61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
Fixed that for you, you're welcome.
By the way, have political postings on the forum lurched alarmingly to the right in the last 6 months? It certainly feels that way...
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Next Tory leader
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By the way, have political postings on the forum lurched alarmingly to the right in the last 6 months? It certainly feels that way...
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3141
Established Member
Looking at that list, my feelings are:-
Johnson: may have missed the boat. He’s now had over a year to convince people that buffoonery isn’t a prime ministerial quality, apparently with some success.
Gove: possibly one of the brightest, but knifing Johnson in the back in 2016 will have made him many enemies who may not have forgiven him. Does he have charisma?
Leadsom: must appeal to somebody. The Labour Party might see her as the best to advance their cause.
Rudd: Seems a more rational person than some. She’d need a strong personality to stand up to the more rabid brexiteers.
Rees-Mogg: also very bright (I think), and just might attract and retain voters, being younger than some on the list, but probably also would be to Labour’s advantage in the end.
Hammond: Not entirely inspiring, but his views about Brexit are nearer to mine.
Davis: an interesting character, could be what they want to get Brexit sorted, but I doubt he’d be long term.
Williamson: different from most of the others, but largely unknown, and those who don’t like him apparently feel strongly, so could he have enough positives to win?
It’s true that Labour are a long way from being in top shape to win an election, but another few years of Conservative divisions – which are unavoidable in a party in an uncertain Parliamentary situation with such a controversial issue as Brexit to deal with – combined with the media telling us every day how divided and directionless the government is, plus the likely economic problems as we actually leave the EU, will all create a “time for a change” mood, and I doubt that anyone on that list will win the next election.
Johnson: may have missed the boat. He’s now had over a year to convince people that buffoonery isn’t a prime ministerial quality, apparently with some success.
Gove: possibly one of the brightest, but knifing Johnson in the back in 2016 will have made him many enemies who may not have forgiven him. Does he have charisma?
Leadsom: must appeal to somebody. The Labour Party might see her as the best to advance their cause.
Rudd: Seems a more rational person than some. She’d need a strong personality to stand up to the more rabid brexiteers.
Rees-Mogg: also very bright (I think), and just might attract and retain voters, being younger than some on the list, but probably also would be to Labour’s advantage in the end.
Hammond: Not entirely inspiring, but his views about Brexit are nearer to mine.
Davis: an interesting character, could be what they want to get Brexit sorted, but I doubt he’d be long term.
Williamson: different from most of the others, but largely unknown, and those who don’t like him apparently feel strongly, so could he have enough positives to win?
It’s true that Labour are a long way from being in top shape to win an election, but another few years of Conservative divisions – which are unavoidable in a party in an uncertain Parliamentary situation with such a controversial issue as Brexit to deal with – combined with the media telling us every day how divided and directionless the government is, plus the likely economic problems as we actually leave the EU, will all create a “time for a change” mood, and I doubt that anyone on that list will win the next election.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I do wish Portillo could be convinced back into the fold. I would vote for him.
nlogax
Established Member
You're right, Gove's ambush on Johnson's chances in 2016 will live long in his colleagues' memories and he'll not be on any leadership radar for some time to come. Tbh he seems to be doing a halfway decent job at DEFRA and I think for the environment's sake it'd be good if he could stay there for as long as possible.
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Up_Tilt_390
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There, I fixed it properly for both of you.
Casey Jones125
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Alarming isn't it! Maybe you should make a complaint to the site moderators!
Personally I think the reason Portillo looks like a reasonable person on railway programs is because he keeps quiet about his political views. I also don't think he would be so pro-railways if he was leader of the country as he would have to justify spending on the railways over spending for other departments like education.
trash80
Established Member
21st century anno domini or before christ?
61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
My point was just an observation, though I'm not sure if this forum is much of a bellwether!
We are of course all free to believe whatever we want to believe. We are also free to say whatever we choose here, within the bounds defined by the Forum Rules.
