asylumxl
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You think you've seen chaos, just wait until these clowns have 24 trains per hour...
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Amended timetable for Govia Thameslink Railway services on Brighton mainline
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You think you've seen chaos, just wait until these clowns have 24 trains per hour...
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southern442
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Surely this madness has to be caused by something other then 'we didn't think it through very well'
RichardKing
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When all of the 442s are withdrawn, what unit(s) will be allocated into Hove Yard for overnight, or general, storage?
The problem of course is that when it goes wrong its the passenger facing staff who will take the flack, and the ire of the passengers, and whilst it may not be Southerns fault it has gone wrong, the consequences of any issue are likely to be magnified by the issues you mention.
Lets hope there's no bridge strikes, tresspassers, ill passengers etc!
swt_passenger
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There are a couple of discussions already taking place about this in the fares section at the moment. The simple answer is that the fares should not be different but at the moment they are, presumably cock up rather than conspiracy.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=124320
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2393084#post2393084
Metobusfan
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I love the fact that the 3 peak times services towards Gatwick from Elephant and castle are not stopping. All the regular passengers are not happy about that
southern442
Established Member
If this 'cock up' is anything more than just a small error, then there is a serious level of unprofessionalism in GTR's head offices.
southern442
Established Member
Today was the day where we saw if this new timetable was actually any better when it comes to coping with delays.....I'm not convinced. It has been discussed breifly on the London Bridge thread already, but it was pretty bad on the main lines for much of today.
NSEFAN
Established Member
Sorry for the thread bump, but this seemed like the best place for such a question:
Are the Gatwick Express services to Brighton all worked by 442s, or are 377s used on some services? Also, is there a date for the Gatex 387s introduction to the route to replace the 442s?
Are the Gatwick Express services to Brighton all worked by 442s, or are 377s used on some services? Also, is there a date for the Gatex 387s introduction to the route to replace the 442s?
southern442
Established Member
I believe they are all 442's. And rightly so
I think that some of the Thameslink LBG-BTN services are operated by Southern 377's though.
Since the thread has been bumped, is the Saturday evening timetable somehow representative of the long-term (post-December 2018) timetable on the line south of East Croydon.
Trains to Redhill depart East Croydon at xx16 (Horsham slow), xx18 (Horsham semi-fast), xx46 (Horsham slow) and xx48 (Arun Valley).
This timetable obviously depends on the xx18 and xx48 presenting themselves on time at Stoats Nest Junction otherwise they follow a stopping train all the way to Horsham. There is very little leeway in this.
Also, the arrival times at Redhill (and departure times of GWR services) mean that passengers for Reigate have a long wait at Redhill.
Not very good
Trains to Redhill depart East Croydon at xx16 (Horsham slow), xx18 (Horsham semi-fast), xx46 (Horsham slow) and xx48 (Arun Valley).
This timetable obviously depends on the xx18 and xx48 presenting themselves on time at Stoats Nest Junction otherwise they follow a stopping train all the way to Horsham. There is very little leeway in this.
Also, the arrival times at Redhill (and departure times of GWR services) mean that passengers for Reigate have a long wait at Redhill.
Not very good
The other week one evening I was passing through Gatwick Airport to catch a train to Guildford. I got off a service to Victoira that departs Gatwick at 56 minutes passed the hour. I forget the exact hour now.
As I got off I heard someone announce that passengers wanting a non stop service to Victoira should join one on platform x departing at 5 minutes passed the hour.
Now given the service I got off only stopped at East Croydon and Clapham Junction, wouldn't that get in sooner than the Gatwick Express service. After all it leaves Gatwick about 9 minutes earlier than the non stop service.
Both services were made up of Southern branded rolling stock and not 442s. The non stop was 4 carriages and the stopping one 8 carriages.
Contrast this with South West Trains. The other morning I got into Surbiton at 8.56 on the stopping semi-fast service. Over the tannoy, they said passengers wanting a fast service to Waterloo should join this train as it will arrive first. The non stop leaves 9.11.
Much better advice. One could argue the 8.56 is during peak so that might be worth encouraging people to board but doesn't Oyster peak end 9.30 and most would be using Oyster tickets?
As I got off I heard someone announce that passengers wanting a non stop service to Victoira should join one on platform x departing at 5 minutes passed the hour.
Now given the service I got off only stopped at East Croydon and Clapham Junction, wouldn't that get in sooner than the Gatwick Express service. After all it leaves Gatwick about 9 minutes earlier than the non stop service.
Both services were made up of Southern branded rolling stock and not 442s. The non stop was 4 carriages and the stopping one 8 carriages.
Contrast this with South West Trains. The other morning I got into Surbiton at 8.56 on the stopping semi-fast service. Over the tannoy, they said passengers wanting a fast service to Waterloo should join this train as it will arrive first. The non stop leaves 9.11.
Much better advice. One could argue the 8.56 is during peak so that might be worth encouraging people to board but doesn't Oyster peak end 9.30 and most would be using Oyster tickets?
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There are no fasts from Surbiton to Waterloo between 0836 and 0911 - an unusually long gap - so perhaps the advice was aimed at passengers who might have expected a fast sooner? Or the previous one had been cancelled?
As for Gatwick, I can think of good reasons (benefiting the passenger not the operator!) for encouraging air passengers to use the nonstop service.
As for Gatwick, I can think of good reasons (benefiting the passenger not the operator!) for encouraging air passengers to use the nonstop service.
RichardKing
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There is one Gatwick Express service (not to Brighton) that is operated by a 377 as opposed to a 442: 1D26 London Victoria - Gatwick Airport.
But the stopping service was practically empty, as was the Gatwick Express service. The stopping service is cheaper of course.
I might understand during peak rush hour.
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I must add that there is a fast 8.48 service to Waterloo, the gap isn't as long as you stated. The main difference is that their isn't a 9.08 but a 9.11 instead.
I was thinking in terms of overloading, but avoiding station overtime might be a reason - or even that passengers had paid the higher fare, perhaps? (Don't go there folks...)
Sorry, cant read a timetable any more. In that case logical if people have just missed the 48.
Well the passenger didn't need to pay the higher price unless they arrived at a point where the train only accepting a higher price ticket got into Victoria first.
Of course people wouldn't know that when buy their ticket. Perhaps it would be different if the Gatwick Express service was a 442 but it wasn't.
It's definitely logical if someone misses the 8.48 to get the next one that gets in first but equally it's logical to do that at Gatwick Airport, if all the trains are fairly empty.
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