Saturday, May 18. See the HST diagrams thread for the latest
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/remaining-gwr-hst-diagrams.164465/page-32
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/remaining-gwr-hst-diagrams.164465/page-32
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GWR Class 800
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Thatcham Xing
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Perhaps because that is about the only area where they are operating regularly now?
Thanks Jimm.
Can you provide any other updates on the status of 800001/2?
SWRtrain_fan
Member
Do all class 800s now have the same seat covers as the 802s?
TT-ONR-NRN
Established Member
I went on an 800/0 last Saturday with plain seat covers.
Melancholia
Member
Not all yet, there are some still with the original grey seat covers. Replacement is in progress, however it's very slow it seems.
Three firsts today. A journey on a short HST set from Cardiff to Bristol TM, followed by a ride on a XC Voyager From Temple Meads to Parkway and an 800 from Parkway back to Cardiff. Best by far was the HST for comfort, quietness and acceleration. I had never been on a Voyager before but still no better than an HST. The 800 journey was diabolical and quite honestly so soon after the HST was a pile of s**t by comparison.
It arrived at Parkway already on diesel so I don't know how quiet they are from the outside on electric. I joined coach 3 to begin with in a 2 x 5 car set. The seats were the hardest on any new train I have experienced but were comfortable enough for the journey to Cardiff, but the ride was harsh and the rattles from the panels and end doors and noise from air conditioning on top of what I thought was engine noise and vibration was so intrusive that I moved into coach 2 thinking I was in a motored coach. Coach 2 was no different and I was glad I was going no further than Cardiff.
With this and the filthy exterior, I was not impressed. In fact I was depressed knowing that they are coming to the ECML.
It arrived at Parkway already on diesel so I don't know how quiet they are from the outside on electric. I joined coach 3 to begin with in a 2 x 5 car set. The seats were the hardest on any new train I have experienced but were comfortable enough for the journey to Cardiff, but the ride was harsh and the rattles from the panels and end doors and noise from air conditioning on top of what I thought was engine noise and vibration was so intrusive that I moved into coach 2 thinking I was in a motored coach. Coach 2 was no different and I was glad I was going no further than Cardiff.
With this and the filthy exterior, I was not impressed. In fact I was depressed knowing that they are coming to the ECML.
samuelmorris
Established Member
On 5-car sets both 2 & 3 are motored coachers, only the driving vehicles are unpowered. I found the engine noise quite subjective - if you sit at the opposite end of the vehicle to the end the engine is, you can barely hear it at all.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I didn't find engine noise noticeable, but there were a lot of rattles and the aircon was very, very noisy (far worse than a 350). I overall prefer the high floor coaches because the windows are better positioned in relation to the seat height. But the build quality is very poor - very much AnsaldoBreda and not at all Japanese, and not a patch on Siemens - I reckon if you swapped the seat covers and foams on the 350/1s and gave them a new coat of paint you could pass them off as brand new, but the 800s already feel like they're 10 years old.
samuelmorris
Established Member
The A/C isn't quiet on 800s sure, but I've yet to experience one in midsummer. At the default setting it's perhaps a little noisier than Desiro A/C, but when it gets hot, Desiro A/C gets very loud, far louder than 395s (which sound like they may use the same system) ever do when it's hot out.
The fit and finish quality is a bit mediocre I will grant you, particularly rattling window blinds. The traction electronics are also very loud compared to their competitors, but then that's something Siemens don't always get right either.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
TBH I just wouldn't bother with window blinds. They rattle a lot and just cause arguments as to whether they should be up or down. Proper curtains in 1st (it looks much classier), nowt in Standard.
samuelmorris
Established Member
I agree, at least until rolling stock gets fitted with 787-style electrically dimmable windows 
Thunderer
Member
Yep the IEP has resulted in the most expensive train in the world to procure, run and maintain (as confirmed by the ITV programme "Tonight" a few weeks ago) and the passenger ends up with a very poor value for money train. Got to blame the DFT for most of this, they couldn't run a bath, yet alone a railway. Im a lifelong railway fan (45 years plus) and I can honestly say that most modern rolling stock is shockingly bad, sadly it is not a pleasure to travel by train anymore, trains are often too short, too packed and too uncomfortable and way over priced! The HST has been around for 40 years plus for a reason..it has been a major success, the majority of passengers like them and I can't think of a modern designed UK train that has bettered it for comfort. The IET is a tacky, plastic, expensive replacement which are already looking shoddy externally and internally..dreadful train!
