Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

Railrover700 · 21 Mar 2018

https://www.networkrailmediacentre....as-work-continues-on-great-north-rail-project[/QUOTE]

td97 said:
Network rail are still claiming Dec 2018 in a PR release from earlier today, detailing upcoming work as part of the GNRP over Easter

They are no longer promising 'faster' journeys for Manchester-Preston from December 2018. It looks like this has been revised to 'new and improved trains'.

RailUK Forums

snowball · 21 Mar 2018

Railrover700 said:
They are no longer using the word 'faster'...

The press release you link, dated Tuesday, does include the word.

Passengers are being reminded to check before they travel as the Great North Rail Project continues over Easter.

Manchester Victoria will continue to be closed to train services on Sundays until Easter and the Easter weekend. This is to replace old track with new and to lower track under Cheetham Hill Road bridge on the line out to Stalybridge. This will help provide faster journeys in future.

During the engineering work, rail replacement buses will be available to take customers to their usual destinations. Normal train services will resume on Tuesday 3 April 2018.

My emphasis.

Railrover700 · 21 Mar 2018

Apologies, I have edited my post to clarify that I am referring to Manchester-Preston.

LDECRexile · 21 Mar 2018

Preston-Blackpool

An Orangeman has authorised me to quote this:

"All signalling, track work, civils and telecoms are either ready for operational railway or will be ready by Monday.

Carleton crossing is complete and ready for Monday.

Work not yet complete, such as Poulton platforms, is still on target.

As the teams have an extra 3 week window they will be continuing the work to take it beyond being ready for an operational railway and getting it close to being substantially complete, including snagging."

OHLE remains a problem, hence the extension.

PS: A while ago the test train was booked for 10th-15th April. The 15th therefore becomes a do or die deadline for the wiring. We'd better keep an eye on Realtimetrains etc for the actual date, which can vary at very short notice if the Liverpool-Manchester experience is anything to go by.

CdBrux · 21 Mar 2018

which doesn't really explain why there is an extra 3 weeks window...

LDECRexile · 21 Mar 2018

CdBrux said:
which doesn't really explain why there is an extra 3 weeks window...

Please see the PS.

Buspilot · 21 Mar 2018

More complaints in the Blackpool Gazette

https://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/...es-for-blackpool-rail-delay-slammed-1-9073838

59CosG95 · 21 Mar 2018

Buspilot said:
More complaints in the Blackpool Gazette

https://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/...es-for-blackpool-rail-delay-slammed-1-9073838

Ah, the "Angry People In Local Newspapers" brigade strike again.

59CosG95 · 21 Mar 2018

Bertie the bus said:
The gap at Blackpool Road, Preston has now been wired on the up but there is still a gap to the UCLAN sports centre on the down.

They appear have done precisely nothing in the last 2 weeks around Kirkham & Wesham. There is still a mast lying on the ground west of the junction and no wires to be seen. Absolutely nobody about this afternoon either. So much for Team Orange working night and day to finish the job.

Is the newly closed gap between UCLAN's Sports Centre and Water Lane completely plugged now on the Up line?

Bertie the bus · 21 Mar 2018

59CosG95 said:
Ah, the "Angry People In Local Newspapers" brigade strike again.

So you think people should just accept blatant lies because it relates to choo choos? The main reason given was deep snow and high winds. There hasn’t been any deep snow. The work is taking place in the Fylde, not the Scottish Highlands. We've also had fewer storms than usual for Winter.

Ianno87 · 21 Mar 2018

Bertie the bus said:
So you think people should just accept blatant lies because it relates to choo choos? The main reason given was deep snow and high winds. There hasn’t been any deep snow. The work is taking place in the Fylde, not the Scottish Highlands. We've also had fewer storms than usual for Winter.

Might depend on where staff are coming in from. Fylde might have got off lightly with snow, but not necessarily where contractors are trying to travel from, for example.

