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Scotrail Turbostars moving to Southern

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Peter Sarf

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Defiance149 said:
170423 arrived at Wolverton on 16th Jan.
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So 170423 might be expected to be in service soon as I assume its only there for the repaint and that all the clever technical stuff has already been completed at Selhurst.
 
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Chrisgr31

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I thought someone on Twitter suggested the wiring was being done in Wolverton as well.

By the way where is Wolverton?
 
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Peter Sarf

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Chrisgr31 said:
I thought someone on Twitter suggested the wiring was being done in Wolverton as well.

By the way where is Wolverton?
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It in Britain :lol:. Just north of Milton Keynes on the West Coast Mainline. Its a railway works that is also home to the Royal Train (albeit segregated).

Now you mention it I think perhaps the work Selhurst was doing to convert these 3-car units to 2 and 4-car units was not going well. So plan B was to keep them as 3-car nits instead and only change the couplers and anything also required to make them interwork with Southern's 171s. I would have thought this was easy as the Southern 171s are merely (?) 170s built with different couplers (and maybe MU connectors) that were suitable for Southern.
 
47271

47271

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Peter Sarf said:
It in Britain [emoji38]. Just north of Milton Keynes on the West Coast Mainline. Its a railway works that is also home to the Royal Train (albeit segregated).

Now you mention it I think perhaps the work Selhurst was doing to convert these 3-car units to 2 and 4-car units was not going well. So plan B was to keep them as 3-car nits instead and only change the couplers and anything also required to make them interwork with Southern's 171s. I would have thought this was easy as the Southern 171s are merely (?) 170s built with different couplers (and maybe MU connectors) that were suitable for Southern.
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolverton_railway_works

You've never heard of Wolverton? The youth of today...

That aside, this has got to be the most drawn out hopeless refurbishment of stock in British railway history. They were transferred in APRIL of last year.
 
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physics34

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Chrisgr31 said:
Well you should have noticed they had gone missing!
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ha ha, two units in a shed at selhurst the other evening 421 and another... They had their engines on and were being looked at.

That means there is another one somewhere.
 
03_179

03_179

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physics34 said:
ha ha, two units in a shed at selhurst the other evening 421 and another... They had their engines on and were being looked at.

That means there is another one somewhere.
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421 in the cleaning shed

424 on 17 road.
 
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southern442

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47271 said:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolverton_railway_works

You've never heard of Wolverton? The youth of today...

That aside, this has got to be the most drawn out hopeless refurbishment of stock in British railway history. They were transferred in APRIL of last year.
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Well since they still have to replace the couplers, they can call it a conversion and get away with it, hiding safely behind 458/5-gate.

I really want to see what the repaint looks like, as i can't seem to figure out what the old light clusters would look like in the Southern livery.
 
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Chrisgr31

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What is slightly puzzling is if the units that came to Southern needed so much work to the gearboxes, engines and for corrosion why are those that are sublet back to Scotrail running around without all these works being done?
 
Minstral25

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Chrisgr31 said:
What is slightly puzzling is if the units that came to Southern needed so much work to the gearboxes, engines and for corrosion why are those that are sublet back to Scotrail running around without all these works being done?
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Because Southern need the extra units in service to provide adequate cover from East Croydon to London Bridge on Uckfield trains and they are not going to get them from anywhere else.

Quite rightly they won't put them in service until they believe they are up to the standards the rest of the 171 fleet is.

Perhaps better short term solutions could be either use them as a dedicated Marshlink fleet (at 3 coaches better than 2 coaches) allocated to Brighton. As far as I recall there are 3 diagrams for Marshlink daily, this would leave one 3 car unit spare each day. Then 3 Class 171/7 2 car units become free for Uckfield train extensions.

Or alternatively, give up on these units & send them back to Scotland. Then get realistic by terminating some Uckfield peak services at Oxted so passengers can catch the 12-coach ex-East Grinstead trains, freeing up space for extra 12 coach trains along the Redhill route which has significantly more passengers but mysteriously robbed of many of its peak London Bridge services that passengers want to use, specifically to allow the short Uckfield trains into London Bridge.

