS2 route does not obstruct the route of the Western Rail Link in any way.

6. The economic value of better rail links to Manchester Airport and to Manchester city
centre is well recognised and is a central tenet of the government's Northern Powerhouse project.

7. The Western Rail Link would deliver fast rail services from Manchester Airport to
Cheshire and North Wales on a much shorter route than any alternative.

8. The Western Rail Link would also create a fast, direct rail route between Knutsford,
Northwich and other Cheshire towns to and from Manchester city centre.

9. The Manchester Airport Western Rail Link will attract passengers from the roads to rail,
addressing the airport's sustainability targets. The Link is important for the economic prosperity of
Mid Cheshire and North Wales. The route of the Manchester Airport Western Rail Link should
continue to be safeguarded and a start should be made on detailed planning for the link now.

Cheshire & Warrington LEP rail aspirations

pemma

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catfordbags

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stockport1

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CdBrux

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pemma

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Xenophon PCDGS

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pemma

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adrock1976

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pemma

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snowball

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