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Thameslink Services/Timetable from May 20th 2018

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NorthKent1989

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That was an option looked at an awful long time ago , and discounted. Good thing is that it could be revitalised - for what it is worth , now there is a "footprint" of Thameslink working in the SE area (when the service runs !) , a bit of service changing can be accommodated. At least the complete nonsense of sending 8 car 700's to the verdant , traffic less purlieus of Tattenham Corner have been booted firmly into the long grass...

It's a possibility, since Thameslink has undone its aim to avoid The SEML, perhaps a Thameslink service may do the line some good since they will be losing Cannon Street in 2022 London Blackfriars could be a replacement.
 
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frediculous

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Is there a reason why the Luton-Rainham services seem to be running roughly to time up to Gillingham, then most lose 5mins and become late?
 

talldave

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@SE_Railway are tweeting that 1st class on Thameslink services is declassified between Dartford and London. Is this the case? If so, where's "London" defined as? Surely it's going to be confusing to have one set of rules for the front carriage and another for the rear?
 

DaveN

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Normally the printed timetable would be the definitive source (but that's probably a bit tricky at the moment). On the MML side of things, there's generally no first class if the service serves anywhere other than West Hampstead between St Pancras and St Albans.
 

Pakenhamtrain

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AM9

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When the dust settles I'm sure it will be very useful indeed, it's almost like having a new tube line through the centre of London with all sorts of new opportunities.
That's the point of Thameslink. Since it opened in 1989, many have changed their travel arrangements so that they don't have the inconvenience of changing onto the tube. The current teething troubles will mostly be resolved soon enough and those on the routes that have recently been connected to the core will benefit from the improved connectivity, (especially onto Crossrail at Farringdon).
 

Failed Unit

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Still poor on Great Northern,

subsequent fast departures cancelled on the Cambridge - London King Cross route. Leaving Knebworth and Welwyn North a significant gap in service. Although I have no idea why they have decided to skip stop the 1144 Cambridge North - London Kings Cross service, when you consider that the 1127 Cambridge - London Kings Cross service was cancelled throughout. The Cambridge / WGC - London Kings cross was badly hit in the peak as well over past two days. But all GTRs view is these problems are unavoidable.... Only if you don't look after your drivers GTR.

Still very unreliable on services going through the core.
 

Failed Unit

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That's the point of Thameslink. Since it opened in 1989, many have changed their travel arrangements so that they don't have the inconvenience of changing onto the tube. The current teething troubles will mostly be resolved soon enough and those on the routes that have recently been connected to the core will benefit from the improved connectivity, (especially onto Crossrail at Farringdon).
Do you think GTR are capable of doing this, they haven't got a good track record?
 

Robin Edwards

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loads of people getting 'stuck' getting out of London on trains north to Cambridge & Peterborough and staff at FP getting a lot of unwarranted stick. I managed to get home eventually some time after 2am via Hertford North branch to Stevenage and then Hitchin before a train that Trainline said was cancelled was running to Peterborough around 1.30. Guy told me that they only had six people trained for working new routes with new units and most were rostered on early workings resulting in the late trains being cancelled. Not good for those of the 100K people turning out of the Olympic Stadium at 10.45 though, who had planned to get home.
 

bramling

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That's the point of Thameslink. Since it opened in 1989, many have changed their travel arrangements so that they don't have the inconvenience of changing onto the tube. The current teething troubles will mostly be resolved soon enough and those on the routes that have recently been connected to the core will benefit from the improved connectivity, (especially onto Crossrail at Farringdon).

... and they will also suffer from reduced reliability.

The teething troubles will reduce, however the service will still be less reliable than before.
 

Failed Unit

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loads of people getting 'stuck' getting out of London on trains north to Cambridge & Peterborough and staff at FP getting a lot of unwarranted stick. I managed to get home eventually some time after 2am via Hertford North branch to Stevenage and then Hitchin before a train that Trainline said was cancelled was running to Peterborough around 1.30. Guy told me that they only had six people trained for working new routes with new units and most were rostered on early workings resulting in the late trains being cancelled. Not good for those of the 100K people turning out of the Olympic Stadium at 10.45 though, who had planned to get home.

I must admit the meet the manager session is going to be interesting tomorrow. (Although I suspect they will cancel it considering how poor Great Northern are performing this week)

My 3 questions.
1. Why did you make changes to the proposed timetables without consultation (and why did you ignore passenger opinion during the consultation by hiding the responses of impact people in with the responses of people who were not)
2. Will WGC ever get a service into the core (expect them to repeat 2020 but will probe on is this a real commitment with a penalty or can it be forgotten)
3. Why is delay repay so difficult to claim, when your staff incorrectly reject it why must we start again from the beginning.
 

