SWR Repaints and Refurbishments

class387 · 16 Nov 2017

Bletchleyite said:
Was it too much effort to get the colour the same?

Exactly what I was going to post. Thanks for the photo anyway.

RailUK Forums

3141 · 16 Nov 2017

Bletchleyite said:
Was it too much effort to get the colour the same?

I wonder whether the vinyl was matched to the faded blue of the class 450s, by someone who didn't realise that the class 458s looked a lot better.

Class455 · 16 Nov 2017

Is 456015 back yet? I would imagine it would have SWR logos when it returns from repairs

TEW · 17 Nov 2017

Some more details on the Desiro refurbishment.

444

First Class layout changed from 2+1 to 2+2.
First Class seating reduced from 35 to 32 seats per unit.
First Class compartment reduced in size to allow extra Standard Class seats.
Buffet removed for extra seating.
Guard's office removed for extra seating.
One of the two bike storage areas replaced by Standard Class seating.

450

First Class moved from centre of the train to behind each cab.
First Class seating reduced from 24 to 16 seats per unit.
Guard's office removed for extra seating.
Extra Standard Class seating as a result of the relocation of First Class.

class387 · 17 Nov 2017

TEW said:
Some more details on the Desiro refurbishment.

444

First Class layout changed from 2+1 to 2+2.

So effectively first will be worse than standard. Both 2+2 but Grammar seats in Standard and Fisa Lean in First. Huge downgrade.

I have a feeling that SWR are going for the GTR-esque 'first' that is actually pretty much identical to standard. Does anyone know what layouts the 442s and 159s will be getting?

AlterEgo · 17 Nov 2017

TEW said:
Some more details on the Desiro refurbishment.

444

First Class layout changed from 2+1 to 2+2.

First Class seating reduced from 35 to 32 seats per unit.

Well, I won’t be travelling in First Class ever again on 444s. The current configuration is very nice - 2+1 seats including plenty of solo seats.

Oh well.

pompeyfan · 17 Nov 2017

I’m concerned that a 444 will be losing bike space, anyone who’s travelled on one during a spring/summer Sunday’s through the new forest will tell you that 3 spaces is not enough.

XCTurbostar · 17 Nov 2017

I’d imagine they’re probably introduce a bike space reservation system like GWR have. As for first class, I don’t see the change from 2+1 to 2+2 as a big issue. If anything, that should promote groups of tourists to travel in first class as there (should) be more tables?

Goldfish62 · 17 Nov 2017

AlterEgo said:
Well, I won’t be travelling in First Class ever again on 444s. The current configuration is very nice - 2+1 seats including plenty of solo seats.

Oh well.

I've only been in 1st on a 444 once and I was impressed with the InterCity quality. Very comfortable seats indeed.

Goldfish62 · 17 Nov 2017

class387 said:
So effectively first will be worse than standard. Both 2+2 but Grammar seats in Standard and Fisa Lean in First. Huge downgrade.

I have a feeling that SWR are going for the GTR-esque 'first' that is actually pretty much identical to standard. Does anyone know what layouts the 442s and 159s will be getting?

It should satisfy Mick Cash, though! He'll be delighted that the rich scum are paying more for worse comfort than the proletariat.

I've probably sat in Fisa Lean seats on my travels across Europe. What modern stock are they in?

HarleyDavidson · 17 Nov 2017

pompeyfan said:
I’m concerned that a 444 will be losing bike space, anyone who’s travelled on one during a spring/summer Sunday’s through the new forest will tell you that 3 spaces is not enough.

Simple solution. Charge them a 25% supplement or ~£6 fare per journey like NS do. Whichever is the greater.

Bletchleyite · 17 Nov 2017

class387 said:
So effectively first will be worse than standard. Both 2+2 but Grammar seats in Standard and Fisa Lean in First. Huge downgrade.

Sounds like LM where first is *worse* than standard (unless it's a 350/2). I would never sit in First on LM even if it was declassified (unless it meant no seat otherwise). The legroom is worse and the seats are less comfortable than the Grammer regional seat.

Utter madness. There should be a requirement for First to have one seat fewer across the coach *or* substantially increased legroom over Standard.

Bletchleyite · 17 Nov 2017

Goldfish62 said:
I've probably sat in Fisa Lean seats on my travels across Europe. What modern stock are they in?

FWIW they are being used in *Standard* on the Greater Anglia FLIRTs which have comparable journey time to many SWT routes.

pompeyfan · 17 Nov 2017

HarleyDavidson said:
Simple solution. Charge them a 25% supplement or ~£6 fare per journey like NS do. Whichever is the greater.

