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Why Does New Stock Promote Rail Surfing?

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whhistle

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Take the new Northern units:
DhaQKpUWsAAdMZX

https://twitter.com/0502gt/status/1015157297797058561?s=09
Photo of a new CAF unit.

The grey buffer area has a little ledge that people could stand on (admittedly not very well).
Why didn't CAF mould it into the headlight surround so it was straight and connected rather than making it look like two separate pieces?

Noticed this on some other new stock too.
 
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sprinterguy

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I would have thought that the sloped, smooth surface and lack of external grab rails or recesses to grip onto would act to discourage the practice. Certainly seems to have been designed with that aim in mind to my eyes. It's certainly a long way removed from the recessed or extruding footsteps and below windscreen grab rails that were provided as standard for operational convenience on BR ordered units from the seventies onwards, which don't seem to have encouraged train surfing as a popular practice despite the plethora of such units across Britain (Only on the Networker fleets in former NSE areas have steps been taken to remove these features).
 

Rail Blues

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The grey buffer area has a little ledge that people could stand on (admittedly not very well).

I realise that with 40 looming ever closer, I'm not the most nimble of specimens, but I cannot see how someone would be able to stand on what looks like a tiny plinth without hand grabs, doubly so when the train is in motion. Not an issue as far as I can make out.
 
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I would have thought that the sloped, smooth surface and lack of external grab rails or recesses to grip onto would act to discourage the practice. Certainly seems to have been designed with that aim in mind to my eyes. It's certainly a long way removed from the recessed or extruding footsteps and below windscreen grab rails that were provided as standard for operational convenience on BR ordered units from the seventies onwards, which don't seem to have encouraged train surfing as a popular practice despite the plethora of such units across Britain (Only on the Networker fleets in former NSE areas have steps been taken to remove these features).

the mk3 based MUs seem to be a far 'better' prospect for such things,
 

fgwrich

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I would have thought that the sloped, smooth surface and lack of external grab rails or recesses to grip onto would act to discourage the practice. Certainly seems to have been designed with that aim in mind to my eyes. It's certainly a long way removed from the recessed or extruding footsteps and below windscreen grab rails that were provided as standard for operational convenience on BR ordered units from the seventies onwards, which don't seem to have encouraged train surfing as a popular practice despite the plethora of such units across Britain (Only on the Networker fleets in former NSE areas have steps been taken to remove these features).

The recently returned GW overhauled Sprinters (Green 150s and 153s) have also had their front steps and handrails removed as well.
 

Rail Blues

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The whole premise of this thread is somewhat ott, they aren't 'promoting train surfing' given that it looks like a physical impossibility and the network has eminently more surfable trains running without any real problems, Northern and CAF haven't plastered the front with stickers saying 'Surf this train' or set up an Instagram account for people to upload pictures of them clinging on to the train.
 

Alfie1014

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That little ledge is almost certainly part of crash absorption requirements of the train. It’s there to protect the driver and passengers in the event of an accident and not some design statement.
 

61653 HTAFC

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IIRC the 376s were specifically designed to prevent "surfing" which was a particular problem in the areas of SE London where they operate.

Generally though, if we have to design trains in a way to prevent such activity, we've already lost the battle against the moron hordes!
 

sprinterguy

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That little ledge is almost certainly part of crash absorption requirements of the train. It’s there to protect the driver and passengers in the event of an accident and not some design statement.
They are indeed intended for impact absorption, but there's myriad different ways to hide them beneath the external panelling if so desired - not that I think that there's any issue with the design in this case.
 

Darandio

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Can people train surf on this and other stock? Yes, but they can do so on plenty of old stock as well. Is the new stock promoting train surfing? Of course not. Strange thread title.
 

Roast Veg

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The ledges on the current generation of stock (visible on 345s and 700s as well quite prominently) is definitely there for crash safety regulations.
 

stepho

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Just enough to lure the idiots on, not enough to keep them there. Perfect.
 

ash39

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If I ever had to surf a train, perhaps in an apocalypse type scenario, I'd choose a 321 all day long.
 

61653 HTAFC

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If I ever had to surf a train, perhaps in an apocalypse type scenario, I'd choose a 321 all day long.
You think there'd still be juice in the wires after the apocalypse? 158 hands down! :lol:

EDIT: meant 158, not 155 as originally posted. :oops:
 
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goblinuser

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Standing on a 30 degree piece of plastic, in the North so it will be soaking wet, with nothing to hold onto? I don't see how they are encouraging train surfing?
 

Girner

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Looking at that picture, if you could train surf on that ledge you would be either very nimble, very sticky or very stupid.
 

whhistle

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The whole premise of this thread is somewhat ott, they aren't 'promoting train surfing' given that it looks like a physical impossibility.
You could easily stand on the grey section and hold on to the wiper...

Perhaps the wording wasn't quite that great but maybe I should put it another way:

Why doesn't the grey section mould with the sides of the windscreen to give a nicer, more sleek look?
Yes, I understand nobody here is going to know the actual answer but perhaps someone may give some insight.
 

Domh245

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You could easily stand on the grey section and hold on to the wiper...

Perhaps the wording wasn't quite that great but maybe I should put it another way:

Why doesn't the grey section mould with the sides of the windscreen to give a nicer, more sleek look?
Yes, I understand nobody here is going to know the actual answer but perhaps someone may give some insight.

I don't think you'd have much luck clinging on to the wiper, pulling on it will make it come away from the windscreen.

As for why they've got that little inset bit and it doesn't continue all the way down, you'll have to ask the CAF and Northern design teams, there is no particular reason why they couldn't integrate it more nicely.
 

cjmillsnun

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Looking at that picture, if you could train surf on that ledge you would be either very nimble, very sticky or very stupid.

If you were train surfing on any train you are the last one for sure.
 
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