Triva - Station with the most number of "first stations" served by it.

mmh · 26 Dec 2018

Sorry, but this nonsense that passing through a station isn't passing through it if it's on track without a platform is, sorry!, nonsense.

How else would you describe these locations? The railway doesn't make this bizarre differentiation.

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johnnychips · 26 Dec 2018

^ Hear, hear!

DynamicSpirit · 26 Dec 2018

mmh said:
Sorry, but this nonsense that passing through a station isn't passing through it if it's on track without a platform is, sorry!, nonsense.

How else would you describe these locations? The railway doesn't make this bizarre differentiation.

That's why, in my posts, I haven't been using 'is there a platform on the fast lines' as a criteria. I've been using 'Do the fast lines run inside what you would reasonably consider to be the station boundary'. There can be a bit of a judgement call there about where the station boundary is, but I'm pretty sure that criteria isn't 'nonsense'.

Of course, really, this whole thread is a bit of meaningless fun, so perhaps the whole thread is nonsense, but... who cares

bionic · 27 Dec 2018

mmh said:
Sorry, but this nonsense that passing through a station isn't passing through it if it's on track without a platform is, sorry!, nonsense.

How else would you describe these locations? The railway doesn't make this bizarre differentiation.

I wouldn't have said trains passing next to (not through) a station on fast lines whereby it's physically impossible to call there if booked a certain way is "nonsense". If you can't physically stop at a station then I fail to see how it can be the first one. It's not like you could stop and let punters on and off. You couldn't.

Is South Hampstead on the DC lines the first station after Euston for fast line Pendolinos? Do fast trains on the WCML "pass through" DC line stations like South Kenton and Kensal Green? Using the criteria that New Cross IS the first station for trains via the fast lines, Tanners Hill and Ladywell Loop even though there is no physical track connection and no available platform faces then surely they must be.

We could take this "nonsense" even further and say that Shadwell and Royal Oak are first stations after Fenchurch Street and Paddington because a mainline train could just as easily call at those places as a train off the Tanners Hill flydown could call at New Cross: eg they couldn't!

Going back to my original question. I agree that New Street also has ten. I also agree that this is just a bit of fun and that some people might be taking it a bit too seriously! ;D

Harshil · 27 Dec 2018

I'm curious what station has the most number of first destinations served on a typical day on a service?

E.g. From Euston you get:
South Hampstead for Overground
Harrow and Wealdstone
Watford Junction
Milton Keynes Central

Perhaps many more such as Bushey, Wembley Central or even as far as Crewe for Scotland services.

What station would have the most? Guessing it would be somewhere like New Street but perhaps junction stations like Crewe have so many different long distance services with random stopping patterns that it may also be up there.

eastwestdivide · 27 Dec 2018

tommy2215 said:
Chesterfield has 6 - Belper, Alfreton, Dronfield, and if you go via the old road there's also Woodhouse, Rotherham Central and Swinton.

Don't think you can get to Rotherham Central from Chesterfield without passing through another station. The Old Road goes via the closed Rotherham Masboro station to reach Swinton. Also, I don't think there are any scheduled services on the Rotherham end of the Old Road anyway, ruling out Swinton except for very rare diversions.

xotGD · 27 Dec 2018

So are we saying that Northallerton is a first station from both Durham (via Darlington avoider) and York (via fast lines through Thirsk)?

Add from Doncaster and various other places via York avoider and Thirsk fast lines!

Dr Strider · 28 Dec 2018

driver_m said:
As has already been said earlier. New St has 10 as well and doesn't need to do any fast slow line trickery.

Just spotted that from New Street you can also have Walsall, via the Sutton Park line, so that makes 11, I guess.

More tenuously, if we're playing the "lines without platforms" game, could you also have the line from Coleshill Parkway, as it does not have a platform at Water Orton?

Dr Strider

Andyjs247 · 28 Dec 2018

Dr Strider said:
I reckon Birmingham New Street has another two "first stations":

Perry Barr (via Soho South and Perry Barr South junctions)
Bournville (via Camp Hill and Lifford Curve)

The Perry Barr route has at least one passenger service per day (possibly only in one direction).
New Street to New Street (via Lifford and Bournville) is a fairly common ECS working I think.

I reckon that gives New Street a total of ten "first stations".

Dr Strider

I have done Lifford Curve in passenger service en route to Norwich which would have been late 80s. The first station was Five Ways however.

If you’re including Bournville then you could also argue a case for including Walsall - if heading through Sutton Park instead of continuing to Water Orton. There’s no passenger service and no ECS though. The only time I have done Sutton Park was an excursion to York in 1975 from Four Oaks via Walsall.

