• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Scotrail Fleet - A Mess?

Status
Not open for further replies.

whhistle

On Moderation
Joined
30 Dec 2010
Messages
2,636
I didn't realise Scotrail had so many different types of stock.
Even discounting the 365s, there seems to be a fair amount of older units up there.

Are there any plans to replace the MK2s, 314s, 318s, 320s?
I thought the 385s were replacing these units, but obviously not :p
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Esker-pades

Established Member
Joined
23 Jul 2015
Messages
3,766
Location
Beds, Bucks, or somewhere else
The 314s are being replaced...
385s take over some workings, 380s others. Some 318s and 320s will also take over services that were previously 314s.

The 365s have gone.

The Fife Circle loco hauled stock will cease at the December 2019 timetable change (as long as enough 158s and 170s have been cascaded from other parts of the network).

The 385s are replacing units.
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
I didn't realise Scotrail had so many different types of stock.
Even discounting the 365s, there seems to be a fair amount of older units up there.

Are there any plans to replace the MK2s, 314s, 318s, 320s?
I thought the 385s were replacing these units, but obviously not :p

Compared to some operators, the number of types is quite small particularly DMU classes of which there have only been 3 since the last 150/2s were transferred away in 2005.

It's really the EMU classes where there are more types and two of them will be going soon (314 - withdrawn, 365 - off-lease). Taking it from 7 to 5 EMU classes.
 

nat67

Established Member
Joined
23 Apr 2014
Messages
1,477
Location
Warwickshire
Every train operating company fleet is a mess with an array of rolling stock some being hired in and others on there last legs.
 

supervc-10

Member
Joined
4 Mar 2012
Messages
702
Well, some of them are! Virgin only have the 390s and 221s, for example, neither of which are due for replacement (although the 390 I was on the other week could certainly have done with an interior refit!)

But yes, ScotRail are kind of in flux right now. Just like lots of companies.
 

gazthomas

Established Member
Joined
5 Jun 2011
Messages
3,040
Location
St. Albans
ThamesLink isn't a TOC. Govia Thameslink Railway is (ThamesLink, Southern, Gatwick Express, Great Northern).
Pedantic... Scotrail isn't Scotrail? Surely it's Abellio Scotrail Ltd?

If you ask someone who lives in say Harpenden or St. Albans then it's Thameslink, Great Northern and its brethren don't come into the equation. On this route it is 700s, 700s and more 700s.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,164
Pedantic... Scotrail isn't Scotrail? Surely it's Abellio Scotrail Ltd?

If you ask someone who lives in say Harpenden or St. Albans then it's Thameslink, Great Northern and its brethren don't come into the equation. On this route it is 700s, 700s and more 700s.
If you want to do pedantic the brand is actually ScotRail (with capital ‘R’), and the company name is Abellio Scotrail Ltd.
 

Esker-pades

Established Member
Joined
23 Jul 2015
Messages
3,766
Location
Beds, Bucks, or somewhere else
Pedantic... Scotrail isn't Scotrail? Surely it's Abellio Scotrail Ltd?

If you ask someone who lives in say Harpenden or St. Albans then it's Thameslink, Great Northern and its brethren don't come into the equation. On this route it is 700s, 700s and more 700s.
Um.... no. You're being pedantic on a name. I'm pointing out that you're only focusing on a sub-brand, not the whole TOC.

Govia Thameslink Railway is a TOC. Thameslink is a sub-brand of that TOC. Southern is a sub-brand of that same TOC. Ditto with Great Northern, ditto with Gatwick Express.

If we take your argument, ask someone who lives in Tain. It's just 158s, 158s and more 158s. The 385s and their brethren don't come into the equation.
 

gazthomas

Established Member
Joined
5 Jun 2011
Messages
3,040
Location
St. Albans
Um.... no. You're being pedantic on a name. I'm pointing out that you're only focusing on a sub-brand, not the whole TOC.

Govia Thameslink Railway is a TOC. Thameslink is a sub-brand of that TOC. Southern is a sub-brand of that same TOC. Ditto with Great Northern, ditto with Gatwick Express.

If we take your argument, ask someone who lives in Tain. It's just 158s, 158s and more 158s. The 385s and their brethren don't come into the equation.
I get where you're coming from, I just think it over complicates things. We can agree to differ! Though if it was Tainrail as a sub brand you'd be right!
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
That's what I mean and the state the rolling stock is in.

