Titled trains 2017 UK

Condor7 · 21 Jan 2017

I would appreciate assistance with the following list of titled trains as shown in the current National timetable as to omissions or errors. I am aware of the list on Wikipedia but that includes trains no longer running and also is not now up to date. As far as I can see there is no up to date lists available but again you may prove me wrong.

In most cases trains run once each way with one or two exceptions, Most notably
The Flying Scotsman.

The one anomaly seems to be The Cambridge Express. Usually titles are given to one off trains each day (there and back) that provide something different, usually fewer stops and a faster speed, although they could also provide extra 'luxuries'.

The Cambridge Express covers several identical trains each day, and to me is more of a branding such as The Gatwick Express than a titled train.

THE EAST ANGLIAN. Liverpool St. - Norwich. LE
THE FENMAN. Liverpool St. – Kings Lynn. LE
THE HIGHLAND CHIEFTAIN Kings Cross – Inverness. GR
NORTHERN LIGHTS. Kings Cross – Aberdeen. GR
WEST RIDING LTD. Bradford FS – Kings Cross. GR
HULL EXECUTIVE. Hull – Kings Cross. GR
THE FLYING SCOTSMAN. Edinburgh – Kings Cross. GR
THE MASTER CUTLER. St. Pancras – Sheffield. EM
THE ROBIN HOOD. St. Pancras – Nottingham. EM
THE SOUTH YORKSHIREMAN. St. Pancras – Sheffield EM
THE SHEFFIELD CONTINENTAL. Sheffield – St.Pancras EM
THE CATHEDRALS EXPRESS. Paddington – Hereford. GW
THE DEVON EXPRESS. Paddington – Paignton. GW
THE St. DAVID. Paddington – Swansea. GW
THE MERCHANT VENTURER. Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE TORBAY EXPRESS. Paddington – Paignton. GW
THE CORNISH RIVIERA Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE MAYFLOWER. Paddington – Plymouth GW
THE CHELTENHAM SPA EXPRESS. Paddington – Cheltenham Spa. GW
THE ROYAL DUCHY Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE CORNISHMAN. Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE CAPITALS UNITED Paddington – Swansea. GW
THE RED DRAGON. Paddington – Carmarthen. GW
THE BRISTOLIAN Paddington – Bristol Temple Meads. GW
THE GOLDEN HIND. Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE ARMADA. Paddington – Penzance/Plymouth. GW
THE PEMBROKE COAST EXPRESS. Paddington – Pembroke Dock. GW
THE ATLANTIC COAST EXPRESS. Paddington – Newquay. GW
THE NIGHT RIVIERA Paddington – Penzance. GW
THE WEYMOUTH WIZARD. (Summer SO) Weymouth – Bristol Temple Meads. GW
Y CYMRO (THE WELSHMAN). Paddington – Swansea.

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HowardGWR · 21 Jan 2017

GWR says it's the Armada (I expect it was a typo of yours) and only goes to Plymouth from Paddington, on it's web site.

Here#s the link.
https://www.gwr.com/about-us/meet-our-trains

the full list

Armada – Plymouth
Atlantic Coast Express – Newquay
Bristolian – Weston-super-Mare and Bristol Temple Meads
Capitals United – Swansea
Cathedrals Express – Hereford
Cheltenham Spa Express – Cheltenham Spa
Cornish Riviera – Penzance
Cornishman – Penzance
Devon Express – Paignton
Golden Hind – Penzance
Mayflower – Plymouth
Merchant Venturer – Penzance and Bristol Temple Meads
Night Riviera – Penzance
Pembroke Coast Express – Pembroke Dock
Red Dragon – Carmarthen
Royal Duchy – Penzance
St David – Swansea
Torbay Express – Paignton

Mag_seven · 21 Jan 2017

Condor7 said:
THE CAPITALS UNLIMITED. Paddington – Swansea. GW

No its "The Capitals United"

(p.s. don't get me started on naming trains. A named train used to indicate something special or significant about the train usually limited stops and/or the fastest train of the day on a particular route. Just choosing to name a random service on a route that has the same stopping pattern/journey time as any other service on that route does not enter into the spirit of naming trains as far as I am concerned.)

