Annoying jargon in railway announcements

43096 · 26 Mar 2019

PHILIPE said:
What bugs me is the fact that "passengers" was changed to "customers" just for the sake of it and unnecessary PR

No, use of “customer” reflects that they are paying to receive a service. “Passenger” does not - they are just being carried.

If using “customer” helps drive home the message that the people who use the service are paying the wages of the staff, rather than being an inconvenience, then all the better. There is a substantial minority of railway staff who really need to get this.

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AndrewE · 26 Mar 2019

js1000 said:
"Alight" - find it slightly archaic. Personally don't understand what is wrong with disembark1962
"See it, say it, sorted" - as others have said though maybe the fact I remember it suggests it serves its purpose

I also like "Alight" (one word, 2 syllables, explicit, and doesn't pretend that the train is a plane) and find that "See it, say it, sorted" grates.

Deafdoggie said:
"All passengers should get off here" as other connotations with the youth of today!

Like "getting off at Edge Hill" has apparently had for generations! At junior school in 1962 we were forbidden to use "get" or "got" as there was almost invariably a single word that conveyed the meaning.

Bletchleyite said:
In railway-speak change means leave the train, for some reason, even if there is no requirement to take any other form of transport to get to the place concerned.

No it doesn't, it means "get off here for onward travel (by rail or another mode of transport) to..." See "Alight" above!

EM2 said:
Not used in announcements, but I wonder why the railway is so used to using 'vice'? I don't recall it being used in this context anywhere else.

Discussed on another thread recently, (must have been, as I can't see it up-thread.) Latin, apparently, but widely used in Victorian times and helped to survive by becoming railway telegraph code.

telstarbox · 26 Mar 2019

choochoochoo said:
I tend to use London Moorgate in PAs at stations to help let passengers on board who aren't confident/familiar travelling on trains know the train's travelling in the direction towards London.

Might sound patronising, but when you get passengers who approach you at the 'dead end' at Moorgate and ask you which end is the front of the train you can understand why.

Once 717s are in, I won't have to worry as much about the destination PAs.

I think Moorgate is the most obscure of London terminals - far less well known than say Paddington or Euston - so the confirmation is useful.

urbophile · 26 Mar 2019

Dr_Paul said:
In that case, 'alight' would be a more suitable term than 'change'.

As it is, I find 'alight' to be a rather pleasing, somewhat archaic-sounding word, pretty much exclusively used in respect of railway carriages and buses, and I wouldn't be surprised to find it in the modern bus and railway companies' lexicon of obsolete terms.

"Alight", as well as being archaic, must be confusing to many people whose first language is not English. I would imagine most people would think it was a warning against spontaneous combustion.

Rick1984 · 27 Mar 2019

Great Northern class 387 have a horrible announcement "welcome aboard this *pause* service to..." Think the pause must be where they removed Southern or Thameslink. Sounds awful

Strat-tastic · 27 Mar 2019

Rick1984 said:
Great Northern class 387 have a horrible announcement "welcome aboard this *pause* service to..." Think the pause must be where they removed Southern or Thameslink. Sounds awful

Yes, during the pause I imagine a deleted expletive and a :rolleyes:

from the lady speaking.
:lol:

whhistle · 27 Mar 2019

Deafdoggie said:
Yes, so there is a difference.

But they essentially carry out the same job, no?
The only "significant" difference I can see is a TM instructs the driver to close the doors. A SC does it themselves.

But hey, why call people doing the same job the same thing eh?

I believe "Train Manager" was a new term when the Voyagers came in (might be wrong there though). This was around the same time a lot of job titles changed to make them sound more appealing:
Wet leisure assistant – Lifeguard
Modality manager – Nurse
Waste management and disposal technician – Bin man
Information adviser – Librarian
Direct debit and membership and professional development stock and credit administrator – Customer services administrator.
Family protection consultant – Insurance telesales worker
Investment development and research analyst – Technical helpdesk worker
Worldwide marine asset financial analyst – Accountant
Debt management officer / Field force agent – Tax collector
Coordinator of interpretive teaching – Museum tour guide

43096 · 27 Mar 2019

whhistle said:
But they essentially carry out the same job, no?
The only "significant" difference I can see is a TM instructs the driver to close the doors. A SC does it themselves.

But hey, why call people doing the same job the same thing eh?

I believe "Train Manager" was a new term when the Voyagers came in (might be wrong there though). This was around the same time a lot of job titles changed to make them sound more appealing:
Wet leisure assistant – Lifeguard
Modality manager – Nurse
Waste management and disposal technician – Bin man
Information adviser – Librarian
Direct debit and membership and professional development stock and credit administrator – Customer services administrator.
Family protection consultant – Insurance telesales worker
Investment development and research analyst – Technical helpdesk worker
Worldwide marine asset financial analyst – Accountant
Debt management officer / Field force agent – Tax collector
Coordinator of interpretive teaching – Museum tour guide

Not forgetting “Train presentation team”. That’ll be the cleaners, then.

