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TPE franchise awarded to First

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IanXC

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The December 2017 TSRs includes the following:

One service shall be provided each week between the following locations in at least one direction:
Manchester Victoria and Stalybridge via Phillips Park Junction and Guide Bridge.
Leeds and Selby via Milford Junction.

Is there currently a Victoria service running via Phillips Park? I though it was closed for passenger services.

While I can see that this route will be useful while the Stalybridge line is electrified, no other routes used for knowledge retention reasons are specified, it seems a little odd that these two are mandatory.

Interestingly both the services scheduled to use the above diversionary routes were removed from the timetable in the latter days of the previous franchise!
 
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lejog

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Ahh thanks, that explains my unsuccessful RTT searches.

It also seems that the DfT is forcing the new franchise to bring them back, at least from 2017. They don't appear in the current TSRs for the new franchise.
 

gimmea50anyday

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It's not an in service diversion. TPE guards do not sign it. Only drivers use it as an alternative route into and out of Ardwick Depot
 

Greybeard33

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I searched the forum for this before posting and all I was able to find was this quote without an RTT link.

However I couldn't find any Sunday TPE services from Victoria to Guide Bridge (or vice versa) on RTT, hence my question - are there any current TPE passengers services using the Phillips Park line?

Interestingly both the services scheduled to use the above diversionary routes were removed from the timetable in the latter days of the previous franchise!

Ahh thanks, that explains my unsuccessful RTT searches.

It also seems that the DfT is forcing the new franchise to bring them back, at least from 2017. They don't appear in the current TSRs for the new franchise.
Well, lots of Sunday engineering work affecting TPE services this year, so it is not surprising that those diversions have been temporarily dropped.

Until 22 May, there are no TP Sunday services east from Victoria.

From 29 May until 19 June, the Sunday Liverpool - Newcastle services are disrupted by the Ordsall Chord works.

From 19 June until 26 August, all Sunday TP North services are routed via the Calder Valley line, with the Airport and Piccadilly services reversing at Salford Crescent. So they could not possibly use the Phillips Park route.

Were the diversions even a formal requirement in the old franchise agreement, on which the current TSR1 was based?
 

Mark_1987

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It's not an in service diversion. TPE guards do not sign it. Only drivers use it as an alternative route into and out of Ardwick Depot

Ahem incorrect my dear colleague.

Liverpool conductors sign Phillips Park. And if anyone wants to know the service that used to go over it ( with passengers on ! ) was the 10:03 Lime Street - Newcastle on a Sunday. Of course, that doesn't happen currently.
 
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gimmea50anyday

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9Got me surprised!

Then again how certain depots sign certain depots yet others don't surprises me, if Liverpool do, then why don't Manchester or airport crews? Unless you know something I don't....

I sign Calder valley yet it's not on my depot route card.
 
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Mark_1987

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9Got me surprised!

Then again how certain depots sign certain depots yet others don't surprises me, if Liverpool do, then why don't Manchester or airport crews? Unless you know something I don't....

I sign Calder valley yet it's not on my depot route card.

Other than the fact that it is on a Liverpool conductor diagram ( or was should I say ) , I'm not sure.

Also , it seems to be a requirement to have one run over it once a week, easier to have a small depot sign it.
 

Greybeard33

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Ahem incorrect my dear colleague.

Liverpool conductors sign Phillips Park. And if anyone wants to know the service that used to go over it ( with passengers on ! ) was the 10:03 Lime Street - Newcastle on a Sunday. Of course, that doesn't happen currently.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2091013#post2091013 concluded the previous discussion back in Feb 2015 that I remembered (but the RTT link is now broken because it is too old).
 

gimmea50anyday

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Other than the fact that it is on a Liverpool conductor diagram it seems to be a requirement to have one run over it once a week, easier to have a small depot sign it.


Just as Newcastle staff have diagrams across high level bridge and down dinsdale towards Middlesbrough (York sign dinsdale as well tho)

I have always argued Newcastle crews should sign stillington and the Durham Coast, both have proved their worth but can't be used even tho technically the traction does sign it.