Ianno87 · 21 Jan 2017

The Fensman title hasn't been used out of Liverpool Street for many years. In the early 90s it switched to a King's Cross return journey (when this became the fastest route after electrification), before being dropped.

The equivalent services today would probably be the 0621ish ex-Lynn, and 1814 ex-Cross, that convey 8-cars north of Cambridge and only call key stations as a result.

fredk · 21 Jan 2017

Mag_seven said:
No its "The Capitals United"

(p.s. don't get me started on naming trains. A named train used to indicate something special or significant about the train usually limited stops and/or the fastest train of the day on a particular route. Just choosing to name a random service on a route that has the same stopping pattern/journey time as any other service on that route does not enter into the spirit of naming trains as far as I am concerned.)

Don't some named trains have different catering?

317666 · 21 Jan 2017

In WAGN days I seem to remember that the Cambridge Express was instead known as the Cambridge Cruiser, although I'm not sure if that was an official name or just a nickname among passengers.

CyrusWuff · 21 Jan 2017

With the extension of services from Oxford Parkway to Oxford, Chiltern have named the loco-hauled services "The Oxford Flyer".

Steve Harris · 21 Jan 2017

317666 said:
In WAGN days I seem to remember that the Cambridge Express was instead known as the Cambridge Cruiser, although I'm not sure if that was an official name or just a nickname among passengers.

It was official! And applied to the trains that ran non stop between Cambridge and Kings Cross.
I also believe the name was still used in fcc days too.

As an aside I believe the Fensman was actually known as the Fenman.

TheDavibob · 21 Jan 2017

Condor7 said:
The one anomaly seems to be The Cambridge Express. Usually titles are given to one off trains each day (there and back) that provide something different, usually fewer stops and a faster speed, although they could also provide extra 'luxuries'.

The Cambridge Express covers several identical trains each day, and to me is more of a branding such as The Gatwick Express than a titled train.

I've never thought of the Cambridge Express/Cruiser as anything resembling a special high-speed train. It's just the express train to Cambridge, to distinguish it from the several other London-Cambridge routes that stop. It's not used as branding or anything when on the train.

317666 · 21 Jan 2017

TheDavibob said:
I've never thought of the Cambridge Express/Cruiser as anything resembling a special high-speed train. It's just the express train to Cambridge, to distinguish it from the several other London-Cambridge routes that stop. It's not used as branding or anything when on the train.

It does (or did anyway!) display 'The Cambridge Express' on the departure boards at Kings Cross though. I'm guessing the name came about once Royston - Shepreth Branch Junction electrification was completed, to promote the new through service?

route:oxford · 21 Jan 2017

No "Deerstalker"?

Wilts Wanderer · 21 Jan 2017

Although it's an unofficial name (but widely used) the Fort William portion of the Highlander sleeper is known as the 'Deerstalker'. Always thought they should totally use this for advertising purposes.

I don't know whether the Inverness / Aberdeen portions have similar unofficial titles but the Royal Highlander and Aberdonian titles are currently free...

Phil. · 21 Jan 2017

Mag_seven said:
No its "The Capitals United"

(p.s. don't get me started on naming trains. A named train used to indicate something special or significant about the train usually limited stops and/or the fastest train of the day on a particular route. Just choosing to name a random service on a route that has the same stopping pattern/journey time as any other service on that route does not enter into the spirit of naming trains as far as I am concerned.)

Very true. No nameboard on the front of the locomotive (I know, what locomotive?) no name board at the originating boarding point. It's just another train.

Steve Harris · 21 Jan 2017

317666 said:
. I'm guessing the name came about once Royston - Shepreth Branch Junction electrification was completed, to promote the new through service?

In a word, No !

When the line was electrified the stopping pattern was pretty much the same, although a short time later a hourly non stop-ish service was introduced (worked by 317's). It took 1 hour or slightly under and had one stop, but I can't remember if it was Stevenage or Finsbury Park.