Robin Edwards

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I must admit the meet the manager session is going to be interesting tomorrow. (Although I suspect they will cancel it considering how poor Great Northern are performing this week)

My 3 questions.
1. Why did you make changes to the proposed timetables without consultation (and why did you ignore passenger opinion during the consultation by hiding the responses of impact people in with the responses of people who were not)
2. Will WGC ever get a service into the core (expect them to repeat 2020 but will probe on is this a real commitment with a penalty or can it be forgotten)
3. Why is delay repay so difficult to claim, when your staff incorrectly reject it why must we start again from the beginning.

I think that the thing that stuck in my mind last night is that the consequences of widespread cancellation of 'last trains home' on those left holding the fort at stations, is not supportive given the lack of information they seemed to be receiving and heightened security risk placed upon them from those, where a few may already be worse for drink and being told they're not getting home is not always going to result in the right outcome. Plenty of 'old' trains running (313s) was the message but they don't get people to outer suburbia.
 

DY444

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That's the point of Thameslink. Since it opened in 1989, many have changed their travel arrangements so that they don't have the inconvenience of changing onto the tube. The current teething troubles will mostly be resolved soon enough and those on the routes that have recently been connected to the core will benefit from the improved connectivity, (especially onto Crossrail at Farringdon).

<Pendantic>
Thameslink opened in 1988
</Pedantic>
 

NorthKent1989

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That's the point of Thameslink. Since it opened in 1989, many have changed their travel arrangements so that they don't have the inconvenience of changing onto the tube. The current teething troubles will mostly be resolved soon enough and those on the routes that have recently been connected to the core will benefit from the improved connectivity, (especially onto Crossrail at Farringdon).

That's true enough....but no one in Medway wanted it, much less a stopping service, our journey times into London have increased.
 

dlj83

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I can confirm that neither the front or back section on the class 700 from Rainham are declassified.

I got on at Rochester and was told that as I had a standard ticket I was sitting in the wrong section.

(I was sitting in the rear first class)
 

Downthelane

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Why have GN cancelled the 17.21 to Cambridge and the 17.51 Cambridge?

How are people supposed to get home?
 

Failed Unit

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Why have GN cancelled the 17.21 to Cambridge and the 17.51 Cambridge?

How are people supposed to get home?

Because they are inept.

It is actually worse that you state. 1706 and 1806 WGC also gone. 1608 Brighton - Cambridge gone (1742 from Finsbury Park). So no trains to Cambridge from Finsbury Park between 1701 & 1827.

Not sure if they will stop anything additionally but they just don’t seem to care. Charles Horton has already given a total contempt statement. “Unfortunate and unavoidable”. Basic timetable planning.

Hate to see what happens on the first infrastructure failure. The fact the cancellations are so high doesn’t show how fragile the whole thing is. Particularly at Welwyn North.
 

NorthKent1989

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I can confirm that neither the front or back section on the class 700 from Rainham are declassified.

I got on at Rochester and was told that as I had a standard ticket I was sitting in the wrong section.

(I was sitting in the rear first class)

So when this service was a semi fast outer suburban service, the first class was declassified, now that it's an all stops metro there is a first class???? Something is a bit backwards there
 

TrenHotel

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I gave the new service a whirl yesterday - took the 15.51 from West Hampstead Thameslink (1518 ex Luton), parked myself in first class, all very uneventful, hopped off at Charlton and the indicator on the platform was claiming the train was cancelled. Hmmm. But otherwise, all very nice, if a bit disorienting to travel back from north London so swiftly and easily... o_O

The Rainham-Luton train is a funny thing: I can only compare the experience of this Greenwich line passenger with being given a breadmaker for your birthday. You were happy buying your bread from the shops, then there's this new thing that you aren't sure you actually need but apparently it'll be really brilliant. And it seems to raise more questions than answers, such as "who is it for?", why does a "stops-at-most-stops-in-south-London" train suddenly go semi-fast in north London? Why not just a boring St Albans-Dartford stopper, and let the Medways have their faster train back?

But I'm sure when (if?) it settles down it'll be okay. Wish there was a regular Kentish Town call, that actually would be really handy.
 

talldave

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I can confirm that neither the front or back section on the class 700 from Rainham are declassified.

I got on at Rochester and was told that as I had a standard ticket I was sitting in the wrong section.

(I was sitting in the rear first class)
Who told you?

Thameslink have tweeted that the whole route is declassified. Which coincidentally agrees with RealTimeTrains.

As expected, another GTR f*** up.
 

danthekyle

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I can confirm that neither the front or back section on the class 700 from Rainham are declassified.

I got on at Rochester and was told that as I had a standard ticket I was sitting in the wrong section.

(I was sitting in the rear first class)

Thameslink's Twitter team remind people many times a day that the rear first class on all their services is declassified. In addition to this I have seen the digital screens on Luton-Rainham services say that this section is declassified. So I believe it's likely the member of staff was wrong.

The picture is quite confusing regarding the forward 1st class section. Thameslink have sent two contradictory tweets within an hour of each other today.

