Caledonian Sleeper discussion

Scotrail84 · 1 Apr 2018

Only one 73 going now.

RailUK Forums

Scotrail84 · 1 Apr 2018

92’s not cleared for queen street apparently. 2 x 73s not allowed either apparently.

JonathanH · 1 Apr 2018

Scotrail84 said:
Only one 73 going now.

73966 has been started up again so will possibly assist.

TimboM · 1 Apr 2018

JonathanH said:
Isn't it just more likely that it is due to driver availability?

There is still quite a lot of stunting to happen at Edinburgh - 73966 has to come off the back, 73968 / 73971 / 47749 have to come off the front and a 92 needs to go on

Assuming the 47 stays on, if 92043 had gone, once back at EDB 043 would have to drag (failed) 47749 off the stock, put it somewhere, uncouple from it, then go back on the stock. Using the 73/9s means once at EDB they can just unhook and run off with the duff Duff direct to Craigentinny and 043 then goes on - a simpler shunt.

Also the 73/9s already being off 5C11 means 1M11 can now run past and reverse back on to it without another move required to get them off the stock and out of the way.

TimboM · 1 Apr 2018

Scotrail84 said:
92’s not cleared for queen street apparently. 2 x 73s not allowed either apparently.

92s are definitely cleared, as are 86/87/90.

Would be beyond the starting signal if the 47 stays attached though - but then the 73 will be too I think.

ScottDarg · 1 Apr 2018

JonathanH said:
In just over 20 minutes time there will be two Caledonian Sleeper trains at different parts of Glasgow Queen Street station at the same time.

There it is - 1B01 is currently beneath 1M11

gsnedders · 1 Apr 2018

TimboM said:
I guess if you sent 92 043 they’d still have to shunt out the duff Duff once back at EDB. Also the 73/9s needed to come off 5C11 anyway. So actually having thought a bit more about it does make sense...

Is the 92 not providing ETH to the stock in Edinburgh while passengers board?

TimboM said:
92s are definitely cleared, as are 86/87/90.

Would be beyond the starting signal if the 47 stays attached though - but then the 73 will be too I think.

At the time of day by which it gets rescued, I imagine fouling the other platforms is hardly a concern!

Highlandspring · 1 Apr 2018

TimboM said:
92s are definitely cleared, as are 86/87/90.

A wee bit of confusion crept into things but as you say they do all have NRAP certificates clearing them.

TimboM said:
Would be beyond the starting signal if the 47 stays attached though - but then the 73 will be too I think.

The platform 7 starting signal is fitted with ‘standing out’ controls to allow it to be cleared with a portion of a train stating beyond it.

TimboM · 2 Apr 2018

gsnedders said:
Is the 92 not providing ETH to the stock in Edinburgh while passengers board?

No - turns out just one 73/9 has gone to rescue 1M11, so likely the other is still on 5C11 providing ETH.

At the time of day by which it gets rescued, I imagine fouling the other platforms is hardly a concern!

Agreed

Please Explain · 2 Apr 2018

Bonsoir!

Enjoying reading the live updates of tonight's wacky workings here aboard 1S26 as the drama unfolds with some Thirsty Cross! -(I'm told I got my hands on the very last bottle onboard!!) Do keep them coming fellas!! :lol:

Forgive me for my ignorance, I appreciate that it most probably has been mentioned somewhere up-thread months ago but I have not logged on here in some time and just decided to bash tonight's historical first last night having read about it on here thanks to you guys and luckily been at a lose end this Easter Weekend!
But, can one of you gentlemen kindly shed some light on why were going to Queen Street tonight? I'm guessing one of the approaches to Central is closed for ENG WKS for the weekend somewhere or other, but where would that be exactly??

Many thanks in advance and thanks to all the gen posters out there, its been most entertaining so far!

ScottDarg · 2 Apr 2018

1M11 is finally away from Queen St 137 minutes late

JonathanH · 2 Apr 2018

ScottDarg said:
1M11 is finally away from Queen St 137 minutes late

...and away from Edinburgh 148 minutes late.