As previously stated when WAGN was invented, the Cambridge Cruiser was born. Basically to identify that it was the quickest service to London i.e. It was non stop on that line and was quicker that the Liverpool St line also.

The service was also branded in timetables and station announcements also at the time.

I have no idea when the name was changed to Cambridge Express but I'm assuming it was when the TOC changed hands, hopefully someone can confirm.

As an aside, Cambridge used to have a direct service to Kings Cross long before electrification (between KX - Royston) worked by "toffee apple" 31's I believe.

Dr Hoo · 21 Jan 2017

Use of THE MASTER CUTLER by East Midlands seems very limited. It occasionally appears on departure indicators but never seems to be mentioned on board, e.g. in welcome announcements let alone bespoke menus.

On a recent journey, when my breakfast was delivered without utensils and I commented to the steward that it was ironic to have a cutlery-less meal on the CUTLER, the response was: "Shh! We're not supposed to call it that." (He did, however, manage to rustle up a knife and fork from somewhere so I suppose that it lingers on in a way.)

Timrud · 21 Jan 2017

Master Cutler is displayed on the departure boards at Sheffield, both in the lobby and on the platform

Condor7 · 21 Jan 2017

Thanks so far for your comments.

Yes there were a couple of typo's which I have now amended, thanks for spotting them.

The list is based on the current National Rail Timetable which I am using as the 'official' authority as to what is titled and what is not. Hence the Fenman (not the Fensman as I incorrectly typed) is still an official title.

I agree that the Deerstalker would be a good name to officially adopt, or even the Night Caledonian, especially as the carriages have Caledonian on the sides, but as neither is in the timetable I have not included them.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

CyrusWuff said:
With the extension of services from Oxford Parkway to Oxford, Chiltern have named the loco-hauled services "The Oxford Flyer".

I understand this is the title of the service rather than an individual train, as mentioned previously rather like the Gatwick Express.

Bletchleyite · 21 Jan 2017

Wilts Wanderer said:
Although it's an unofficial name (but widely used) the Fort William portion of the Highlander sleeper is known as the 'Deerstalker'. Always thought they should totally use this for advertising purposes.

I don't know whether the Inverness / Aberdeen portions have similar unofficial titles but the Royal Highlander and Aberdonian titles are currently free...

I agree, they would do well to further their branding with these names (and a couple for the Lowlander too). I've always loved the evocative nature of European night train names (the old D/EN 223/224 "Donauwalzer" being one of my favourites, not just for the name but for some wonderful travel experiences that air simply can't offer) and I'd like to see more of them in the UK too.

I recall VTWC abolished them because of the regular-interval timetable - but DB has operated "im Takt" since the 1990s at least and while I think it's moved away from them had named trains throughout the 1990s and 2000s.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Timrud said:
Master Cutler is displayed on the departure boards at Sheffield, both in the lobby and on the platform

Would be nice for LM to reinstate, officially[1], "The Master Cobbler" too

Southbound I'd suggest the 0716 off Northampton, that being one of the two that doesn't stop at MKC and the one better timed for a 9am start in the City, and northbound probably I'd go with either the 1713 or 1813, probably the latter.

[1] I have seen a member of staff put it on the blinds of the 1813, but there was nowt official about that

LM staff seem to get away with putting silly things on the blinds from time to time - I've seen "Bah Humbug", and even once "Late Again!"

Mag_seven · 22 Jan 2017

Would be nice for LM to reinstate, officially[1], "The Master Cobbler" too

To be operated by a rake of NSE liveried Mark 1's hauled by a Class 81 or Class 85 "roarer"

43096 · 22 Jan 2017

CyrusWuff said:
With the extension of services from Oxford Parkway to Oxford, Chiltern have named the loco-hauled services "The Oxford Flyer".

Have they? Or have they just named a loco rather than the service?

JoeGJ1984 · 22 Jan 2017

With the Flying Scotsman, I was looking at the Wikipedia article and it says that 91101 and DVT 82205 were given Flying Scotsman livery. Do these vehicles always operate the Flying Scotsman named service (leaves Edingburgh at 05.40 for London; one way only)?