GRALISTAIR · 21 Mar 2018

Ianno87 said:
Might depend on where staff are coming in from. Fylde might have got off lightly with snow, but not necessarily where contractors are trying to travel from, for example.

Not sure what the winds were like but high winds do not make for good safety either which would have delayed things too. If you put too much contingency in for things going wrong, I assume you would be paying more out in compensation too. So I assume there is pressure to keep to as tight a timescale as possible.

Bertie the bus · 21 Mar 2018

Ianno87 said:
Might depend on where staff are coming in from. Fylde might have got off lightly with snow, but not necessarily where contractors are trying to travel from, for example.

Ridiculous. Even if they couldn’t get to work for 2 or 3 days that doesn’t put a project back by 3 weeks.

GRALISTAIR · 21 Mar 2018

Bertie the bus said:
Ridiculous. Even if they couldn’t get to work for 2 or 3 days that doesn’t put a project back by 3 weeks.

Sounds suspiciously to me like Volker Rail are not up to the task. Wasn't it that lot that had that Health and Safety violation leaving a metal pile close to the track or similar?

LNW-GW Joint · 21 Mar 2018

Isn't Easter the problem?
Contractors like a long break, and they were all due to finish the job this week.

But I still don't really understand how the line can be operational (track, signalling, station platforms etc) with only OHLE outstanding.
Why can't DMUs operate?

GRALISTAIR · 21 Mar 2018

LNW-GW Joint said:
Isn't Easter the problem?
Contractors like a long break, and they were all due to finish the job this week.

But I still don't really understand how the line can be operational (track, signalling, station platforms etc) with only OHLE outstanding.
Why can't DMUs operate?

I confess I do not understand why either. Run DMUs -possibly a bus replacement for the last train of the day, then wire the OHLE overnight - or am I being too simplistic?

takno · 21 Mar 2018

LNW-GW Joint said:
Isn't Easter the problem?
Contractors like a long break, and they were all due to finish the job this week.

But I still don't really understand how the line can be operational (track, signalling, station platforms etc) with only OHLE outstanding.
Why can't DMUs operate?

Are there any DMUs available?

LNW-GW Joint · 21 Mar 2018

takno said:
Are there any DMUs available?

Well, nothing's changed since they last ran in November.
It was always the plan to resume with DMUs until May 20.

AngelicUpstart · 21 Mar 2018

LNW-GW Joint said:
Isn't Easter the problem?
Contractors like a long break, and they were all due to finish the job this week.

But I still don't really understand how the line can be operational (track, signalling, station platforms etc) with only OHLE outstanding.
Why can't DMUs operate?

I understand, and having just been passed Blackpool North and the old Devonshire Road hospital site which is used as a work compound, I can quite believe it, that there is still a lot of steel work to go up over all six platforms at Blackpool North, which incidentally currently don't have working lights. I also understand that at Poulton there is both not only steel work still to erect but also piles to be driven. There is no point in running a service if you can't get passed Poulton or into the platforms at North!

GRALISTAIR · 21 Mar 2018

You can run a diesel service though- just not an electric service

Pyreneenguy · 21 Mar 2018

AngelicUpstart said:
I understand, and having just been passed Blackpool North and the old Devonshire Road hospital site which is used as a work compound, I can quite believe it, that there is still a lot of steel work to go up over all six platforms at Blackpool North, which incidentally currently don't have working lights. I also understand that at Poulton there is both not only steel work still to erect but also piles to be driven. There is no point in running a service if you can't get passed Poulton or into the platforms at North!

I had a look at North station a few weeks ago, commenting on this thread about what I saw on 3rd March so it really comes as no surprise that a later completion date has been announced.