D365 · 30 Dec 2018

It won't be the most, but Peterborough has a fair few:

Grantham
Huntingdon
Spalding
Stamford
Whittlesea
Orton Mere?

VT 390 · 30 Dec 2018

507021 said:
If I've done this right, Lime Street currently has six.

Liverpool South Parkway. (EMT/LNWR/Northern)
Lea Green. (TPE)
Newton-le-Willows. (TPE)
Edge Hill. (Northern)
Huyton. (Northern)
Runcorn. (Virgin)

Future "first stations" will be St Helens Central (TPE) and Manchester Victoria and Warrington Central (both Northern Connect).

They will not be first stations as the services will have to pass through Edge Hill on both routes and then many other local stations.

Parallel · 3 Jan 2019

VT 390 said:
They will not be first stations as the services will have to pass through Edge Hill on both routes and then many other local stations.

Indeed, though you could get away with having Liverpool Central and Moorfields from Merseyrail!

racyrich · 5 Jan 2019

Stratford I think has 5

Maryland
Lea Bridge
Hackney Wick
Liv St
Limehouse
It will soon also have Whitechapel

At one time it would have had
Maryland
Leytonstone
Lea Bridge
Hackney Wick
Bethnal Green
Liv St
Limehouse
Stratford Market
(stations vary according to how far back you go)

If you included LUL and DLR then the current 5 (soon 6) increases with
West Ham
Pudding Mill Lane
Stratford High St
Stratford Intl
Leyton
Mile End

driver_m · 5 Jan 2019

Parallel said:
Indeed, though you could get away with having Liverpool Central and Moorfields from Merseyrail!

One way only. Can't get to Moorfields from Lime St.

py_megapixel · 13 Jan 2019

Manchester Piccadilly gets to 9:
Levenshulme (Northern)
Heaton Chapel (Northern)
Stockport (XC/Virgin/TfW)
Manchester Airport (TPE)
Manchester Oxford Road (TPE/EMT/Northern)
Ardwick (Northern)
Ashburys (Northern)
Stalybridge (TPE)

alistairlees · 13 Jan 2019

py_megapixel said:
Manchester Piccadilly gets to 9:
Levenshulme (Northern)
Heaton Chapel (Northern)
Stockport (XC/Virgin/TfW)
Manchester Airport (TPE)
Manchester Oxford Road (TPE/EMT/Northern)
Ardwick (Northern)
Ashburys (Northern)
Stalybridge (TPE)

Not if you read the OP's post. They are referring to stations that are served on different routes, not by different TOCs, as you can see from their examples.

Strathclyder · 14 Jan 2019

Mag_seven said:
There are numerous first stations served by Glasgow Central (Cambuslang, Pollokshields East, Crossmyloof, Pollokshields West, Dumbreck, Cardonald, Argyle St, Anderston).

Up until the Whifflet Line was electrified and intergrated into the Argyle Line network, Glasgow Central had 9 'first stations'; Carmyle being the station in question. In the event of engineering works & diversions however, a direct Central-Carmyle service avoiding the Low Level has operated.

fairysdad · 15 Jan 2019

If we're doing the whole 'no platforms' thing, then Wimbledon has six, seven, or eight depending on if you count London Underground and/or Tramlink:

Raynes Park
New Malden/Surbiton
Earlsfield
Clapham Junction
Wimbledon Chase
Haydons Road
Wimbledon Park (London Underground - though arguably this could still count as SWT do run the odd regular service up that line)
Dundonald Road (Tramlink)

NewClee153 · 15 Jan 2019

If we’re only counting lines, then my local station, Smethwick Galton Bridge only has 4:

Smethwick Rolfe Street
Sandwell and Dudley
The Hawthorns
Langley Green

However, if we’re not, there’s:

Langley Green
Rowley Regis
Birmingham Snow Hill
The Hawthorns
Sandwell & Dudley
Coseley
Wolverhampton
Smethwick Rolfe Street
Birmingham New Street

charlesn132 · 16 Jan 2019

fairysdad said:
If we're doing the whole 'no platforms' thing, then Wimbledon has six, seven, or eight depending on if you count London Underground and/or Tramlink:

Raynes Park

New Malden/Surbiton

Earlsfield

Clapham Junction

Wimbledon Chase

Haydons Road

Wimbledon Park (London Underground - though arguably this could still count as SWT do run the odd regular service up that line)

Dundonald Road (Tramlink)

I would assume that Tramlink's Dundonald Road is excluded:

Mag_seven said:
I am including low level platforms but excluding LUL, Metros, Trams etc.

but if Wimbledon Park is excluded as a station, then you could swap it with Wandsworth Town instead?

Triva - Station with the most number of "first stations" served by it.

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