TheNewNo2
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On the Underground, Morden and Heathrow Terminal 5 would be examples - in both there's a depot or sidings beyond the platforms.
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Trivia: Stations where terminating trains reverse outside the station
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edwin_m
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At various times Metrolink has timetabled services to turn back at Etihad when there is no event on there. This seems to be to about avoiding too many services trying to turn at Sheffield Street.
PHILIPE
Veteran Member
At Liskeard terminating trains from Plymouth arrive in the Down Platform and have to go ahead to crossover and return from the Up platform.
Kite159
Veteran Member
I believe the Altrincham - Piccadilly services terminate at Eithad during the day, used to be Bury services but got switched over with the 2CC opening.
philthetube
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Also Amersham on the Met and Harrow on the Bakerloo, though in both cases it is possible to reverse from the arrival platform.
route:oxford
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Isn't the loop in order that the seats face the correct direction?
From experience, Amtrak "airline" seats tend always to face the direction of travel.
iain-j
Member
Was this strictly enforced/observed? I have vague memories of services terminating there, sitting for a while (staff having a chat on the platform) and then returning back to the Waverley. While I might be wrong I'm pretty sure that was what happened.
As an uninformed child I always assumed a balloon loop connected those portals.
AlterEgo
Veteran Member
On the T+W Metro, St James is a good example.
I can think of plenty where terminating trains run through to a siding but where there are through services as well. Also a few, such as Chesham where sidings have been removed and the buffer stop is now at the end of the platform.
If you ignore the LTS lines Upminster has lines through to the District Line depot.
If you ignore the LTS lines Upminster has lines through to the District Line depot.
The trains that start southbound from Lancaster to Euston in the early morning now arrive ecs from the south and use Platform 4 without going to Carnforth. The evening train from Euston that terminates at Lancaster turns round in Platform 3 and heads back south ecs.
The track and signalling layout introduced with electrification didn't allow trains to turn round from the south using the same platform, or at least not with both trains carrying passengers. A few years ago signalled southbound passenger departures from Platform 3 became possible, but only currently happen during engineering works or disruption. It was always possible to turn trains round by crossing them empty from the down side to the up, at either end of the station, but this involved changing ends while the train was blocking the WCML, not a great idea with 11 car trains!
Carnforth provided a loop for changing ends in, and avoided lengthy platform or line occupation at Lancaster, which would otherwise impact the Manchester-Barrow/Windermere services.
anti-pacer
Established Member
Wakefield Westgate for the Huddersfield trains. They go up to Wrenthorpe sidings after arrival, and wait there until just before the return working.
I agree that this must be common, it certainly is at stations local to me. At Hebden Bridge, terminating trains can run through the station in either direction. Terminators from the west run through the station to use the crossover to the east of the station. Terminators from the east usually just reverse to the crossover, but if the dwell time is too high (as was usually the case with the Leeds-Brighouse-Hebden Bridge service before it was extended to Manchester) trains run through to the west to Hall Royd Junction to turn.
Terminators at Todmorden from Manchester run through to the Tod Curve to turn. Terminators from Leeds run through Halifax to the sidings to turn. While I don't think there are any terminating services running through at any of these stations in the current timetable, there have been examples of all of these in the last 4 or 5 years.
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Emblematic
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That would certainty be one of the uses historically, but now most services are suburban EMUs with mixed direction seating (some stock had reversible seating, but not sure if any remains now.) Nowadays Amtrak use Penn Station for all of their services, other than at time of disruption, and only one of the loops (can't remember whether upper or lower level) remains open.
edwin_m
Veteran Member
At the time Grand Central was opened steam traction was banned and most of the trains would have electric locomotives that were taken off at the limit of the third rail, which wasn't very far away. As I doubt they had push-pull technology the loops would save a fair amount of shunting of locos.
Amtrak's Superliners had reversible seating as built and all seats would face forward in the Western long-distance trains they formed - both may still be so but it's a long time since I visited. The preference was to turn the entire train on a convenient triangle, probably because this kept the sleepers at the back. Superliners never worked into Grand Central but I think the heritage stock they used on the Lake Shore at the time (1986 and 1990) was also fully forward-facing.