Btw you Liverpool based? Guessing you are but not a scouser, you probs figured out who I am no doubt....
 

pdq

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I posted a week or so back (I think it was in this thread, and this one is relevant) about the extended canopy under construction at Dewsbury. Turns out it's for bikes!

It holds 60 bikes, no less. Overkill? Regulars certainly think so. Much derision of the facility this morning with the general view that half the area, at least, should have been used for seating.
 
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61653 HTAFC

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It holds 60 bikes, no less. Overkill? Regulars certainly think so. Much derision of the facility this morning with the general view that half the area, at least, should have been used for seating.

That does seem like overkill, especially considering the topography of Dewsbury and the almost complete lack of any cycling infrastructure once you leave the station!
 

Starmill

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It holds 60 bikes, no less. Overkill? Regulars certainly think so. Much derision of the facility this morning with the general view that half the area, at least, should have been used for seating.

That does seem like overkill, especially considering the topography of Dewsbury and the almost complete lack of any cycling infrastructure once you leave the station!

There are stations with hundreds of bicycle spaces, and in Greater Manchester there are bicycle hubs at stations and Metrolink stops. West Yorkshire is merely playing catch up.
 

BurtonM

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From what I've seen nobody cares about GM's cycle hubs, people for the most part take their bikes on the train.
I've never seen a bike in the metal shed at Ashton-under-Lyne, that thing must house at least 30. It's not wasting space, but it's in such a place a lot of people might not know of its existence. Stalybridge meanwhile has a couple of bike racks on P4, and you're pretty much guaranteed a space to lock up.

Bike parking at Met stops sounds odd to me, all that comes to mind is the TfGM subscrition hub in a basement off Piccadilly Gardens' bus station, and a few lock rails here and there.
 
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WatcherZero

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This is the list of current Cycle Hubs;

Altrincham Interchange
Ashton-under-Lyne Interchange
Ashton-under-Lyne Train Station
Bolton
Bury
City Tower, Manchester
Eccles
Hazel Grove
Leigh
MediaCityUK
Oxford Road
Rochdale railway station and Metrolink stop
Sale
Salford Central

Opening this year;
Cheadle Hulme
East Didsbury
Guide Bridge
Hollinwood
Irlam
Stockport
Rochdale town centre (River Street)


And this is the list of cycle lockers

Metrolink Stops;
Ashton Moss
Ashton West
Ashton under Lyne
Audenshaw
Baguley
Benchill
Besses o’ th’ Barn
Brooklands
Burton Road
Bury
Cemetery Road
Clayton Hall
Crossacres
Crumpsall
Dane Road
Derker
Didsbury Village
East Didsbury
Edge Lane
Failsworth
Freehold
Heaton Park
Hollinwood
Martinscroft
Milnrow
Monsall
Moor Road
Navigation Road
Newbold
Newhey
Northern Moor
Oldham Mumps
Old Trafford
Peel Hall
Prestwich
Radcliffe
Robinswood Road
Roundthorn
Sale - New Cycle Hub work in progress
Sale Water Park
Shadowmoss
Shaw and Crompton
South Chadderton
Stretford
St Werburgh's Road
Timperley
Velopark
West Didsbury
Whitefield
Withington
Wythenshawe Park
Wythenshawe Town Centre

Rail stations;
Appley Bridge
Atherton
Bolton
Bredbury
Bromley Cross
Cheadle Hulme
Gathurst
Hazel Grove
Heald Green
Heaton Chapel
Hindley
Horwich Parkway
Lostock
Marple
Reddish North
Romiley
Rose Hill Marple
Stockport
Wigan Wallgate

Bus stations;
Bolton
Bury
Leigh
Stockport
 
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61653 HTAFC

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Lockers at Met stops will be more likely to be used, as taking the bike on the tram is not an option.

I'm all in favour of better cycling infrastructure, but as an occasional cyclist lacking in confidence, storage at stations is way down my list of priorities. Better cycle lanes along with a significant improvement in the behaviour of motorised vehicle users is far more important, though outside the jurisdiction of the railway of course. I just feel that the enormous bike shed at Dewsbury is a classic case of putting the cart before the horse.
 

pdq

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It's also in a curious location. Virtually everyone who would leave a bike there will be either arriving at or departing from the opposite platform, and the shed is about as far from the overbridge as it could be.
 