3141
Established Member
Or ever again, because things move on, different people start to come to the fore, and a person who was in the running for the leadership but didn't win rarely makes it to the top at a later date. But as you said, he does seem to be doing sensible things at DEFRA, and he was getting a good grip on Justice before that peculiar decision to try for the leadership.
I don't know whether Portillo has ever explained publicly why he left politics, but perhaps he was sufficiently realistic and balanced to feel that there are other things in life and he wanted to do some of them. His speech when he lost the Southgate seat in 1997 showed he appreciated that the mood of the public had seriously diverged from his party's position. I guess he wouldn't want to return to the political world. All that may explain, partly at least, why he can seem an attractive figure.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
He has a record for being pro-rail when he was in Government - but that's not why I'd vote for him. I just think he comes across as a reasonable thinking man, and always did.
Butts
Veteran Member
They need to parachute Ruth Davidson in from Scotland asap.
Suprised no one has mentioned her before - anyone who can make mincemeat of Salmond and Sturgeon could easily wipe the floor with Corbyn.
Is there any legality that precludes someone who is not a Westminster MP becoming Prime Minister ?
Suprised no one has mentioned her before - anyone who can make mincemeat of Salmond and Sturgeon could easily wipe the floor with Corbyn.
Is there any legality that precludes someone who is not a Westminster MP becoming Prime Minister ?
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Yes. You can't be in the Commons unless you are an MP! Even the Speaker is an MP, which is itself controversial because it denies the constituency representation, effectively.
The way this is usually worked around is to place them in a very safe seat.
Butts
Veteran Member
What about if you are a Peer ? - seem to remember Lord Aberdeen !!
Up_Tilt_390
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I agree with some people here in regards to Michael Portillo. Quite honestly, if he was leader and contender to potentially become Prime Minister, I think I would seriously consider voting Conservative. I have voted Labour in both general elections in which I was eligible to vote, but given that Portillo now seems like a reasonable bloke (though I have heard he wasn't particularly moderate when he was an MP) I imagine he might have reasonable policies. I'd have to see really. I mean I thought the Conservatives might've been a decent option given their commitment to Brexit and that, but they just went so overboard I was like "Really? Are you trying to lose?".
Seconded! How could I honestly forget about Ruth Davidson? From what I've read so far she seems to be one of the more liberal conservatives, and my friend has even said she's the "Queen of Sass". I'd love to see here go toe-to-toe with Jeremy Corbyn, I think he'd have his work cut out very well then so long as she doesn't resort to the same previous tactics of buzzwording "strong economy" and going on about past mistakes of Labour that doesn't hold any power at the moment. It'd be interesting to say the least, and I do wonder what kind of time John Bercow would be having in any PMQs or debates between them.
Seconded! How could I honestly forget about Ruth Davidson? From what I've read so far she seems to be one of the more liberal conservatives, and my friend has even said she's the "Queen of Sass". I'd love to see here go toe-to-toe with Jeremy Corbyn, I think he'd have his work cut out very well then so long as she doesn't resort to the same previous tactics of buzzwording "strong economy" and going on about past mistakes of Labour that doesn't hold any power at the moment. It'd be interesting to say the least, and I do wonder what kind of time John Bercow would be having in any PMQs or debates between them.
DynamicSpirit
Established Member
I'm not sure that any explanation is really needed, as it's not hard to put 2 and 2 together. He lost his seat in 1997, apparently entered a period of reflection which resulted in him modifying many of his previous views and becoming more of a modernising, internationalist, Tory. He got back into Parliament and stood for the Tory leadership, but lost in circumstances that made it very clear that the Tory party at the time was not at all receptive towards Portillo's new worldview. It would take a very strong person to want to continue in politics in those kinds of circumstances. Especially since with hindsight it's clear that other very good career opportunities were available to him.
