Changes to Auto Annie

MrPIC · 9 Mar 2016

Whilst I was at Liverpool Street and Tottenham Hale earlier tonight I noticed that the auto announcements had changed. At Liverpool Street where what I remember being said was "The next train to depart from platform X, will be the XX:XX *company* service to *destination* calling at...."
It seems to have changed to "The train at platform X is the XX:XX *company* train to *destination* calling at...."
A subtle change, which seems to save a bit of breath/time, but the way its been changed makes it sound unnatural. The changing of "service" to "train" sounds very bizarre in my opinion.
Thoughts?

RailUK Forums

HMS Ark Royal · 9 Mar 2016

MrPIC said:
Whilst I was at Liverpool Street and Tottenham Hale earlier tonight I noticed that the auto announcements had changed. At Liverpool Street where what I remember being said was "The next train to depart from platform X, will be the XX:XX *company* service to *destination* calling at...."
It seems to have changed to "The train at platform X is the XX:XX *company* train to *destination* calling at...."
A subtle change, which seems to save a bit of breath/time, but the way its been changed makes it sound unnatural. The changing of "service" to "train" sounds very bizarre in my opinion.
Thoughts?

Must be a London thing... I know we have her up here in the land of Northern, but its still the original one - not the new one you've heard.

ainsworth74 · 9 Mar 2016

Is it a change? I always thought that the first style was used before a train arrived at a platform and the second was used when the train was literally at the platform and boarding.

SPADTrap · 9 Mar 2016

ainsworth74 said:
Is it a change? I always thought that the first style was used before a train arrived at a platform and the second was used when the train was literally at the platform and boarding.

Correct but the change from service to train is new

crehld · 9 Mar 2016

SPADTrap said:
Correct but the change from service to train is new

Why is that a bad thing?

Bletchleyite · 9 Mar 2016

Just changing what we are used to?

It does vary a bit by TOC. London Midland likes to use "This train has 12 carriages", which is wonderfully archaic and makes it a right anticlimax when a 350/2 turns up; just about everyone else uses the more formal but not as olde-worlde "This train is formed of 12 coaches". Chiltern use another wording though I forget what it is.

Via Bank · 9 Mar 2016

A rare triumph for plain English, IMHO.

Now, if only they can institute a swear box for every time a staff member says "Customers are requested to…" when they mean "please."

ainsworth74 · 9 Mar 2016

SPADTrap said:
Correct but the change from service to train is new

Is it!? I really need to start paying more attention as I could have sworn she's always said train :lol:

SPADTrap · 9 Mar 2016

ainsworth74 said:
Is it!? I really need to start paying more attention as I could have sworn she's always said train

It is for my patch at least. Maybe it's just what I'm used to but it sounds a bit as if it has been dumbed down.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

crehld said:
Why is that a bad thing?

Sounds a bit dumbed down IMO.

'The train at platform 3 is the 1328 Abellio Greater Anglia train to Cambridge'

Maybe it's just me.

Via Bank · 9 Mar 2016

SPADTrap said:
Sounds a bit dumbed down IMO.

'The train at platform 3 is the 1328 Abellio Greater Anglia train to Cambridge'

Maybe it's just me.

Why is 'dumbing down' a bad thing?

The meaning remains unchanged, and when last I checked, we weren't insisting potential passengers scored an arbitrary mark on an English comprehension test before being allowed to board a train.

If it makes it slightly easier for people who have English as an additional language, or visitors, or occasional rail passengers,* or people with learning difficulties, I say bring it on.

* "Ah," you might say, "there's no way anyone can assume 'service' doesn't mean 'train' in this context!" Never underestimate people's capacity to not know things you do. I say this having once helped an American at Woking, who'd never been on a train before in his life, and had no idea that (a) there was no concept of 'checking in,' (b) 'calling at' meant 'stopping to allow passengers to get in or out at,' and (c) you had to buy a ticket, which you then put through the barriers, rather than trying to put your credit card through the slot.

Ibex · 9 Mar 2016

Neil Williams said:
Just changing what we are used to?

It does vary a bit by TOC. London Midland likes to use "This train has 12 carriages", which is wonderfully archaic and makes it a right anticlimax when a 350/2 turns up; just about everyone else uses the more formal but not as olde-worlde "This train is formed of 12 coaches". Chiltern use another wording though I forget what it is.

Northern are now using "This train has x carriages" too using the same sound files as London Midland.

Chiltern's screens display "This service consists of 4 carriages" but the announcement is "This train is formed of 4 carriages".

SPADTrap · 9 Mar 2016

Mods please delete.

Via Bank · 9 Mar 2016

SPADTrap said:
I don't recall saying that?

You're right, fixed. Apologies.

najaB · 9 Mar 2016

SPADTrap said:
Sounds a bit dumbed down IMO.

'The train at platform 3 is the 1328 Abellio Greater Anglia train to Cambridge'

Maybe it's just me.

It isn't dumbed down, it's just poor English. They've already said it is a train, so why repeat it? 'Service' is better grammar.

Not that it *really* matters though.

TheEdge · 9 Mar 2016

I noticed this new plain speak format at Ipswich today. Must be making its way around Anglia.

Parallel · 9 Mar 2016

ainsworth74 said:
Is it a change? I always thought that the first style was used before a train arrived at a platform and the second was used when the train was literally at the platform and boarding.