It is annoying that so much has been or will be spent on electrification whilst other worthy projects are left unfinanced :- a passing loop enabling a 30 min service on the South line; relaying one or both of the Burscough curves to enable a direct Southport to Preston/ Ormskirk, just to mention two that would cost peanuts compared to North West electrification.

jyte · 21 Mar 2018

Maybe they'd rather open with an electric service than a diesel one? There was criticism of TFL/NR when the Goblin was re-opened without electric trains. Sometimes people expect the benefit immediately :/

Bertie the bus · 21 Mar 2018

GRALISTAIR said:
You can run a diesel service though- just not an electric service

You can't run a diesel service if the work hasn't been completed, which is what people who have seen the work are saying.

Just because somebody dressed in orange says something different doesn't mean his account is correct.

Bertie the bus · 21 Mar 2018

jyte said:
Maybe they'd rather open with an electric service than a diesel one? There was criticism of TFL/NR when the Goblin was re-opened without electric trains. Sometimes people expect the benefit immediately :/

That certainly isn't the reason. There will be no EMUs operating when the line reopens. Even with the May timetable change the absolute best that can be hoped for is an EMU service to Liverpool and an hourly - Manchester via Wigan, though the latter isn't certain but could happen if they swap the routing of the Barrow and Blackpool - Manchester services.

driver_m · 21 Mar 2018

The route ultimately has to be signed off by someone, maybe they won't put their name to it until everything is guaranteed safe. Ultimately we don't know. So there's no point either getting het up about it. Hopefully it opens on the 16th and then attention can start on the Westhoughton line, or at least try and finish off Bolton!

AngelicUpstart · 21 Mar 2018

GRALISTAIR said:
You can run a diesel service though- just not an electric service

How are you going to run a service if the line is blocked by essential engineering work. Or are you suggesting they plod along with 8 hours possessions each night and finish the job in about July?

As a resident of Blackpool, the RRB service is fine and almost as good as the trains it replaces. Give me a 35 minute journey on a coach or one of the brand new Blackpool Transport double deckers than 25 in a knackered Pacer any day!

AngelicUpstart · 21 Mar 2018

Bertie the bus said:
That certainly isn't the reason. There will be no EMUs operating when the line reopens. Even with the May timetable change the absolute best that can be hoped for is an EMU service to Liverpool and an hourly - Manchester via Wigan, though the latter isn't certain but could happen if they swap the routing of the Barrow and Blackpool - Manchester services.

There will be an hourly Lime Street and hourly Manchester Airport via Wigan mostly electric from May, this is now confirmed subject to the line being complete.

Bertie the bus · 21 Mar 2018

At least that is some good news - confirmation of the hourly Blackpool - Manchester from May. The timetable has completely disappeared from RTT for May.

Geeves · 21 Mar 2018

Emailed to us earlier...

Manchester Piccadilly – Blackpool
Hourly service running Blackpool North – Manchester Piccadilly
Hourly Manchester Airport – Blackpool North via Wigan

Manchester Picc and Vic – Preston
Half hourly Preston – Manchester Piccadilly via Bolton service will still be provided, one train an hour running Blackpool North – Manchester Picc
one train an hour Preston – Manchester Airport

Four through Barrow – Manchester Airport and vice versa services will be provided
with one Manchester Piccadilly – Windermere and two Windermere – Manchester
Piccadilly services

Hourly Preston – Manchester Victoria service will now run between Buckshaw Parkway and Manchester Victoria
Hourly Manchester Airport – Blackpool North via Wigan EMU service

Liverpool – Blackpool
Hourly through service between Liverpool and Blackpool North restored

Preston to Ormskirk
Regular hourly weekday service will be introduced between Preston an
Ormskirk
The following services will see alterations:
 Blackpool South – Preston – Colne service split, with hourly Blackpool South
Preston and hourly Preston – Colne services
Blackpool North – York service will be curtailed to operate Preston – Leeds


GRALISTAIR · 21 Mar 2018

AngelicUpstart said:
How are you going to run a service if the line is blocked by essential engineering work. Or are you suggesting they plod along with 8 hours possessions each night and finish the job in about July?!

I would certainly ask “ why not?”

Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

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