Slight changes you would make to liveries to make them nicer

ash39 · 26 Nov 2017

True, but does it matter if a livery dates? Trains generally need to be painted every 10-15 years to protect against corrosion, so as long as we have generic franchises with small, subtle 'operated by' logos, there's no reason why the livery can't be changed when repaints are due. The key is to separate the repainting process from the franchising process to stop unnecessary repainting.

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ash39 · 26 Nov 2017

DanNCL said:
Here is what a 185 would look like without the yellow front (like on the TPE livery 68). I personally think it looks better without a yellow front (though I suspect I'm probably in the minority here)

Nope, I think that looks great. The only thing I'd be tempted to try would be to increase the size of the black 'false windscreen' to cover more the whole top half of the front end.

Didn't like the TPE livery at first. I do now, but I still don't think it suits the Desiro shape. Will look great on the new stock though. May not age well as the colours are very trend based.

DanNCL · 26 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
Nope, I think that looks great. The only thing I'd be tempted to try would be to increase the size of the black 'false windscreen' to cover more the whole top half of the front end.

Didn't like the TPE livery at first. I do now, but I still don't think it suits the Desiro shape. Will look great on the new stock though. May not age well as the colours are very trend based.

How about this?

LunchSociety · 26 Nov 2017

DanNCL said:
How about this?

Now THAT looks superb! (IMO)

ash39 · 26 Nov 2017

DanNCL said:
How about this?

I'm not as skilled in photoshop as you are, but I was thinking more like the attached. I've also readded the number - I still can't get used to the front without them. Like when you take the xmas decorations down, after seeing them with numbers for so long they just look bare now!

pdeaves · 26 Nov 2017

DasLunatic said:
I've removed the yellow stripe on the door and the yellow above the orange line.

Oh yes. Very neatly done, I must say!

Clansman · 26 Nov 2017

A change in colour from Yellow to Black on the front of the 185s would top it off.

Domh245 said:
I found something similar, but the body is in black rather than midnight blue

First Great Western Sunset HST by Paul Burkitt-Gray, on Flickr

Reminds me of Fiery Irn Bru.

DarloRich · 26 Nov 2017

I love the smell of paint wibble in the morning!

Personally - would go for simple, standard liveries for intercity, cross country, regional and local and have a small operator logo as required. That or BR. one of the two.

ash39 · 26 Nov 2017

I'm not a fan of predominantly white liveries, so I've been thinking of this livery for a while but after seeing this thread I decided to try and mock it up. As I said, I'm not the strongest in photoshop, and we're probably out of the realms of 'slight changes' here, but how about an inverted Azuma....

superalbs · 26 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
I'm not a fan of predominantly white liveries, so I've been thinking of this livery for a while but after seeing this thread I decided to try and mock it up. As I said, I'm not the strongest in photoshop, and we're probably out of the realms of 'slight changes' here, but how about an inverted Azuma....

FAR better.

najaB · 26 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
I'm not a fan of predominantly white liveries, so I've been thinking of this livery for a while but after seeing this thread I decided to try and mock it up. As I said, I'm not the strongest in photoshop, and we're probably out of the realms of 'slight changes' here, but how about an inverted Azuma....

I think it should have a yellow front - there's too much black IMO.

ash39 · 26 Nov 2017

It looks OK actually, black would be more striking though.

najaB · 26 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
It looks OK actually, black would be more striking though.

I know that yellow fronts aren't needed any more for standards compliance but I'm not 'comfortable' with an all black front from a track safety point of view.

Goldfish62 · 27 Nov 2017

DanNCL said:
How about this?

I like that a lot.

Goldfish62 · 27 Nov 2017

najaB said:
I know that yellow fronts aren't needed any more for standards compliance but I'm not 'comfortable' with an all black front from a track safety point of view.

Although black is probably the most common colour for train fronts across the world.

BMIFlyer · 27 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
I'm not as skilled in photoshop as you are, but I was thinking more like the attached. I've also readded the number - I still can't get used to the front without them. Like when you take the xmas decorations down, after seeing them with numbers for so long they just look bare now!

When the class 185 headlamps are modified (next year) then the front end yellow will vanish. This is because both headlamps will be illuminated at the same time, like on the class 68's and all other new TPE stock arriving in due course.

najaB · 27 Nov 2017

Goldfish62 said:
Although black is probably the most common colour for train fronts across the world.