Both are certainly still used with GWR. If a train is waiting to leave at its origin station she will say "The next train to depart platform x is the xx.xx service to xxxx..." And if it just has dwell time at a station en route to its destination she will say "The train at platform x is the xx.xx to..."

grumblingalong · 9 Mar 2016

Overall it's ok, but "the train at platform X is the xx:xx train to" just sounds clunky and horrid. I do like new "PLEASE STAND CLEAR - the next train at platform X does not stop here" much better message.

Bletchleyite · 9 Mar 2016

grumblingalong said:
Overall it's ok, but "the train at platform X is the xx:xx train to" just sounds clunky and horrid. I do like new "PLEASE STAND CLEAR - the next train at platform X does not stop here" much better message.

The best way I've seen to do that is on the older systems that have a very urgent-sounding four-tone "toot-toot-toot-toooooot" prior to that message and that message only.

Annie just sounds bored, and that doesn't get the urgency of that particular safety message (as distinct from the rest of the unnecessary waffle) across.

D1009 · 9 Mar 2016

On GWR they are now using "train" rather than "service" so they can discriminate between trains and buses. Both Rail Replacement and scheduled bus services are auto announced at various stations.

greaterwest · 9 Mar 2016

Neil Williams said:
The best way I've seen to do that is on the older systems that have a very urgent-sounding four-tone "toot-toot-toot-toooooot" prior to that message and that message only.

Annie just sounds bored, and that doesn't get the urgency of that particular safety message (as distinct from the rest of the unnecessary waffle) across.

The pre-existing Southern systems (NOT the ones found at London Victoria, East Croydon, Gatwick or Brighton) still use this sound, and SWT has a different electronic beep type sound (instead of the 3 / 4 bells) for its "stand clear" messages.

najaB · 9 Mar 2016

D1009 said:
On GWR they are now using "train" rather than "service" so they can discriminate between trains and buses. Both Rail Replacement and scheduled bus services are auto announced at various stations.

If the rail replacement bus is at the platform something has gone wrong!

F Great Eastern · 9 Mar 2016

Hopefully whilst they're at it they can do something about terminating trains being announced as trains that "do not stop here" at Ipswich.

"To ensure the safe and punctual dispatch of your train, please close all doors and windows behind you. Thank you."particularly ironic when a train without windows such as a 360 turns up.

Maybe we can even have back the legendary: "A selection of hot and cold snacks, and light refreshments are available from the buffet.

TheEdge · 9 Mar 2016

F Great Eastern said:
Hopefully whilst they're at it they can do something about terminating trains being announced as trains that "do not stop here" at Ipswich.

The signalling set up at Ipswich does seem to confuse Annie and Doris fairly regularly. My two personal favourites;

1. "The next train does not stop here, please stand well clear of the platform edge" - A freight services comes trundling through very slowly, stops, waits for a few minutes then slowly trundles into the yard.

2. "The next train does not stop here, please stand well clear of the platform edge", at the same time the PIS screens change to display the same - a few minutes pass, no train materialises, PIS screens go back to normal. What has actually happened is a light FL66 shunting the yard has shunted out onto the running lines, just entered the far Norwich end of the platform to clear the signals, changed ends and run off again.

All of this means is they get ignored so when something does come through at relative speed people are near the edge. Something to be said for too much information given out by the railways at times (can of worms opened! :lol:

)

Bob Ames · 9 Mar 2016

TheEdge said:
1. "The next train does not stop here, please stand well clear of the platform edge" - A freight services comes trundling through very slowly, stops, waits for a few minutes then slowly trundles into the yard.

Heh. At Wigan, on the other hand: "The next train does not stop here, please sta" [unable to hear rest of announcement due to freight set crashing through the station at 75 mph].

Neil Williams said:
Annie just sounds bored

Totally agreed. What's needed is an upbeat/cheerful and less snooty voice.

SPADTrap · 9 Mar 2016

Parallel said:
Both are certainly still used with GWR. If a train is waiting to leave at its origin station she will say "The next train to depart platform x is the xx.xx service to xxxx..." And if it just has dwell time at a station en route to its destination she will say "The train at platform x is the xx.xx to..."

The change is in the word service.

FartinLewis · 9 Mar 2016

Yes, it sounds very unusual to my seasoned ears - noticed it at Colchester this morning and then again at Liverpool Street on my way home

fat_boy_pete · 9 Mar 2016

The double use of the word 'Train' in close succession in the sentence is the problem, the second occurrence would be better left as 'service' which would scan nicely.

me123 · 9 Mar 2016

TheEdge said:
1. "The next train does not stop here, please stand well clear of the platform edge" - A freight services comes trundling through very slowly, stops, waits for a few minutes then slowly trundles into the yard.

It used to (and probably still does) happen regularly at Partick in Glasgow.

Scotrail have an excellent message for non-stopping trains:

"Stand well away from the edge of Platform 1. Fast train approaching".

Succinct and clear. But at Partick, this was almost always followed by a 320 entering the platform at walking speed and stopping at the red signal.

Bletchleyite · 9 Mar 2016

fat_boy_pete said:
The double use of the word 'Train' in close succession in the sentence is the problem, the second occurrence would be better left as 'service' which would scan nicely.

Not only that, but when it says something like "Virgin Trains train" it will sound ridiculous.

If they think "service" is somehow bad they could try "departure".

SPADTrap · 9 Mar 2016

Neil Williams said:
Not only that, but when it says something like "Virgin Trains train" it will sound ridiculous.

If they think "service" is somehow bad they could try "departure".

How can they see the word service a bad though? Wonder what went into it to result in the change.

Changes to Auto Annie

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