London (any) to Manchester (any)

Hi guys, i'm looking through some maps, and some fares, and some other stuff and i'm a little puzzled. I thought i was getting better at this but perhaps not.

Essentially, I need to go from London to Manchester on this coming Wednesday, mid morning time. And i need to go home Wednesday night which is Worksop. I then need to go back to London on Sunday.

I seem to have worked out that a London to Manchester is valid via Sheffield, and indeed it comes up with fares from St Pancras to Manchester via Sheffield, saying these are "valid only via Chesterfield" for about £1.50 less than the Any permitted which seems to take me from Euston (the usual route).

Now, the question is when i put in "via Sheffield" it doesn't give me the option of an any permitted ticket, just the via chesterfield one. So this has puzzled me. I want to go from Euston on the way there as it is quicker, but on the return that starts Wednesday night i want to go to Sheffield and break my journey there for a few days (and buy the appropriate single to worksop) and go back via Sheffield (again with appropriate single from worksop) on Sunday.

I have worked this out to be ok but i have been thrown by it not letting me buy and any permitted when i put in via Sheffield so i thought i had better check.

Long winded post i guess.

Rob

Which website are you using? Via Sheffield is a permitted route and Transpennine Express will correctly sell you the Any Permitted fare for travel via Sheffield.

So it does, excellent. At least i'm not going mad. Let us hope that if i catch an EMT train from Manchester to Sheffield that the person doesn't mark my ticket and tell me it has to be completed that day as has happened before to many of us. Hopefully the new fairly clear section 16.3 ought to stop them even considering that.

Rob

robbeech said:

Let us hope that if i catch an EMT train from Manchester to Sheffield that the person doesn't mark my ticket and tell me it has to be completed that day as has happened before to many of us.

Click to expand...

If they do tell you that, their 'advice' can be disregarded and a letter can be written to the company.

You could try educating them, and if they respond positively then the need for such a letter may be avoided, but there is no point getting into an argument.

There's actually a good chance your ticket will be inspected by a knowledgeable and friendly forum member on that route! We know a few...

robbeech said:

Hopefully the new fairly clear section 16.3 ought to stop them even considering that.

Click to expand...

The new conditions will have no effect as the small minority of staff who make up their own rules are likely to continue to do so. The new conditions are even longer than the old ones, so I do not think that the individuals concerned are going to be any more likely to read them.

It turns out, (quite comically) that, and I quote "that's obviously not a valid ticket you can't go to Sheffield that completely the wrong way you can go straight to London from here so you obviously can't go to Sheffield" "that's just not how it works is it"

Needless to say I politely asked if I was allowed to get on the train anyway and was told that I could but I would end up in court.

So I got on and upon ticket inspection the nice TPE lady looked at my ticket and said, oh are you going via Sheffield? I said yes but not leaving Sheffield until Sunday. And she said Thankyou and moved on.

I really enjoyed being spoke to like crap by the member of Virgin Trains gateline staff. Made my day actually. Maybe because I wasn't getting a virgin service?

Rob

Write to Virgin and if they don't give you a decent response, escalate the matter further.

Am I surprised? Nope. (But I should be...)

robbeech said:

It turns out, (quite comically) that, and I quote "that's obviously not a valid ticket you can't go to Sheffield that completely the wrong way you can go straight to London from here so you obviously can't go to Sheffield" "that's just not how it works is it"

Needless to say I politely asked if I was allowed to get on the train anyway and was told that I could but I would end up in court.

So I got on and upon ticket inspection the nice TPE lady looked at my ticket and said, oh are you going via Sheffield? I said yes but not leaving Sheffield until Sunday. And she said Thankyou and moved on.

I really enjoyed being spoke to like crap by the member of Virgin Trains gateline staff. Made my day actually. Maybe because I wasn't getting a virgin service?

Rob

Click to expand...

Which station was the disagreement at? It reads as though this happened at Manchester Picc?

Yes, but they typically only check tickets of those arriving from the concourse.

Passengers from the footbridge are much less likely to encounter problems and can join the train in peace.

It's disappointing TPE allow Virgin's inadequately trained staff to check their passengers tickets, if this is what goes on, so its worth writing to TPE too.

I thought the platforms barriered by VT were just the three used by them only, not those used by TPE?

This was at Piccadilly, at the gateline from the concourse. The TPE Train left P5. It was initially my fault for the confrontation. I put my outbound ticket (London terminals to Manchester stations) through the machine and it didn't work. I wasn't thinking, usually the return part of my ticket is the London to **** bit and in a scrabble to get the right ticket out I used this wrong one. I realised as it was going through and got the other one out which was accepted but this got her attention so she asked to see. She 'kindly' told me I wanted the train on p6 or 7 I can't remember and I explained that I was going via Sheffield. This is what caused her to become really quite patronising and somewhat unpleasant. I shall write to VT to explain to them that they have some staff with gaps in their knowledge and should look into dealing with it.

As with a lot of things, I don't have a huge issue with her not knowing the validity of every single ticket, although Manchester to London is not going to be a particularly rare one. My main issue was the was she spoke down to me as if I was an idiot for thinking I could go that way, where the fact of the matter is it is a completely valid route and the TPE lady on the train accepted it without any problem.

robbeech said:

I really enjoyed being spoke to like crap by the member of Virgin Trains gateline staff. Made my day actually. Maybe because I wasn't getting a virgin service?

Click to expand...

I can see why Virgin hate that - they get almost all of the revenue without having to carry you a single metre. Oh hang on now

Agree with yorkie - worth complaining about even if it didn't affect you. Who knows how many other passengers ended up overcharged due to his poor advice?

Even if she was correct that it wasn't valid (she wasn't, but I recall Manchester-London via Chesterfield fares have been higher in the past, and when that was the case it wasn't valid) the threats of prosecution need challenging - all that would be due is an excess fare.

Neil Williams said:

I thought the platforms barriered by VT were just the three used by them only, not those used by TPE?

Click to expand...

The automatic barriers cover platforms 4 to 7 I believe. Given the layout at Piccadilly, it would be very costly to only barrier three platforms, unless they happen to be 1-3.

There is a fare London to Manchester only valid via Chesterfield but this is actually £2 less now, perhaps it used to be more expensive than the other. If i had been travelling via Sheffield (and as such Chesterfield) both ways i might have bought this ticket although the saving isn't really worth it. I'm just hoping that with my ticket with 28/09 written on it i won't have any issues when i get on a train from Sheffield to London on Saturday or Sunday when i complete the journey.

Rob

hairyhandedfool said:

The automatic barriers cover platforms 4 to 7 I believe. Given the layout at Piccadilly, it would be very costly to only barrier three platforms, unless they happen to be 1-3.

Click to expand...

Given the number of Network Rail staff in Square One who walk down P1 to get to the concourse shops at lunchtime, barriering that end would be an absolute nightmare for them anyway!

Well, it's going to happen soon enough - TPE franchise requires it I think.
Doesn't affect Sq1 though as there's a door to the concourse that'll be on the right side of the gateline.