A Google image search for 'train' suggests that might not be the case.

pdeaves · 27 Nov 2017

najaB said:
A Google image search for 'train' suggests that might not be the case.

[black cab fronts] It does seem to be true of all modern British trains that do not have yellow fronts (or at least the artists' impressions). If yellow is not obligatory, can't designers not do something imaginative with the fronts? Can they not think round corners?

najaB · 27 Nov 2017

pdeaves said:
If yellow is not obligatory, can't designers not do something imaginative with the fronts? Can they not think round corners?

As I said, I know that yellow fronts aren't required for standards compliance but I don't see the harm in keeping them.

Wivenswold · 27 Nov 2017

ash39 said:
It looks OK actually, black would be more striking though.

Now that Ash, is a thing of beauty. Never been a fan of yellow fronts. If you're going to have a high visibility yellow front, make it bright yellow so it's still visible in poor light and when the front ends are covered in flies. We were going to experiment with HV yellow on a withdrawn 302 on LTS back in 1995 but Euston House bigwigs put a stop to it before the paint arrived. Innovation was not encouraged in British Rail days. Yet SWR seem to have been allowed to use a brighter shade on their new livery.

XCTurbostar · 27 Nov 2017

Class 701

TT-ONR-NRN · 27 Nov 2017

Bottom right looks the best!

Bletchleyite · 27 Nov 2017

Either of the bottom two, though it’s a particularly pig ugly snout end to try to make to look nice. Only the non gangway Desiro looks quite as rubbish.

AndrewE · 27 Nov 2017

Given some of the comments on this thread I think we might have one of the answers to a question posed a few months ago, what distinguishes a train-spotter from an enthusiast?

whhistle · 28 Nov 2017

najaB said:
What do you have against track workers and why do you want them killed?

Yawn.
The train horn and more modern headlight (yes, even on the MTU HSTs) are pretty bright. I can see a 170 from miles off - before the yellow front ends, which are usually dirty anyway so they're not particularly bright.
If they were so safety critical, why not paint them flourescent yellow? Why not paint the whole front end yellow? Or really, they should be red as the colour red means danger... it's also the most easily identifiable colour in the spectrum.
Are you also suggesting the new trains that don't need yellow front ends are dangerous?

Clansman · 28 Nov 2017

Not sure what I think of this to be honest...

najaB · 28 Nov 2017

whhistle said:
Are you also suggesting the new trains that don't need yellow front ends are dangerous?

No. Perhaps you should actually read the post I was replying to:

George Moore said:
Get rid of all yellow ends regardless of lights.

whhistle said:
Or really, they should be red as the colour red means danger... it's also the most easily identifiable colour in the spectrum.

Ermm.... nah, never mind.

alexl92 · 28 Nov 2017

Clansman said:
Not sure what I think of this to be honest...

I don’t like most of the attempts to remove yellow ends but this one actually looks classy and well thought-out.

DarloRich · 28 Nov 2017

whhistle said:
Yawn.
The train horn and more modern headlight (yes, even on the MTU HSTs) are pretty bright. I can see a 170 from miles off - before the yellow front ends, which are usually dirty anyway so they're not particularly bright.
If they were so safety critical, why not paint them flourescent yellow? Why not paint the whole front end yellow? Or really, they should be red as the colour red means danger... it's also the most easily identifiable colour in the spectrum.
Are you also suggesting the new trains that don't need yellow front ends are dangerous?

Is that from track level or on the platform?

While I am by no means a track monkey I do find the yellow is easier to pick up, especially on a dull horrible day as it offers some contrast with the background. It also offers a bigger target area for you to visually acquire. I am not comfortable with the change to headlights only and my concern is that there may be an increase in track worker incidents because of this.

Studies have shown that yellow is the best colour for this kind of thing as red can not be picked up from as far away nor does it stand out as clearly. Actually yellow and back chevrons are best like an 08. It is also one of the reasons numbers plates are yellow and black rather than red and white.

I am suggesting that without the yellow front end a new train may be more dangerous to a person working on the track as i feel there is a larger chance they will not acquire the train coming towards them as early as they may now. To the man on the platform the colour of the front end makes no difference other than in an aesthetic fashion.

Goldfish62 · 28 Nov 2017

najaB said:
A Google image search for 'train' suggests that might not be the case.

XCTurbostar said:
Class 701

I reckon pale grey/silver would look better and integrate with the colours on the side. Yellow just clashes.

Slight changes you would make to liveries to make them nicer

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