Possible dispute over lack of training for GWR staff regarding new SETs

Bromley boy · 16 Oct 2017

bnm said:
Anti-RMT. I'm a union member myself.

And thanks. It cheers me that you are glad to see me.

But you’re unwilling to clarify how you came by this mythical information you claim to have?

You keep digging that hole, chap. :lol:

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FordFocus · 16 Oct 2017

bnm said:
Anti-RMT. I'm a union member myself.

And thanks. It cheers me that you are glad to see me.

Your welcome, I hope the rest of my post clarified a few things for you

bnm · 16 Oct 2017

Darandio said:
I assume it means that because you cannot divulge your sources, then your countering or confirming statements doesn't really hold any water. Anyone can state they know the facts or argue they are right without backing it up.

It does happen a lot here, only yesterday in the Jacobite rescue thread there was a claim that the news reports were completely false, it's just that they couldn't tell you why they were false. I understand when people cannot speak for confidentiality reasons, in which case i'd prefer them not to bother at all.

This is a front page to one of the half dozen or so staff .pdf documents I have from both GWR and Hitachi regarding the Class 800. All I'm prepared to divulge to show bona fides.

No doubt that won't be proof enough for some that I have these documents. But I'm not sharing them publicly to prove a point. That's how you lose sources.

ainsworth74 · 16 Oct 2017

So it seems that the trains have run without any dispatch issues so far? I can't help but wonder if the problem is that not all staff have been trained as they don't all need to be trained yet? After all the two diagrams at the moment cover Paddington - Bristol/Swansea. So staff at places like Carmarthen or Oxford or Plymouth and similar don't actually need to have done any training as yet.

313103 · 16 Oct 2017

ainsworth74 said:
So it seems that the trains have run without any dispatch issues so far? I can't help but wonder if the problem is that not all staff have been trained as they don't all need to be trained yet? After all the two diagrams at the moment cover Paddington - Bristol/Swansea. So staff at places like Carmarthen or Oxford or Plymouth and similar don't actually need to have done any training as yet.

Most staff were given a briefing of sorts, i received mine on Friday afternoon. Swansea is the last station in Wales where dispatch staff are required, Carmarthen does not have dispatch staff.

Clip · 16 Oct 2017

313103 said:
Why? the union gets blamed for everything else, perhaps the RMT sabotaged the air con units so they leaked water, perhaps a union member made sure that the ohl wasnt working for 005.

I thought the trains were owned by a company called Agility or something similar (a previous message up thread mentioned that name) and not Hitachi.

Well it's already been answered, but in future ranting about stuff you're unsure of maybe isn't a good thing.

313103 · 16 Oct 2017

bnm said:
This is a front page to one of the half dozen or so staff .pdf documents I have from both GWR and Hitachi regarding the Class 800. All I'm prepared to divulge to show bona fides.

No doubt that won't be proof enough for some that I have these documents. But I'm not sharing them publicly to prove a point. That's how you lose sources.

Well all i can say, is that you have got far more then i have and i reckon more then most employees of GWR. I believe the one i have is an abridge version of the document i think you have (same picture of the class 800). With added material explaining the video is incorrect made for arriva staff just four pages. Which is better then nothing i suppose, which is where i was on Friday morning.

Not going to doubt you, and i understand why you wouldn't want to share. I am happy with that.

coppercapped · 16 Oct 2017

FordFocus said:
Glad to see your back with your anti-union posts again.

They'll sign off the trains to see if it meets standards (e.g. meets braking performance) but it's down to the TOCs to do their own risk assessments for dispatch at stations. HMRI and ORR don't sign every small detail off when a new train is launched. A lot of items are passed down to TOCs and their appropriate standards and safety departments to examine and sign off.

Every station has a different layout and it's my understanding these new trains carry some different risks because of their body profile and lengths compared to the previous fleets. GWR not carrying out these checks or briefing staff on differences between stock (considering it's the new pride of the fleet) is poor. Certainly when a Mk1 charter train came to my home depot station recently the dispatch staff had to be briefed on risks with slam door stock.

The separation between the bogies on each carriage of the Class 80X trains is the same as that on the Mk 3 stock and the doors are in the same relative position, to within a few inches, to the bogies as on the Mark 3 stock. This is intentional to ensure that the stepping distances are the same. The extra length of the Class 80X coaches is entirely outboard of the doors and explains why the ends are tapered in the manner they are.

This information is publicly available. The door positions were carefully selected so it would not be necessary to retrain the passengers so they could use the new trains safely - although judging by this thread it might be necessary for some of the staff.

bnm · 17 Oct 2017

nottsnurse said:
Indeed.

If this were a military forum the Walter Mitty hunters would be out in force.

Bromley boy said:
But you’re unwilling to clarify how you came by this mythical information you claim to have?

You keep digging that hole, chap.

Has the hole with this Walter character in it been found yet?

Would you two like a PM with copies of the documents and details of how to access to the IET Familiarisation App?

the sniper · 18 Oct 2017

Personally I've never doubted that bnm has access to these documents. Haven't we previously had him having access to the internal GWR logs too, acting cock of the walk over various GW related issues discussed here? You still have to take what he says with a pinch of salt though, as he enters every discussion with a self confirmed anti-RMT/staff bias, selectively using the confidential information he has access to to further his agenda on here. That his arguments would generally be found agreeable by GW management might leave them less concerned that internal and sometimes confidential information is so freely being leaked to him, as he's previously given the impression that he doesn't work on the railway.

Bromley boy · 18 Oct 2017

bnm said:
Has the hole with this Walter character in it been found yet?

Would you two like a PM with copies of the documents and details of how to access to the IET Familiarisation App?

I'm good thanks.

Ok you have the documents. They're really only half the story, as what you presumably don't have is any actual experience of dispatching trains.

I'm not going to say it's a complex process but it is an important one. I dispatch DOO trains (from the driver's cab) on a daily basis. Even with that experience I certainly wouldn't be competent to do so from the platform without further training.

If the staff who actually do the job are saying (via their union) they feel they have been inadequately prepared for new rolling stock I'll take that at face value. I'm not sure what you think qualifies you to know better.

You clearly have an axe to grind. You have access to internal documents, and evidently care enough to be posting extensively on these matters, so I imagine many readers will draw their own conclusions about your claims not to be affiliated with a TOC and to have no particular agenda.

tiptoptaff · 18 Oct 2017

bnm said:
Would you two like a PM with copies of the documents and details of how to access to the IET Familiarisation App?

I would like a pm with details of how to get on the app, being that I'm GWR staff without a company phone I can't have access, which is a shame

Filton Bank · 18 Oct 2017

tiptoptaff said:
I would like a pm with details of how to get on the app, being that I'm GWR staff without a company phone I can't have access, which is a shame

The app only really works on a tablet and is installed via the GWR internal app store. I don"t know where you're based, but if you don't have a tablet, ask your manager if there's a way to get you a chance to look at it.

bnm · 18 Oct 2017

Bromley boy said:
so I imagine many readers will draw their own conclusions about your claims not to be affiliated with a TOC and to have no particular agenda.

No affiliation with any rail industry body. The agenda is the (forlorn) hope that the RMT stops acting like its still the 1970s.

313103 · 18 Oct 2017

bnm said:
No affiliation with any rail industry body. The agenda is the (forlorn) hope that the RMT stops acting like its still the 1970s.

Actually what the union was doing was telling its staff to comply with the 'Employment Rights Act 1996' Section 44 Health & safety cases. Nothing at all to do with the 1970's, but if that is what you believe to be i am not going to change your mind.

Possible dispute over lack of training for GWR staff regarding new SETs

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