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First Class Yellow Band

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Haig paxton

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I have noticed the gradual phasing out of the yellow band to denote First Class on trains, the new TPE livery being the latest. Do operators not realise how useful this is? Virgin are inconsistent with a yellow band on Voyagers but a useless 1 sticker on the Pendolino. It is time for all operators to get together and decide on a uniform approach.
 
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47802

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I agree the yellow band should be mandatory for 1st Class, along with a minimum level of comfort above standard class seating to prevent cowboy 1st class seating (GTR):lol:
 

MrB

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Southeastern are refurbishing their 375s at the moment and the yellow band is being replaced with a yellow box around the windows covering the whole first class area. Won't get much clearer than that!
 

crehld

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I have noticed the gradual phasing out of the yellow band to denote First Class on trains, the new TPE livery being the latest. Do operators not realise how useful this is? Virgin are inconsistent with a yellow band on Voyagers but a useless 1 sticker on the Pendolino. It is time for all operators to get together and decide on a uniform approach.

I'm uncertain how useful the yellow stripe is to most people - most people (that is normal people who don't spend their lives obsessed about such matters) seem generally unaware about what a yellow line denotes. Your average passenger just looks for a big "1" on the door or side of the carriage.
 

phoenixcronin

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How about a yellow stripe but with "FIRST CLASS" written in bold black letters within the stripe.

Shouldn't detract too much from the liveries as the writing will only be within the stripe.
 

AM9

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The same could be said for the red buffet stripe. Again, internationally recognised but disappearing.

That's more because there aren't many static buffets left. Maybe they could have red illuminated panels on each car to denote where the trolley currently is. :)
 

swt_passenger

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If all the Ray Stenning (Best Impressions) liveries reverted to yellow stripes from their various dots, that would put SWT, EMT and LM on a more traditional footing, and remove a large proportion of the problem...
 

All Line Rover

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I never noticed that VT Voyagers have a yellow band despite using them multiple times a week (usually in 1ST) for many years.
 

dk1

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The same could be said for the red buffet stripe. Again, internationally recognised but disappearing.

Whereas Abellio Greater Anglia have brought back both the yellow & red lines bigger & bolder than ever. BR lives on.
 

Islineclear3_1

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The yellow stripe wasn't always that obvious in the days of Network SouthEast, especially on the slammers at cantrail level. It used to be quite thin but then at least a bold "1" was stickered onto the doors and windows etc.

Surely the markings have to, by law, be DDA compliant (or whatever the correct term is) for the partially sighted etc?
 

NSEFAN

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I thought that was only the doors themselves which had to be an obviously-different colour from the rest of the train body?
 

SpacePhoenix

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Some units such as Voyagers for example also have the electrical cover of the coupler block painted yellow for the end of the unit where 1st class is as well
 

Master29

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I thought that was only the doors themselves which had to be an obviously-different colour from the rest of the train body?

On a slightly different note Grand Central have gold doors on their 1st class while silver for the rest. Sounds reasonable.
 

Deepgreen

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Just one of a plethora of useful and long-established standards which privatisation has destroyed. Some TOCs' feeble efforts at first class denotation do make me suspect that they are deliberately trying to trap people into penalty fare situations! SWT is poor, Thameslink has been pathetic for years now and the new GWR livery (which I really like) has a near-useless pencil-thin silver stripe for first class. Only very recently has Southern apparently bowed to pressure and adorned its 5 car 377s with yellow stripes (albeit inconsistently), having run them for years with virtually nothing to identify the location of first from the outside.

Southeastern's new livery is the clearest by far, and I would like to see the universal adoption of very clear external marking, as it not only helps those of us who use first class, but also helps those who don't to avoid it. Of course, some of the more bizarre liveries these days do not lend themselves to proper identification but that's easily changed.

The other factor of course is that so many people seem not to care where they sit - either deliberately chancing it (and almost always getting away with it) or simply being so unaware of their surroundings that they haven't a clue (or care) that they are in first. This morning, my Southern 377/6 unit from Redhill gradually filled with people in first, but when the conductor strolled through (without checking tickets or saying anything) about half of them moved to standard!
 
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hulabaloo

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Southeastern are refurbishing their 375s at the moment and the yellow band is being replaced with a yellow box around the windows covering the whole first class area. Won't get much clearer than that!

It would have to be clear as you wouldn't know by sitting in it!
 

Deepgreen

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And unfortunately doesn't help if you've boarded by another door and are walking down inside looking for a seat.

I know this is a bit 'out there', but how about, say, providing different (better?) seating and accommodation for first class areas, or am I just living in cloud-cuckoo land? Sarcasm quota used up for today!
 
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Some units such as Voyagers for example also have the electrical cover of the coupler block painted yellow for the end of the unit where 1st class is as well

A guard pointed that out to me several years ago when I was awaiting a XC service from Alnmouth and trying to work out which end of the platform I should stand as I was booked into 1st. It's a useful technique for working out the location of 1st/standard before you can see the side of the train and before it arrives at the platform.
 

AM9

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Maybe there will be a legal challenge to a penalty for or prosecution of a passenger inadvertantly travelling in an inadequately or ambiguously marked 1st class area without a ticket.
I doubt that a TOC would really want to take that through the full process though. The DfT should insist that operators mark their rolling stock to a standard - a bit boring for spotters, but really quite necessary for passengers and TOCs to operate a two class fare system.
 

Haig paxton

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The Scotrail 158s being particularly dreadful in First Class with only a usless glass partition seperating it from the main saloon. Although even the saltire liveried trains retain the yellow band. VTEC is a good example of how not to do it and i'm surprised at Ray Stenning for ommitting the yellow band- but hey, Ray is God-like and EVERYTHING he produces must be right. A yellow band would actually enhance the drab GWR green too. However it's not just about presentation, a standard is required and ATOC should take note.
 

Deepgreen

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The Scotrail 158s being particularly dreadful in First Class with only a usless glass partition seperating it from the main saloon. Although even the saltire liveried trains retain the yellow band. VTEC is a good example of how not to do it and i'm surprised at Ray Stenning for ommitting the yellow band- but hey, Ray is God-like and EVERYTHING he produces must be right. A yellow band would actually enhance the drab GWR green too. However it's not just about presentation, a standard is required and ATOC should take note.

ATOC has proved itself to be utterly pointless throughout its existence - it is just a collection of the culprits, after all!
 

Starmill

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The old TPE livery didn't have the yellow band either, so I'm unsurprised they haven't added it. It is disappointing they can't demarcate First Class in this or even really any visual way beyond some '1' stickers.
 

AM9

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The old TPE livery didn't have the yellow band either, so I'm unsurprised they haven't added it. It is disappointing they can't demarcate First Class in this or even really any visual way beyond some '1' stickers.

They don't have any problems demarcating 1st class when they ask for passengers tickets!
 
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