For people interested in the shunting arrangements -

73971 remained coupled to the Edinburgh portion in platform 11. 92043 had been drawn forward from the Klondike siding.

1M11 arrived in platform 10. 73966 was detached from the rear. 1M11 drew forward into platform 7.

73971 then left the Edinburgh portion behind to shunt to platform 10 and attach to 73966. 73968 appeared to be the engine pushing the Glasgow portion back onto the waiting carriages rather than 47749

73968 and 47749 then taken off the front to shunt to platform 10 via Abbeyhill and join the two 73s. 92043 then coupled to the front of 1M11.

Meanwhile with attention on 1M11 the normal shunting of 1M16 was delayed. However, 0B01 and 0M16 were allowed to go to Craigentinny and the 92 for 1M16 move from platform 9 to 2 before 1M11 left.

1M16 left 52 minutes late 12 minutes behind 1M11. Let's see how the rest of this goes.

Oh, and 1S25 is waiting at Newcastle, presumably for the driver off 1M11. Seems possible that all four trains will be in the Newcastle area at once (not the station because there aren't enough suitable platforms)

Scotrail84 · 2 Apr 2018

JonathanH said:
...and away from Edinburgh 148 minutes late.

For people interested in the shunting arrangements -

73971 remained coupled to the Edinburgh portion in platform 11. 92043 had been drawn forward from the Klondike siding.

1M11 arrived in platform 10. 73966 was detached from the rear. 1M11 drew forward into platform 7.

73971 then left the Edinburgh portion behind to shunt to platform 10 and attach to 73966. 73968 appeared to be the engine pushing the Glasgow portion back onto the waiting carriages rather than 47749

73968 and 47749 then taken off the front to shunt to platform 10 via Abbeyhill and join the two 73s. 92043 then coupled to the front of 1M11.

Meanwhile with attention on 1M11 the normal shunting of 1M16 was delayed. However, 0B01 and 0M16 were allowed to go to Craigentinny and the 92 for 1M16 move from platform 9 to 2 before 1M11 left.

1M16 left 52 minutes late 12 minutes behind 1M11. Let's see how the rest of this goes.

Oh, and 1S25 is waiting at Newcastle, presumably for the driver off 1M11. Seems possible that all four trains will be in the Newcastle area at once (not the station because there aren't enough suitable platforms)

Nope, driver for 1S25 went forward in a taxi long before 1M11 arrived in Edinburgh

JonathanH · 2 Apr 2018

Scotrail84 said:
Nope, driver for 1S25 went forward in a taxi long before 1M11 arrived in Edinburgh

Ah, right - just a guess as I noted 1S25 hadn't left Newcastle - in that case why was shunting of 1M11 (or appeared to be) prioritised over getting 1M16 out on time?

JModulo · 2 Apr 2018

1S25 still at Newcastle with 1S26 now stuck behind it on King Edward Bridge. The joys of waking up to the fire alarm...

Scotrail84 · 2 Apr 2018

JonathanH said:
Ah, right - just a guess as I noted 1S25 hadn't left Newcastle - in that case why was shunting of 1M11 (or appeared to be) prioritised over getting 1M16 out on time?

Because 1M11 didn't have to stop at Newcastle for a driver change, 1M16 did so I believe

Scotrail84 · 2 Apr 2018

JModulo said:
1S25 still at Newcastle with 1S26 now stuck behind it on King Edward Bridge. The joys of waking up to the fire alarm...

26 will still be in Edinburgh in plenty time.

Kite159 · 2 Apr 2018

1S26 is still at Edinburgh 10+ minutes after it was meant to have departed.

Please Explain · 2 Apr 2018

And were off! The first ever electric locomotive-hauled passenger train over the E&G to Glasgow Queen Street (High Level)! The 73 has been tied on the rear for the ECS out.

jopsuk · 2 Apr 2018

how long is the train into QS? Surely it can't be a full loco+2 mark 2 + 6 mark 3+ loco?