Deafdoggie · 27 Mar 2019

whhistle said:
But they essentially carry out the same job, no?
The only "significant" difference I can see is a TM instructs the driver to close the doors. A SC does it themselves.

But hey, why call people doing the same job the same thing eh?

I believe "Train Manager" was a new term when the Voyagers came in (might be wrong there though). This was around the same time a lot of job titles changed to make them sound more appealing:

BR introduced the term "Senior Conductor" and "Train Manager". They also had "Conductor Guard" as a job, but I don't think anyone ever understood what that was! Whilst broadly all doing the same job, there are differences to grade and pay. It isn't all about the doors, not all TMs do not do doors.

PR1Berske · 27 Mar 2019

whhistle said:
But they essentially carry out the same job, no?
The only "significant" difference I can see is a TM instructs the driver to close the doors. A SC does it themselves.

But hey, why call people doing the same job the same thing eh?

I believe "Train Manager" was a new term when the Voyagers came in (might be wrong there though). This was around the same time a lot of job titles changed to make them sound more appealing:
Wet leisure assistant – Lifeguard
Modality manager – Nurse
Waste management and disposal technician – Bin man
Information adviser – Librarian
Direct debit and membership and professional development stock and credit administrator – Customer services administrator.
Family protection consultant – Insurance telesales worker
Investment development and research analyst – Technical helpdesk worker
Worldwide marine asset financial analyst – Accountant
Debt management officer / Field force agent – Tax collector
Coordinator of interpretive teaching – Museum tour guide

I put it to you quite politely that not one of those job titles is actually true.

stut · 27 Mar 2019

Strat-tastic said:
Yes, during the pause I imagine a deleted expletive and a from the lady speaking.

I always imagine the announcer doing air quotes around "service".

CaptainHaddock · 27 Mar 2019

And while we're in full pedant mode, am I the only person who gets annoyed with the announcement "We are now approaching Stockport" (or wherever) shortly before the train arrives at said station? My inner pedant wants to yell "Yes, I know, we've been approaching Stockport ever since we set off!"

Strat-tastic · 27 Mar 2019

stut said:
I always imagine the announcer doing air quotes around "service".

It's the sneering way she pronounces "service". Service? Is that what you call it?

mrcheek · 27 Mar 2019

whhistle said:
But they essentially carry out the same job, no?
The only "significant" difference I can see is a TM instructs the driver to close the doors. A SC does it themselves.

But hey, why call people doing the same job the same thing eh?

I believe "Train Manager" was a new term when the Voyagers came in (might be wrong there though). This was around the same time a lot of job titles changed to make them sound more appealing:
Wet leisure assistant – Lifeguard
Modality manager – Nurse
Waste management and disposal technician – Bin man
Information adviser – Librarian
Direct debit and membership and professional development stock and credit administrator – Customer services administrator.
Family protection consultant – Insurance telesales worker
Investment development and research analyst – Technical helpdesk worker
Worldwide marine asset financial analyst – Accountant
Debt management officer / Field force agent – Tax collector
Coordinator of interpretive teaching – Museum tour guide

You missed the very best one, which was officially introduced in the 1980s, the "School Meal Supervisory Assistant"

duffield · 27 Mar 2019

CaptainHaddock said:
And while we're in full pedant mode, am I the only person who gets annoyed with the announcement "We are now approaching Stockport" (or wherever) shortly before the train arrives at said station? My inner pedant wants to yell "Yes, I know, we've been approaching Stockport ever since we set off!"

If we're going full pedant, then depending of the geography of the line, reversals en-route etc. for parts of the journey you might be going away from, rather than approaching Stockport at least in terms of straight-line distance...

swt_passenger · 27 Mar 2019

David Emmott said:
"Alight", as well as being archaic, must be confusing to many people whose first language is not English. I would imagine most people would think it was a warning against spontaneous combustion.

Alight is archaic? Really?

urbophile · 27 Mar 2019

swt_passenger said:
Alight is archaic? Really?

Well it's certainly not modern conversational English. I know 'get off' can be misinterpreted (seriously though, allowing for context?), but 'leave the train' is unambiguous.

I always think of Betjeman: 'Gaily into Ruislip Gardens/ Runs the red electric train,/ With a thousand Ta's and Pardon's/ Daintily alights Elaine.' The first word of the poem is a reminder of how quickly language becomes dated.

Dr Hoo · 27 Mar 2019

Getting back to the 'c-word', I was fascinated to see it in the January 1965 Western Region timetable. [For the benefit of younger forum members, this was a seminal publication during the modernising frenzy of the Beeching era and launch of the 24-hour clock and a new timetable format that largely survives in the 'GBTT' to this day. It was published over the name of his dynamic lieutenant, Gerry Fiennes, then Western General Manager.]