I like the idea of named train services (not locomotives/units) but (sadly) I don't think there are really so relevant today as lots of services do the same route; sticking the name onto one of them per day 'dilutes' the idea. Are these names actually referred to in real life when travelling them (either on the train or on monitors)?

I think that the Highland Chieftain name should be carried on the train as a headboard (because this is a once a day train that the concept of named services was designed for) (or does it already). I don't think that would be too difficult to organise and would bring back some of the 'glamour' and 'romance' of rail travel.

broadgage · 22 Jan 2017

Wilts Wanderer said:
Although it's an unofficial name (but widely used) the Fort William portion of the Highlander sleeper is known as the 'Deerstalker'. Always thought they should totally use this for advertising purposes.

I don't know whether the Inverness / Aberdeen portions have similar unofficial titles but the Royal Highlander and Aberdonian titles are currently free...

I rather like the idea, but suspect that the anti hunting lobby would object strongly to a train called the Deerstalker. And yes I know that a deer might be stalked simply to admire and photograph it, but stalking is normally a prelude to shooting.
"you cant shoot Bambi !" "meat is murder" and so on.

(starting to fancy roast venison now

)

crewmeal · 22 Jan 2017

I for one minute cannot imagine a 4 coached voyager having a title on the front of it. Well depends what the title is of course, but certainly it wouldn't be in the ranks of any of the above mentioned.

Condor7 · 22 Jan 2017

JoeGJ1984 said:
With the Flying Scotsman, I was looking at the Wikipedia article and it says that 91101 and DVT 82205 were given Flying Scotsman livery. Do these vehicles always operate the Flying Scotsman named service (leaves Edingburgh at 05.40 for London; one way only)?

I like the idea of named train services (not locomotives/units) but (sadly) I don't think there are really so relevant today as lots of services do the same route; sticking the name onto one of them per day 'dilutes' the idea. Are these names actually referred to in real life when travelling them (either on the train or on monitors)?

I think that the Highland Chieftain name should be carried on the train as a headboard (because this is a once a day train that the concept of named services was designed for) (or does it already). I don't think that would be too difficult to organise and would bring back some of the 'glamour' and 'romance' of rail travel.

No, named locos do not regularly run the titled train they share the name with, I believe the cost of using a dedicated loco would be to high.

I am not aware of any current titled trains carrying headboards these are normally reserved for charters. I agree though it is a shame. I would have thought with modern technology an easily removable board would be possible, even if it was a peel on peel off sticker/banner.

Oxfordblues · 22 Jan 2017

When I was a railman at Preston station in the 1970s we used to load newspapers roaded from Manchester onto the Inverness sleeper. The bundles were labelled "Royal Highlander" rather than the train's departure time as that varied between timetables and it saved having to print new labels with each change.

IanXC · 22 Jan 2017

My understanding is that Chiltern have specifically named the one locohauled Oxford - Marylebone and return.

VTEC deleted "The Hull Executive" from the timetable a year or so ago.

Wilts Wanderer · 22 Jan 2017

broadgage said:
I rather like the idea, but suspect that the anti hunting lobby would object strongly to a train called the Deerstalker. And yes I know that a deer might be stalked simply to admire and photograph it, but stalking is normally a prelude to shooting.
"you cant shoot Bambi !" "meat is murder" and so on.

(starting to fancy roast venison now )

Technically this is a Deerstalker... :lol:

Condor7 · 22 Jan 2017

IanXC said:
VTEC deleted "The Hull Executive" from the timetable a year or so ago.

Thanks for your comment, but I can assure you it still appears in the National Timetable, table 26 as the 07:00 from Hull to Kings Cross but just one way.

grumblingalong · 23 Jan 2017

The East Anglian is not officially used for both the 0740 up and 1700 down that used to carry its name. Some of us dedicated crews like to keep the name alive though.

bramling · 23 Jan 2017

TheDavibob said:
I've never thought of the Cambridge Express/Cruiser as anything resembling a special high-speed train. It's just the express train to Cambridge, to distinguish it from the several other London-Cambridge routes that stop. It's not used as branding or anything when on the train.