TimboM · 2 Apr 2018

jopsuk said:
how long is the train into QS? Surely it can't be a full loco+2 mark 2 + 6 mark 3+ loco?

2 locos + Load 7

(ie one Mk3 sleeper shorter than normal)

theblackwatch · 2 Apr 2018

Judging by a few pictures I have seen, 90046 has successfully made it to Glasgow QS - glad it was a bit more successful that last night's departure from there!

ScottDarg · 2 Apr 2018

theblackwatch said:
glad it was a bit more successful that last night's departure from there!

Same can't be said for the ECS it seems - posts elsewhere saying the 73 struggled up Cowlairs this morning, with the 90 seemingly pushing (pan up, driver in cab facing the coaches). Not sure how true that is at the moment.

If it is true, then I'd be surprised if they used Queen St again*. It seems like it's causing more hassle than it's worth and that it'd have been easier to run Glasgow Central - City Union - Bathgate - Edinburgh

*with the exception of tonights service, which is already booked out of Queen St

Waverleystu · 2 Apr 2018

Any photos of the 90 at Queen street??

marks87 · 2 Apr 2018

ScottDarg said:
Same can't be said for the ECS it seems - posts elsewhere saying the 73 struggled up Cowlairs this morning, with the 90 seemingly pushing (pan up, driver in cab facing the coaches). Not sure how true that is at the moment.

If that's true, then I'd be surprised if they used Queen St again*. It seems like it's causing more hassle than it's worth and that it'd have been easier to run Glasgow Central - City Union - Bathgate - Edinburgh

*with the exception of tonights service, which is already booked out of Queen St

I don't know if last night and this morning will put them off Queen Street entirely. In true management speak, "lessons will have been learned". Which basically seems to be "don't use single-headed 73s or 47s" up Cowlairs.

Let's see how tonight goes with electric traction up front. I'd expect things to go a lot smoother.

If the worst thing they have to do in future is give a shove from the rear when the ECS is taken away, that doesn't seem a massive problem. But even if it were, a 73 could do the in-service run to Queen Street, with the 92 on the rear for ECS.

Please Explain · 2 Apr 2018

Waverleystu said:
Any photos of the 90 at Queen street??

Oui!

Enjoy!!

theblackwatch · 2 Apr 2018

ScottDarg said:
Same can't be said for the ECS it seems - posts elsewhere saying the 73 struggled up Cowlairs this morning, with the 90 seemingly pushing (pan up, driver in cab facing the coaches). Not sure how true that is at the moment.

If it is true, then I'd be surprised if they used Queen St again*. It seems like it's causing more hassle than it's worth and that it'd have been easier to run Glasgow Central - City Union - Bathgate - Edinburgh

*with the exception of tonights service, which is already booked out of Queen St

Yes I think I spoke too soon there!

marks87 said:
I don't know if last night and this morning will put them off Queen Street entirely. In true management speak, "lessons will have been learned". Which basically seems to be "don't use single-headed 73s or 47s" up Cowlairs.

Class 47s regularly took that number of coaches out of Queen Street in the 80s, so that shouldn't, in theory, be an issue.

Waverleystu · 2 Apr 2018

Please Explain said:
Oui!

Enjoy!!

Thank you

Kite159 · 2 Apr 2018

Waverleystu said:
Any photos of the 90 at Queen street??

My rather poor effort

bonzawe · 2 Apr 2018

theblackwatch said:
Yes I think I spoke too soon there!

Class 47s regularly took that number of coaches out of Queen Street in the 80s, so that shouldn't, in theory, be an issue.

Is not a dead engine on the rear the equivalent of another two coaches.

Caledonian Sleeper discussion

Established Member

RailUK Forums

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Member

Established Member

Member

Attachments

Established Member

Member

Veteran Member

Attachments

Member