Although I'm in the Labour Party and there is basically zero chance of me voting Conservative in the foreseeable future no matter who becomes leader, I do agree that Portillo would be a far more reasonable, and probably better, leader than any of the people currently being touted [*]. He'd arguably also give the Conservatives by far their best shot at winning the next election outright. If he was Tory leader, then as a Labour member, I'd be pretty worried!
[*] With the possible exception of Ruth Davidson, who isn't in the running 'coz she's not an MP.
Spot on DS.
Casey Jones125
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My point was just an observation, though I'm not sure if the forum is much of a bellwether!
We are of course all free to believe whatever we want to believe. We are also free to say whatever we choose here, within the bounds defined by the Forum Rules.
Ah the rules, mustn't forget the rules, how nice of you to remind everyone of the rules!
AlterEgo
Veteran Member
That’s not actually correct.
The Prime Minister is appointed by the Monarch and is simply the person who can command the confidence of the Commons. Of course, this is almost always the leader of the largest party, but it could be a Lord, or even someone not in either Houses of Parliament at all!
BlythPower
Member
Well, JRM does know what it's like to live off handouts from the taxpayer...
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SilentGrade
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Indeed up until the end of the 19th Century it was common to have a Lord as PM.
Not that that could happen politically today, despite the fact that some lords would probably have greater expertise in negotiating Brexit than May currently.
furnessvale
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The fact that the house no longer belongs to the family, having been offered to the National Trust but declined as too much of a liability appears to missing from this tirade.Well, JRM does know what it's like to live off handouts from the taxpayer...
The house has been owned for some years by a charitable trust.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
The postings may have, but have the number of posters agreeing with it? Quite a few far-right posters here seem to have very similar writing styles!
None whatsoever.
Modern protocol is that the PM is the leader of the largest party in the Commons, but it is not necessary. It's only a relatively modern change too, throughout most of the 19th Century the PM was still in the Lords.
My cat has greater expertise in negotiating Brexit than May.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
And the beneficiary of that trust is Lady Juliet Tadgell, heir to the Fitzwilliam fortune (which originally owned the house) with a net worth of £45m, and who is none other than Jacob Rees-Mogg's mother in law.
It's a small world.
I'd say the meme was pretty much on the spot.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
The Conservative Party will tear itself apart because you have the moderates on one side and you have the hard-right Brexit element on the other. The grassroots are mostly hard-right Brexiters that wouldn't be out of place in UKIP. The funders are a combination of neo-liberals who want to make money out of privatisation and hard-right Brexiters who want to make money out of the carnage of Brexit.
Moderates like Portillo or Ken Clarke, or even Anna Soubry, wouldn't stand a chance in a leadership election. But hard-right Brexiters wouldn't stand a chance in a general election, even against Corbyn. Ruth Davidson would be an attractive leader to the general public, but a moderate Scottish lesbian in charge of the Tories? Nah. They wouldn't stand for it.
Personally I'm hoping they rip themselves apart once and for all. They almost killed the party in the late 90s. Here's hoping they do it again.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
It'd be nice if both the Tories and the Labour Party would tear themselves apart and leave the extremists to run the show (and not be elected), and the sensible moderates in both to gather and form a new European style centrist social democratic party (probably slightly, but only very slightly, to the right of Blairite Labour) which could do quite well.
It would seem that if ever there’s was a time to do this, then this is the time.
Up_Tilt_390
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Maybe there’s no need for a new party. I’d quote like to see a growth in the Liberal Party (not Lib Dem’s). Macron in France proved that a minor party can gain a great deal of seats in just a short amount of time, and given that I agree with a great deal of what the Liberal Party stands for (unless I’ve been lied to), I think it’d be great if they broke the chain of Labour and Tory rule. Plus as a Liverpudlian, a Liverpool-based party would be a great empowerment to us if they won
.Casey Jones125
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Yes, and let the communists, and hard left in. That will solve the country's problems.
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