Regarding the Luton-Rainham service, they said:
First class is declassified throughout this service.
To me this implies it is declassified all the way from Luton to Rainham, including the core.

Then they later Tweeted in a separate conversation:
All rear first class carriages are declassified on all services. The front first class is in operation anywhere north of London or on services South that go through East Croydon.
To me this implies that the forward first class in in operation Luton - St Pancras, but not the core.

No idea what's going on!
 

mongoose

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Because they are inept.

It is actually worse that you state. 1706 and 1806 WGC also gone. 1608 Brighton - Cambridge gone (1742 from Finsbury Park). So no trains to Cambridge from Finsbury Park between 1701 & 1827.

Not sure if they will stop anything additionally but they just don’t seem to care. Charles Horton has already given a total contempt statement. “Unfortunate and unavoidable”. Basic timetable planning.

Hate to see what happens on the first infrastructure failure. The fact the cancellations are so high doesn’t show how fragile the whole thing is. Particularly at Welwyn North.
The Journey Planner says the 1806 is running.
 

Kanrakuq

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The 1554 Peterborough-Horsham has been sat at Finsbury Park for 20 minutes. Now the 1555 Horsham-Peterborough train has arrived and been sitting on the other side of the station for 10 minutes. Don't tell me the drivers are going to swap? Is that what it's come to?

(edit: it was)
 
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talldave

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Thameslink's Twitter team remind people many times a day that the rear first class on all their services is declassified. In addition to this I have seen the digital screens on Luton-Rainham services say that this section is declassified. So I believe it's likely the member of staff was wrong.

The picture is quite confusing regarding the forward 1st class section. Thameslink have sent two contradictory tweets within an hour of each other today.

Regarding the Luton-Rainham service, they said:

To me this implies it is declassified all the way from Luton to Rainham, including the core.

Then they later Tweeted in a separate conversation:

To me this implies that the forward first class in in operation Luton - St Pancras, but not the core.

No idea what's going on!
That sums them up precisely. They've got no idea. It's such a simple question to which there must be ONE answer.
 
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NorthKent1989

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I gave the new service a whirl yesterday - took the 15.51 from West Hampstead Thameslink (1518 ex Luton), parked myself in first class, all very uneventful, hopped off at Charlton and the indicator on the platform was claiming the train was cancelled. Hmmm. But otherwise, all very nice, if a bit disorienting to travel back from north London so swiftly and easily... o_O

The Rainham-Luton train is a funny thing: I can only compare the experience of this Greenwich line passenger with being given a breadmaker for your birthday. You were happy buying your bread from the shops, then there's this new thing that you aren't sure you actually need but apparently it'll be really brilliant. And it seems to raise more questions than answers, such as "who is it for?", why does a "stops-at-most-stops-in-south-London" train suddenly go semi-fast in north London? Why not just a boring St Albans-Dartford stopper, and let the Medways have their faster train back?

But I'm sure when (if?) it settles down it'll be okay. Wish there was a regular Kentish Town call, that actually would be really handy.

I'd be happy with this service starting at Dartford, but us in Medway (and a fair few in Woolwich and Abbey Wood who for decades have used the fast service) will never be okay with Thameslink replacing our fasts with stoppers, I pray for the day it's withdrawn from these parts.

Crossrail is what we are looking forward to :) cannot wait to see the purple line on the map!
 

danthekyle

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That sums them up precisely. They've got no idea. It's such a simple bloody question to which there must be ONE answer. I thought I was done with GTR's f***wits when I moved to Kent but how wrong I was.

The number of times Thameslink (and other TOCs) give out misleading information on Twitter is ridiculous. Only last week they told somebody London Terminals tickets are valid to Farringdon & City Thameslink if coming from the north. And this is a question they get asked 20 times a week - you'd think they'd know the answers by now!
 

talldave

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The number of times Thameslink (and other TOCs) give out misleading information on Twitter is ridiculous. Only last week they told somebody London Terminals tickets are valid to Farringdon & City Thameslink if coming from the north. And this is a question they get asked 20 times a week - you'd think they'd know the answers by now!
Don't worry, Southeastern's Twitter were telling people from the South that London Terminals tickets are valid to Blackfriars! Their manager stuck his nose in when I pointed out their incompetence but even he accepted my comment that no answer is better than the wrong answer.
 
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danthekyle

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Don't worry, Southeastern's Twitter were telling people from the South that London Terminals tickets are valid to Blackfriars! Their manager stuck his nose in when I pointed out their incompetence but even he accepted my comment that no answer is better than the wrong answer.

Do you mean St Pancras? London Terminals tickets are valid to Blackfriars from the south.

But yes, all of these finer details haven't been communicated to passengers before the TL launch in any way. Ticket validity and first class seating on the new services are important things that passengers should be told about through leaflets, posters etc. It could cost people a lot of money if they get it wrong.
 
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