You mean more why they have some many classes, how it affects reliability, whether it's a good/bad thing and general upkeep of stock?

If so, that's not quite what I was getting at actually.
 

nat67

Established Member
Joined
23 Apr 2014
Messages
1,477
Location
Warwickshire
You mean more why they have some many classes, how it affects reliability, whether it's a good/bad thing and general upkeep of stock?

If so, that's not quite what I was getting at actually.
I know what you mean as the HST's being introduced late and and unrefurbished.
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
I know what you mean as the HST's being introduced late and and unrefurbished.

Well yes in a way, but I also meant that I was quite happy about the increased variety of classes being used by ScotRail as it makes things more interesting by having more types of train than we used to.
 

nat67

Established Member
Joined
23 Apr 2014
Messages
1,477
Location
Warwickshire
Well yes in a way, but I also meant that I was quite happy about the increased variety of classes being used by ScotRail as it makes things more interesting by having more types of train than we used to.
True I do agree there. Like in BR days in Scotland with all the different loco classes and DMU's.
 

Meole

Member
Joined
28 Oct 2018
Messages
452
Perhaps the Scottish government should take a look at the proactive approach in Cardiff.
 

Altnabreac

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2013
Messages
2,414
Location
Salt & Vinegar
The 314s are being replaced...
385s take over some workings, 380s others. Some 318s and 320s will also take over services that were previously 314s.

The 365s have gone.

The Fife Circle loco hauled stock will cease at the December 2019 timetable change (as long as enough 158s and 170s have been cascaded from other parts of the network).

The 385s are replacing units.

Just a small correction. the remedial agreement between TS and Scotrail has seen an extension of the Fife loco hauled stock lease until May 2020, with an option to extend to December 2020 "In order to ensure they are available until sufficient HSTs are in service to deliver the planned cascade of class 170s to Fife routes"

Suggests some wise scepticism at TS about the delivery timescales being promised by Wabtec.
 

hexagon789

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Sep 2016
Messages
15,715
Location
Glasgow
Just a small correction. the remedial agreement between TS and Scotrail has seen an extension of the Fife loco hauled stock lease until May 2020, with an option to extend to December 2020 "In order to ensure they are available until sufficient HSTs are in service to deliver the planned cascade of class 170s to Fife routes"

Suggests some wise scepticism at TS about the delivery timescales being promised by Wabtec.

I don't blame them, in fact I commend them for being realistic in appreciating that and sensible in having a contingency of keeping the Fife Circle loco-hauled stock in place a bit longer.
 

Esker-pades

Established Member
Joined
23 Jul 2015
Messages
3,766
Location
Beds, Bucks, or somewhere else
Just a small correction. the remedial agreement between TS and Scotrail has seen an extension of the Fife loco hauled stock lease until May 2020, with an option to extend to December 2020 "In order to ensure they are available until sufficient HSTs are in service to deliver the planned cascade of class 170s to Fife routes"

Suggests some wise scepticism at TS about the delivery timescales being promised by Wabtec.
Thank you for the correction. This seems a very sensible move.
 

MatthewRead

On Moderation
Joined
21 Nov 2014
Messages
1,636
Location
West london
Just a small correction. the remedial agreement between TS and Scotrail has seen an extension of the Fife loco hauled stock lease until May 2020, with an option to extend to December 2020 "In order to ensure they are available until sufficient HSTs are in service to deliver the planned cascade of class 170s to Fife routes"

Suggests some wise scepticism at TS about the delivery timescales being promised by Wabtec.
I hope the at least one of those loco hauled sets is retained until December 2020.:D
 

3141

Established Member
Joined
1 Apr 2012
Messages
1,771
Location
Whitchurch, Hampshire
Every train operating company fleet is a mess with an array of rolling stock some being hired in and others on there last legs.

Gazthomas's suggestion that you should think about Thameslink ran into flak, so what about c2c and Chiltern?
 

nat67

Established Member
Joined
23 Apr 2014
Messages
1,477
Location
Warwickshire
Gazthomas's suggestion that you should think about Thameslink ran into flak, so what about c2c and Chiltern?
Ok not C2C with major problems and Chiltern are pretty good. They just have a few different traction types.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top