WAGN referred to all their service groups by particular titles.
Great Northern - the outer suburban services to Cambridge and Peterborough.
Capital Connect - the inner suburban services generally to Moorgate.
Cambridge Cruiser - non-stop Cambridge to KX trains, marked "CC" in the timetable.
Fen Line - anything going north of Cambridge.
Heron Line - West Anglia outer suburban
City Hopper - West Anglia inner suburban.

This is where the name Cambridge Cruiser comes from, it gradually fell into disuse after National Express took over, and had completely fallen out of use early into FCC days. As far as I know it referred to particular services in the timetable, IIRC only the non-stop ones.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

317666 said:
It does (or did anyway!) display 'The Cambridge Express' on the departure boards at Kings Cross though. I'm guessing the name came about once Royston - Shepreth Branch Junction electrification was completed, to promote the new through service?

"The Cambridge Express" has only started appearing in the last year or so. I've not seen it referred to anywhere else except on the departure boards at King's Cross. Perhaps just a local initiative?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Condor7 said:
I would appreciate assistance with the following list of titled trains as shown in the current National timetable as to omissions or errors. I am aware of the list on Wikipedia but that includes trains no longer running and also is not now up to date. As far as I can see there is no up to date lists available but again you may prove me wrong.

In most cases trains run once each way with one or two exceptions, Most notably
The Flying Scotsman.

The one anomaly seems to be The Cambridge Express. Usually titles are given to one off trains each day (there and back) that provide something different, usually fewer stops and a faster speed, although they could also provide extra 'luxuries'.

The Cambridge Express covers several identical trains each day, and to me is more of a branding such as The Gatwick Express than a titled train.

THE EAST ANGLIAN. Liverpool St. - Norwich. LE
THE FENMAN. Liverpool St. Kings Lynn. LE
THE HIGHLAND CHIEFTAIN Kings Cross Inverness. GR
NORTHERN LIGHTS. Kings Cross Aberdeen. GR
WEST RIDING LTD. Bradford FS Kings Cross. GR
HULL EXECUTIVE. Hull Kings Cross. GR
THE FLYING SCOTSMAN. Edinburgh Kings Cross. GR
THE MASTER CUTLER. St. Pancras Sheffield. EM
THE ROBIN HOOD. St. Pancras Nottingham. EM
THE SOUTH YORKSHIREMAN. St. Pancras Sheffield EM
THE SHEFFIELD CONTINENTAL. Sheffield St.Pancras EM
THE CATHEDRALS EXPRESS. Paddington Hereford. GW
THE DEVON EXPRESS. Paddington Paignton. GW
THE St. DAVID. Paddington Swansea. GW
THE MERCHANT VENTURER. Paddington Penzance. GW
THE TORBAY EXPRESS. Paddington Paignton. GW
THE CORNISH RIVIERA Paddington Penzance. GW
THE MAYFLOWER. Paddington Plymouth GW
THE CHELTENHAM SPA EXPRESS. Paddington Cheltenham Spa. GW
THE ROYAL DUCHY Paddington Penzance. GW
THE CORNISHMAN. Paddington Penzance. GW
THE CAPITALS UNITED Paddington Swansea. GW
THE RED DRAGON. Paddington Carmarthen. GW
THE BRISTOLIAN Paddington Bristol Temple Meads. GW
THE GOLDEN HIND. Paddington Penzance. GW
THE ARMADA. Paddington Penzance/Plymouth. GW
THE PEMBROKE COAST EXPRESS. Paddington Pembroke Dock. GW
THE ATLANTIC COAST EXPRESS. Paddington Newquay. GW
THE NIGHT RIVIERA Paddington Penzance. GW
THE WEYMOUTH WIZARD. (Summer SO) Weymouth Bristol Temple Meads. GW
Y CYMRO (THE WELSHMAN). Paddington Swansea.

Not quite what you had in mind, but on London Underground generally any train numbered 111 is referred to by staff as "Nelson", although this practice has fallen out of use a little in recent years.

Titled trains 2017 UK

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