I caught a lovely train from Florence to siena. Loco hauled and clearly a 70s relic. Incredibly comfy seats and all seats lining up with Windows. Coming back was a DMU which was very noisy but otherwise comfortable
Agree trains are getting worse
377 outer cars hold up very well actually given later new entrants
samuelmorris
Established Member
Maybe it's just 'my generation' but I find UK rolling stock peaked around the turn of the millennium with the first wave of post-privatisation stock. Quiet, air-conditioned units with universal access toilets and info displays, but built before interiors became too clinical and seats became, well...
cactustwirly
Established Member
Or an Austrian intercity train... Quiet, very refined and comfortable!
But Austria is completely different to the UK, with a much lesser need for seating capacity, with a whole carriage taken up by a restaurant!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
If you extended TPE trains to 8 car you could do that. The UK doesn't see enough value in those concepts to spend money on them.
43096
On Moderation
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And maybe they recognise that high quality sells, unlike DfT who clearly think treating passengers with contempt is the way to go.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
The restaurant aside, Railjet "Economy" is about the same as the old low density GWR HST layout and has identical seats (my much-loved Grammer IC3000, but not everyone likes those
), and 1st is nothing special with rubbish seats with broken recliners. It's not actually that good.I don't know what DaFT thinks, but other than the rubbish seats and the restaurant the new TPE units, particularly the WCML EMUs, look quite a lot better than Railjet.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I have no great love for the Mk3 - but if something is rubbish, it needs calling out as rubbish.
Two things are rubbish about the 800 - the build quality (what did they think would happen when they built the things at AnsaldoBreda? I think that's evidence enough that the only solution there is going to be closure) and the seats. Solve those and I'll be fine with them. The GWR colour scheme is also rubbish, but that would be easily solved while replacing the seat cushions (the frames are fine, just like the Mallard seats on the ECML were rubbish but replacing the cushions has solved the issue completely).
I agree they're not a bad train as such, and I prefer the seating layout in standard compare to high density HST with not enough tables. It's just sad that with all the advances in technology since the 70s a new train can't be loads better than the one it replaces. The improvement to cars seems a much bigger step forwards. I suppose if you look at housebuilding though some of the new builds are really poor.
Priorities are so different though. In the 70s the railways were in decline. BR needed to attract customers to the network to survive. That isn’t the case anymore. The public want a seat, and to get there on time. Considering the railway is struggling to manage those two perhaps it’s best they concentrated their time and energy on that. Once that’s fixed maybe comfort can be looked at.
cactustwirly
Established Member
I'd controversially say that the build quality at Newton Aycliffe is worse than Pistoia tbh!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
For some reason this doesn't overly surprise me.
Trains to the West Country have always been busy as far back as I can remember and whilst I agree that there is more demand for seats nowadays I still don`t follow the peddle that it`s all about fire safety. The interiors do look tacky and cheap but I believe things will get better in time.
You prefer the seating layout of the 800! The couple in the seats behind me had no window at all. Just a blank wall. This should have been a luggage rack.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
As luggage capacity is a bit short on these units, I think this may well end up happening at some point. Though the overheads are very good - huge and square.
The 800 does have excellent legroom, and the main problem with the seats could be solved with a few sheets of 6mm ply and a jigsaw. (Though no doubt it'd have to be steel plate for fire reasons).
There feels like more legroom in airline seats. I like tables and I think there are 3 times as many in an 800 carriage?
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