The editorial page (yes, there was one) had all sorts of gushy comments:
"...the rate of improvement and modernisation has exceeded expectation, and we consider it sensible to reflect these changes in a new issue for the greater convenience of our customers."
"...re-cast of the London suburban services... with the aim of demonstrating... to the point of complete customer satisfaction."
"...for the convenience of businessmen...(sic)"
"Holidaymakers will be glad to see..."

Now I know that the 'old guard' were suspicious of such language way back then and this push-back was a feature throughout my 40+ year career in the industry from 1973 but it really isn't new.

37047 · 27 Mar 2019

stut said:
I always imagine the announcer doing air quotes around "service".

You're not alone in that!

Strat-tastic said:
It's the sneering way she pronounces "service". Service? Is that what you call it?

Indeed. The sneering tone of voice is frequently very apt for my commute.

whhistle · 28 Mar 2019

PR1Berske said:
I put it to you quite politely that not one of those job titles is actually true.

*Yawn*
I mean... most people call it an example.
But seriously, unless you know ALL places those job titles could apply, I don't think you can say that.
I would also suggest that somewhere, there will be fluffed up job titles. The majority of those containing the word "manager" are along those lines.

David M · 28 Mar 2019

Apart from the seemingly incessant announcements on the class 385 units, my current pet hate in Scotland is at Edinburgh Waverley (I assume it applies to all stations served by LNER though).
"The next service to depart from platform 5 is the 1307 London and North Eastern Railway service to London Kings Cross".
This takes for ever and my head screams JUST SAY LNER!

Pakenhamtrain · 28 Mar 2019

David M said:
Apart from the seemingly incessant announcements on the class 385 units, my current pet hate in Scotland is at Edinburgh Waverley (I assume it applies to all stations served by LNER though).
"The next service to depart from platform 5 is the 1307 London and North Eastern Railway service to London Kings Cross".
This takes for ever and my head screams JUST SAY LNER!

Or just operate the whole network under one brand name. Like our buses down here. Doesn't matter if its Ventura, CDC or Transdev. Every bus in the exact same orange and white livery.

Bletchleyite · 28 Mar 2019

Pakenhamtrain said:
Or just operate the whole network under one brand name. Like our buses down here. Doesn't matter if its Ventura, CDC or Transdev. Every bus in the exact same orange and white livery.

I don't know, "it's that red one over there" does have value.

EM2 · 28 Mar 2019

PR1Berske said:
I put it to you quite politely that not one of those job titles is actually true.

Don't bank on it. I almost applied for a job as a Traffic Management Supervisor until I read that it meant operating the Stop/Go board at roadworks!

ATW Alex 101 · 29 Mar 2019

I heard an announcement at Crewe the last time I was there where the automated announcement was referring to a buffet car with "delicious hot and cold snacks and refreshments"... really?

superalbs · 29 Mar 2019

ATW Alex 101 said:
I heard an announcement at Crewe the last time I was there where the automated announcement was referring to a buffet car with "delicious hot and cold snacks and refreshments"... really?

Which word don't you understand?

GrimShady · 29 Mar 2019

Automated apologies really piss me off. They can't even be bothered to apologise in person rendering it totally condescending.

GrimShady · 29 Mar 2019

Bletchleyite said:
A railway passenger/customer fits both definitions.

TBH I don't overly mind which they use if they sort out the service. What I don't like, though, is excessive informality. I'm not the guard (or whoever)'s mate, I'm their customer.

But I think I may be a generation behind on this. I get particularly annoyed with sales calls which call me by my first name, but I bet younger people don't.

And I also find a bit of olde-worlde charm in some railway-isms (though LNR's "this train has N carriages" is a maybe a *bit* much), so as long as they're not confusing...

Agreed on the excessive familiarity with sales calls and even calls to banks, ISP etc. Starbucks....well lol let's not even get started on "I need your name for the cup" scenarios.

LowLevel · 30 Mar 2019

Deafdoggie said:
BR introduced the term "Senior Conductor" and "Train Manager". They also had "Conductor Guard" as a job, but I don't think anyone ever understood what that was! Whilst broadly all doing the same job, there are differences to grade and pay. It isn't all about the doors, not all TMs do not do doors.

A conductor guard is a guard that takes fares. On the British network it's just common practice for a conductor to be a guard as well. They don't have to be. Apart from Paytrains guards didn't really deal with revenue until the late 80s.

If anything it's the best description for the job.

I just answer to anything, it's easier. Except when somebody insists there must be 'a manager' for them to talk to when they don't like my decisions. Getting them to understand that to all intents and purposes we don't bother with a manager and the guard in a uniform is quite literally the person in charge and there's no other wind bag to be wheeled out can be difficult.

I was asked the other week for a manager. I returned that I am it. I was then told that I must have someone in charge of me in an office and that they wanted to speak to them. They weren't impressed when I asked if they wanted to discuss my sickness record or how much annual leave I have left as they certainly aren't qualified to do my job!

atraindriver · 31 Mar 2019

Annoying jargon in railway announcements

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