No chip on my shoulder at NOT being unable to get a direct train from Redhill or Earlswood to London Bridge in the peak around 8am and spending lots of time standing on East Croydon waiting for a train with enough space to get on.
 
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sng7

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Minstral25 said:
Because Southern need the extra units in service to provide adequate cover from East Croydon to London Bridge on Uckfield trains and they are not going to get them from anywhere else.

Quite rightly they won't put them in service until they believe they are up to the standards the rest of the 171 fleet is.
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The point is Scotrails 170 Fleet are in pretty good condition and all the rest of them are running along quite happily all over Scotland on commuter and intercity services with normal maintenance so what makes these 4 so bad it takes a year to give them a repaint, refurbish the interior and change the couplings?
 
D365

D365

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sng7 said:
The point is Scotrails 170 Fleet are in pretty good condition...
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If that is the case, why were Chiltern and Southern nipping at each other's heels to secure the TPE 170s first?
 
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Chrisgr31

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sng7 said:
The point is Scotrails 170 Fleet are in pretty good condition and all the rest of them are running along quite happily all over Scotland on commuter and intercity services with normal maintenance so what makes these 4 so bad it takes a year to give them a repaint, refurbish the interior and change the couplings?
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Thats the puzzling thing as Southern have apparently suggested that the units they are working in were in dire condition and the article suggests they have photographic evidence of it. Not that they'll share it with us!

They are meant to be changing the format of the units as well from four 3 car units to two fours and 2 twos.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Minstral25 said:
Because Southern need the extra units in service to provide adequate cover from East Croydon to London Bridge on Uckfield trains and they are not going to get them from anywhere else.

Quite rightly they won't put them in service until they believe they are up to the standards the rest of the 171 fleet is.

Perhaps better short term solutions could be either use them as a dedicated Marshlink fleet (at 3 coaches better than 2 coaches) allocated to Brighton. As far as I recall there are 3 diagrams for Marshlink daily, this would leave one 3 car unit spare each day. Then 3 Class 171/7 2 car units become free for Uckfield train extensions.

Or alternatively, give up on these units & send them back to Scotland. Then get realistic by terminating some Uckfield peak services at Oxted so passengers can catch the 12-coach ex-East Grinstead trains, freeing up space for extra 12 coach trains along the Redhill route which has significantly more passengers but mysteriously robbed of many of its peak London Bridge services that passengers want to use, specifically to allow the short Uckfield trains into London Bridge.

No chip on my shoulder at NOT being unable to get a direct train from Redhill or Earlswood to London Bridge in the peak around 8am and spending lots of time standing on East Croydon waiting for a train with enough space to get on.
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Whats the purpose of terminating Uckfield line trains at Oxted and which one you going to terminate there? The diesels currently arrive at Oxted with standing room only and the main peak trains are 6 or 8 car. The 6.43 ex Crowborough is standing room from Eridge, the 7.17 is from Edenbridge. You really think that these people should change at Oxted? Many will also have to change at East Croydon, so you are probably adding 15 or 20 minutes to their journey times.

One of the reasons the line is so busy is the introduction of the through service, so take it away and you'll just sent the passengers back to Tunbridge Wells and Haywards Heath.
 
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scotraildriver

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The odd thing is that if a vehicle has an engine or transmission problem the whole engine raft is simply exchanged. A job wich takes about 8 hours. And they have run about in 2 and 4 car formations here when vehicles were damaged and hybrid sets made up. Again without issue. All 170 vehicles are compatible in any formation
 
cj_1985

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scotraildriver said:
The odd thing is that if a vehicle has an engine or transmission problem the whole engine raft is simply exchanged. A job wich takes about 8 hours. And they have run about in 2 and 4 car formations here when vehicles were damaged and hybrid sets made up. Again without issue. All 170 vehicles are compatible in any formation
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Nah.. much better to slag off another operators maintenance practices and stock than get on with the job at hand :roll:<(
 
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Techniquest

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Interesting, I'll need to bear that in mind to score some shacks down that way when the DaySave comes back online! Cheers :)
 
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