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Mordac

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Didn't check get the number but one 350 had new door open buttons fitted to their gangway doors. Is this the start of their refurbishment? :lol:

Joking aside, I must say the old buttons were getting very worn out and were quite hard to press sometimes, so kudos.
 

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Bletchleyite

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Didn't check get the number but one 350 had new door open buttons fitted to their gangway doors. Is this the start of their refurbishment? :lol:

Joking aside, I must say the old buttons were getting very worn out and were quite hard to press sometimes, so kudos.

Yes, hopefully LM will also do this - the buttons are as built really awkward and hard to press, and probably don't comply with accessibility regulation as such.
 

notlob.divad

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Curious, it says up to 18 Class 68 Locos. But only 13 until the end of the franchise. Does that mean we could have 9 rakes of top and tailed carriages being used before the extra Driving units are delivered?
 

Mordac

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Some interesting details about the Mk. 5s on page 205, including:

a) capable of operating at 125mph when hauled/propelled by locomotives permitted to operate at such speeds;
(b) configured with sliding plug passenger doors located in vehicle end vestibules;
(c)a minimum of 60% of standard class seats to be configured in bay seating layout with four seats facing a central table;
[...]
(j)commissioned and operational electronic seat reservation system capable of
enabling customers to make a seat reservation any time prior to 10 minutes
before their train departs;
 
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WatcherZero

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Platform lengthening obligations of the franchise.

Cottingley both platforms to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m
Ravensthorpe both platforms to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m
Mirfield Platform 1 and 2 to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m
Slaithwaite both platforms to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m
Marsden Platform 1 and 3 to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m
South Milford both platforms to be extended from 4x23m to 6x23m

Route strategy assessments that will be carried out during the franchise by Network Rail and Rail North

(i) Manchester to the East Midlands, Sheffield and Cleethorpes (to be completed by 31 March 2017),
(ii) Scarborough to York and Hull and East Yorkshire (to be completed by 30 September 2017),
(iii) North East (Tees, Tyne and Wear) (to be completed by 31 March 2018),
(iv) connectivity to Manchester Airport and other regional airports (to be completed by 30 September 2018)
(v) Liverpool to Manchester (including consideration of the implementation of a very high frequency passenger service) (to be completed by 30 June 2019).

Class 68 have to be replaced by class 88 when available.

The following optional extra EMU follow on orders must be available to be placed
Option A: seven x 5 car units (for all seven units)
Option B: seven x 6 car units (for all seven units)
Option C: seven x 8 car units (for all seven units)
Option D: up to 15 additional 5 car units such option only to be exercisable if Option A is also exercised
Option E: up to 15 additional 6 car units such option only to be exercisable if Option B is also exercised
Option F: up to 15 additional 8 car units such option only to be exercisable if Option C is also exercised
 
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BurtonM

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Sounds great, but as a once regular user of CrossCountry there's one thing I object to and that's ten minute reservations.
 

Senex

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Sounds great, but as a once regular user of CrossCountry there's one thing I object to and that's ten minute reservations.
I agree with you given the way things are at the moment. There needs to be some way of ensuring that the passenger who boards a train and finds a free seat (for the section of route covering his journey) can "reserve" that seat and thus ensure that he does not have to movce two or three times in the course of his journey. If that can be achieved, then the ten-minute booking + reservation business is not so bad at all.
 

class26

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I agree with you given the way things are at the moment. There needs to be some way of ensuring that the passenger who boards a train and finds a free seat (for the section of route covering his journey) can "reserve" that seat and thus ensure that he does not have to movce two or three times in the course of his journey. If that can be achieved, then the ten-minute booking + reservation business is not so bad at all.

There ought to be a way that when a seat is occupied it cannot be reserved. It shouldn`t be difficult. If I put my wallet on the passenger seat of my car it thinks someone is sitting there and the seat belt alarm goes off !
 

YorkshireBear

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Good to see platform extensions being thought of. Some could be interesting.

I think the big thing i am waiting for with TPE is to see what Transpennine Upgrade is actually going to consist of. What remodelling, extra tracks, electrification, new platforms etc.
 
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