To get back-ish on topic, I believe New Jersey Transit runs some of its Penn terminators empty through to Sunnyside Yard (west end of Long Island). And I've an idea the Long Island turns back in the sidings to the west. So this could be a non-terminal terminal in both directions.
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Bank on the DLR uses this idea- as will services terminating at Paddington on Crossrail. For metro-type services, especially if you can have clearance not to verify that the train is fully empty, it can be much more efficient than having terminating/departing trains crossing in the station mouth. Ideally though you want two sidings to provide for failures
Liverpool Central Low Level used to run through to a reversing siding. A second driver used to get on at the terminus so that they could reverse quickly without having to walk through the train.
Since the building of the loop line and closure of the high level station, the Northern Line now use these platforms and it's become a through station (although 8 trains an hour still terminate there). I haven't seen the reversal siding used in years, but I believe it's still operational.
Since the building of the loop line and closure of the high level station, the Northern Line now use these platforms and it's become a through station (although 8 trains an hour still terminate there). I haven't seen the reversal siding used in years, but I believe it's still operational.
61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
Queens Park terminators on the Bakerloo would be an example.
As for Halifax terminators, there is one from Leeds each evening but from the Brighouse direction. Not sure what it does upon arrival though.
As for Halifax terminators, there is one from Leeds each evening but from the Brighouse direction. Not sure what it does upon arrival though.
True. It waits 10 mins, then runs in passenger service through Bradford back to Leeds, so I've always thought of it as a circular service. But it's shown in timetables as a Haifax terminator, so if this counts, it means Halifax can have terminating trains running through in both directions, as well as Hebden Bridge.
Halifax also has the 180 morning service to Leeds from the Brighouse direction, although that's a starting train that runs through rather than a terminating train.
Metobusfan
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West hampstead and elephant and castle
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Strathclyder
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Dalmuir? Trains that terminate at Platforms 1 & 3 run empty to a holding siding west of the station for cleaning etc. before running back to the station to take up their next service at either Platforms 2 or 3.
xotGD
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Am I right in thinking that some terminating services at Embsay run through the station to reverse, but with the passengers still on board?
Kite159
Veteran Member
Basingstoke terminating services sometimes have to vacate the station to a siding on the west side when a XC service is due. Once the XC service has departed the 450s roll back in to form the next Waterloo stopping service.
Last time I checked, there were still a couple of daily trains booked to use the Reversing Siding - presumably for route knowledge retention at least.
I should have thought of that one. I assume that platform 1 is West bound from Westerton? In which case these trains now usually run through to Dumbarton, and I assume reverse in the loop there.
Via Yoker terminators presumably usually run into the bay platform ?5, although I've been on one that did as you suggest.
I seem to remember that in the first few years of Northern Line operation, trains that terminated at Central (usually Ormskirk and Kirkby ones) routinely continued into that siding and reversed into the northbound platform (2?). More recently they have terminated and started in the same platform, one or the other. But I think some of the extra Southport terminators still use it.
Kneedown
Established Member
Phase 1 of the Robin Hood line, when trains terminated at Newstead. It was a requirement for trains to offload the passengers before continuing forward ECS for a short distance, where the Driver would change ends and return to the platform. I'm afraid I don't recall the reason for this, only that it was something to do with the signalling or track circuits.
Not sure if it counts, but some EMT services terminating at Worksop continue over the crossover to reverse, or on to Mantonwood. Same applies at Newark Castle for the terminators.
Not sure if it counts, but some EMT services terminating at Worksop continue over the crossover to reverse, or on to Mantonwood. Same applies at Newark Castle for the terminators.
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cactustwirly
Established Member
Bedwyn, the train switches platform via a siding just beyond the station.
Great Malvern, terminating services go via Malvern Wells siding
Great Malvern, terminating services go via Malvern Wells siding
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