It’s doesnt say that......
RMT would have to consult ASLEF before making such an argeement or guarantee to SWR
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SWR: Guards/RMT Industrial Action. Next strike dates: 30/31 August, 1/2 September 2019
- Thread starter theironroad
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It’s doesnt say that......
RMT would have to consult ASLEF before making such an argeement or guarantee to SWR
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So essentially everyone wins. RMT can now calm down since there will be a second member of staff on each train and SWR negotiate to allow driver release of the door to speed up dwell times (potentially?) and with the whole ''risk assessment" I wouldn't be surprised if SWR attempted to let drivers close the doors too at quite a few stations without a dispatch team or the guard's help.
If guards on suburban routes become commercial and check tickets then SWR may stop hiring third party agencies to check tickets who often don't display their lanyard to many peoples annoyance from the tweets I often see about it.
Genuine question, it seems that the TOC just has to give in to the union, what circiumstance would the TOC win, in this case could SWR have ignored the union and trained drivers from other unions on DOO?
dk1
Veteran Member
Certainly seems a breakthrough & an end hopefully in sight to what has been a stubourn DfT led approach to train manning at many TOCs. Whatever has this unnecessary & prolonged stake out cost the rail industry?
Monty
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Won't be quite as simple as that, the method of dispatch as well as operation will still need to be agreed. If there is a change in operation the most you'll probably see now is driver open and guard close. But you'll still need to get Aslef on board and I'll doubt the company will want to cough up much for the drivers to release doors on arrival. So you could have a scenario where nothing changes at all. We will have to wait and see.
Goldfish62
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Both unions have agreed to driver door release elsewhere so I see no reason why they wouldn't on SWR. On GA and Merseyrail they appear to have also agreed to driver close as well.
SWR network isn’t equipped for DOO.
Goldfish62
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I don't understand this comment at all.
swt_passenger
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It’ll be completely on the trains, like any brand new stock.
I think the point that’s being made is that none/very of the SWR stations have been modified to meet the DOO standards in terms of lights and similar stuff. That said I can’t see it being a huge job to change the station lighting to bright LED heads. Didn’t take them long to do it on the southern served SWR operated stations.
swt_passenger
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Yes, there is that aspect, but it’s sort of background work isn’t it rather than major new technology as such.
Matt Taylor
Established Member
DOO equipment is not required for 'driver open guard close', as it stands there is not even a requirement for guards to step on the platform before releasing the doors.
So three years of near continuous action finally is brought to and end. The agreements reached all seem to concede door operation provided the guard is guaranteed and safety critical
What an absurd waste of money. Surely these agreements could have been reached months ago. Saying that not sure at what point the union were ready to accept loss of door operation under normal circumstances .. Greater Anglia I think
I am sure there were a few on here who assumed they'd go on indefinitely with the union defeated. Quite a turn around
It's great news as staff morale will be much improved and the railway can win back passengers
Given the undeniable global warming emergency public transport should be leading the way
What an absurd waste of money. Surely these agreements could have been reached months ago. Saying that not sure at what point the union were ready to accept loss of door operation under normal circumstances .. Greater Anglia I think
I am sure there were a few on here who assumed they'd go on indefinitely with the union defeated. Quite a turn around
It's great news as staff morale will be much improved and the railway can win back passengers
Given the undeniable global warming emergency public transport should be leading the way
Monty
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No where in the statement released does it even hint that door operation will be conceded. People are reading far too much into it, the framework says that method of operation and dispatch has to be agreed by both parties. We will have to wait and see for more infomation.
nuts & bolts
Member
As Monty states there is a long way to go.
Yrsterday’s statement from the RMT indicates a framework is in place to go forward.
As per both the RMT & SWR previously jointly stated “nothing is agreed until everything is agreed”.
So the strike is currently suspended.
Let’s await a response from the train operating company!
DarloRich
Veteran Member
Same as Northern: Strike suspended to allow more talks on how to create an agreeable operating process. Still lots to sort out!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Good stuff. I thought Northern would influence this one by essentially taking "no second person" DOO pretty much permanently off the table.
Monty
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It's my suspicion that external politics has transcended this dispute (all TOCs not just SWR). With the ever increasing uncertainty surrounding our exit from the EU I think the DfT have instructed to the TOCs to settle as quickly and quietly as possible to ensure that the rail network runs as smoothly as it can over the next few months.
cjp
Member
If a driver has platformed their train correctly why would they need extra money to simply press a button or two to open the doors so as to end what is sometimes an extended wait before the door open buttons are activated?
Keep a guard for closing and dispatch but on many local trains once the doors are closed there is even now no way the guard can monitor the platform (no drop lights).
Have all guards trained on revenue / ticket examination like Scotrail.
Keep a guard for closing and dispatch but on many local trains once the doors are closed there is even now no way the guard can monitor the platform (no drop lights).
Have all guards trained on revenue / ticket examination like Scotrail.
An inevitable consequence of the industry now giving an impression of potential total capitulation to hardline militant organisations like the RMT in its current form. I’m sure they’ll be more on the horizon, perhaps even an attempt to re ignite the southern dispute .
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Does that still work? I thought the railway worked to the rulebook all the time now anyway, at least in safety matters.
Completely incorrect. This issue has nothing to do with the DOO dispute and any ‘victory’ scored. It’s to do with goalposts being moved. It would be inappropriate for me to comment further. If someone wants to copy and paste the statement by the regional executive that is up to them.
nuts & bolts
Member
There are times when "Degraded Working" occurs!
theironroad
Established Member
As I'm sure you know 'degraded working' are scenarios fully covered by the rule book and just mean implementation of procedures when the normal working cannot operate, ie signalling problems.
I’m certain the poster is aware of the official title of degraded working, hence the use of quote marks to state that occasionally standards slip but not to the level where anyone could come to harm.
theironroad
Established Member
My understanding is that degraded working isnt about standards slipping but implementation of things like temporary block or emergency special working which are all fully safe but reduce capacity.
nuts & bolts
Member
Providing that a risk assessment has taken place, you are correct.
nuts & bolts
Member
Degraded Working (for Guards) examples are
- Talking past Signal
- On (train) board faults
- Working in reduced visability
- Platform Lifts out of order
- Ticket office and TVM's not operating to retail standards
- Platform train interface (dispatcher availabilty)
- Station lighting
- Icy platforms
Ok thanks for explaining that, Sounds like something that can probably be solved without going into dispute then .
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