Enforcement, especially on routes like the Netley line would be almost impossible.

HarleyDavidson · 17 Nov 2017

Don't I know it. :rolleyes:

Goldfish62 · 17 Nov 2017

Bletchleyite said:
FWIW they are being used in *Standard* on the Greater Anglia FLIRTs which have comparable journey time to many SWT routes.

That's the first time they've been used in the UK, I believe. They look the same as the seats on the Desiros on the Vienna S Bahn. Can anyone confirm?

class387 · 17 Nov 2017

Goldfish62 said:
That's the first time they've been used in the UK, I believe. They look the same as the seats on the Desiros on the Vienna S Bahn. Can anyone confirm?

I don't know which trains do have them, but Vienna S-Bahn definitely isn't one of them.

The Ham · 17 Nov 2017

pompeyfan said:
I’m concerned that a 444 will be losing bike space, anyone who’s travelled on one during a spring/summer Sunday’s through the new forest will tell you that 3 spaces is not enough.

Also, I don't remember where I've of the two cycle blocks are but one is certainly outside of the main seating area opposite a loo. Hardly the best location for seats, maybe they're aiming for encoring people of the XC services by giving them a comparable experience!

TEW · 17 Nov 2017

The Ham said:
Also, I don't remember where I've of the two cycle blocks are but one is certainly outside of the main seating area opposite a loo. Hardly the best location for seats, maybe they're aiming for encoring people of the XC services by giving them a comparable experience!

Both are in the same area in two different coaches. It's a ridiculous place to put seats.

F Great Eastern · 17 Nov 2017

This is the advertising blurb for the LEAN

It's not a parody, honest.

3141 · 17 Nov 2017

Not sure that I'll want another passenger's ginocchia so close to my posteriore as the diagram indicates

.

DenmarkRail · 18 Nov 2017

Something I'm concerned about is the removal of the guards compartment on the 444s. Seems a slow move to guardless trains.

theironroad · 18 Nov 2017

pompeyfan said:
I’m concerned that a 444 will be losing bike space, anyone who’s travelled on one during a spring/summer Sunday’s through the new forest will tell you that 3 spaces is not enough.

Just means there is going to be a free for all in every vestibule. Less bike spaces on 444 which serves heart of New forest and Purbeck is going to be a major issue in summer.

theironroad · 18 Nov 2017

George Moore said:
Something I'm concerned about is the removal of the guards compartment on the 444s. Seems a slow move to guardless trains.

Tend to agree. this is going to make the guard less visible, not more. Removing the buffet is probably ok as they are rarely used as a static buffet with trolleys in use. Having an office where the guard is based has always been a good thing imo. I believe it was sited were it is to allow to provide for providing easy assistance to wheelchair passengers.

moley · 18 Nov 2017

TEW said:
Both are in the same area in two different coaches. It's a ridiculous place to put seats.

Unless they drop the number of toilets from 3 standard + 1 universal to 2 standard + 1 universal.

With all these changes, it does concern me that the units may all loose their internal doors - that will increase the noise and cold airflow.

Lockwood · 19 Nov 2017

just saw 5909 and ?5903, both with new set stickers on the side

Kite159 · 19 Nov 2017

One thing which could be fitted to the 444s to make them better is luggage racks.

Considering they serve an airport plus 2 reasonably large seaside towns, as how many times have you seen large suitcases seemingly dumped in the vestibules

Bletchleyite · 19 Nov 2017

Most trains could use that, though Desiros are better than many as you can fit a proper sized case in the overheads.

TT-ONR-NRN · 19 Nov 2017

Kite159 said:
One thing which could be fitted to the 444s to make them better is luggage racks.

Considering they serve an airport plus 2 reasonably large seaside towns, as how many times have you seen large suitcases seemingly dumped in the vestibules

Not just one airport really.
OK, Southampton is the only actual airport station, but Bournemouth is the nearest station to Bournemouth Airport, Woking has the Heathrow coaches and Clapham Junction is regularly used for interchanges to Gatwick.

So yes luggage racks would be a good idea.

TT-ONR-NRN · 19 Nov 2017

class387 said:
So effectively first will be worse than standard. Both 2+2 but Grammar seats in Standard and Fisa Lean in First. Huge downgrade.

I have a feeling that SWR are going for the GTR-esque 'first' that is actually pretty much identical to standard. Does anyone know what layouts the 442s and 159s will be getting?

Grammar seats are those used on GWR HSTs/ScotRail 158s/EMT 158s/OBB RailJet. They have never been used in 444s.

SWR Repaints and Refurbishments

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