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ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion

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jingsmonty

jingsmonty

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43096 said:
It’s interesting that most of the ire has been directed at Wabtec (on here at least), but ScotRail have been totally incompetent. The fact that even now training is still going on, that the stabling facilities were late (if the trains had been delivered on time, there would have been problems) and the lack of engineering readiness (why was ATP left on for so long?) says just how badly planned and delivered it has been by Abellio.
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Wouldn't disagree with you, to be honest. Wabtec deserve all the ire they are getting though
 
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Chrism20

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jingsmonty said:
It's no use at all, is it? It must be so disheartening for the on train staff who have to deal with this. If I was a passenger, I'd be furious if I turned up for a 4 coach train with a reserved seat, only to discover that there's 1 less (potentially 2) coaches & no seat reservations. It's just not good enough at all, just embarrasing - hardly likely to encourage people to stay with train travel after an experience like that!

My only hope is that the 3 extra Classic sets will enter service & the availability of Train Crew/sets will improve. I do know that a lot of the train crew training has been suspended after the May timetable change - this will free up sets that have been used on the training trains.
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Surely given that they have known now for a considerable period of time that there were going to be a large number of substitutions wouldn't it have been easier to sell the advances and issue reservations based on the train being a 170 rather than an HST?

If they done that all the reservations could get seats as all the HSTs would have an A, B, C. Granted seats allocated to tables may end up in airline etc but at least it would mean seat reservations were honoured in some form.

Obviously if a 158 rolls in all bets are off but surely allocating as a 170 in the meantime would make sense. Or am I overthinking it?
 
47271

47271

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Chrism20 said:
Surely given that they have known now for a considerable period of time that there were going to be a large number of substitutions wouldn't it have been easier to sell the advances and issue reservations based on the train being a 170 rather than an HST?

If they done that all the reservations could get seats as all the HSTs would have an A, B, C. Granted seats allocated to tables may end up in airline etc but at least it would mean seat reservations were honoured in some form.

Obviously if a 158 rolls in all bets are off but surely allocating as a 170 in the meantime would make sense. Or am I overthinking it?
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No, you aren't overthinking it, but it seems that Scotrail can't be bothered to think about it at all.

To be honest you're lucky to get up to date reservations on HSTs at the moment never mind when a 170 has been substituted, the last three times I've been on the 1739 Edinburgh-Inverness as an HST it has been:

1. No reservations and full of old litter.
2. Old reservations and full of old litter.
3. Old reservations visibly removed in the platform before the doors were opened, but no new reservations placed, and no litter.

So, as you can see, the service is improving.
 
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Chrism20

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47271 said:
No, you aren't overthinking it, but it seems that Scotrail can't be bothered to think about it at all.

To be honest you're lucky to get up to date reservations on HSTs at the moment never mind when a 170 has been substituted, the last three times I've been on the 1739 Edinburgh-Inverness as an HST it has been:

1. No reservations and full of old litter.
2. Old reservations and full of old litter.
3. Old reservations visibly removed in the platform before the doors were opened, but no new reservations placed, and no litter.

So, as you can see, the service is improving.
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You've probably jinxed it now....
 
gnolife

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Chrism20 said:
Surely given that they have known now for a considerable period of time that there were going to be a large number of substitutions wouldn't it have been easier to sell the advances and issue reservations based on the train being a 170 rather than an HST?

If they done that all the reservations could get seats as all the HSTs would have an A, B, C. Granted seats allocated to tables may end up in airline etc but at least it would mean seat reservations were honoured in some form.
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That would be worse for people travelling as groups - if their booked table of 4 doesn't coincide with a table on the new set, or worse, if the number of seats doesn't match, and your seat reservation becomes one for an imagjnary seat.
Also, what happens with reservations for a 170, say seat 37 in coach A, which is Standard class, but on a HST is First Class (or indeed the opposite case in coach C, which on a 170 contains first class, but on a HST is standard only)
 
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bigmoose

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Still haven’t managed to get an HST. 1538 ABD - GLQ on Friday was my latest reservation-less 170. Work trips to Aberdeen are a lottery at the moment.

On the plus side (and for the relevant other thread) the 385s are great on G-E.
 
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Chrism20

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gnolife said:
That would be worse for people travelling as groups - if their booked table of 4 doesn't coincide with a table on the new set, or worse, if the number of seats doesn't match, and your seat reservation becomes one for an imagjnary seat.
Also, what happens with reservations for a 170, say seat 37 in coach A, which is Standard class, but on a HST is First Class (or indeed the opposite case in coach C, which on a 170 contains first class, but on a HST is standard only)
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There are three standard carriages in an HST and then the mixed carriage. Label the standard ones A, B and C leaving the first class standard portion as unreserved.

There are more seats in a standard HST carriage than there is a 170 so there wouldn't be an imaginary seat. It's not ideal and as you say would upset groups but in the long run it guarantees those who have booked a seat actually get a seat.
 
jingsmonty

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Chrism20 said:
Surely given that they have known now for a considerable period of time that there were going to be a large number of substitutions wouldn't it have been easier to sell the advances and issue reservations based on the train being a 170 rather than an HST?

If they done that all the reservations could get seats as all the HSTs would have an A, B, C. Granted seats allocated to tables may end up in airline etc but at least it would mean seat reservations were honoured in some form.

Obviously if a 158 rolls in all bets are off but surely allocating as a 170 in the meantime would make sense. Or am I overthinking it?
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No, I think that's a pretty sensible & logical idea - as an ex Conductor, I like it! But the railway rarely does 'sensible & logical'....
 
jingsmonty

jingsmonty

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Chrism20 said:
There are three standard carriages in an HST and then the mixed carriage. Label the standard ones A, B and C leaving the first class standard portion as unreserved.

There are more seats in a standard HST carriage than there is a 170 so there wouldn't be an imaginary seat. It's not ideal and as you say would upset groups but in the long run it guarantees those who have booked a seat actually get a seat.
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Exactly. It's not ideal, but better than turning up for a busy train & having to stand.

Scotrail probably haven't done this, as they will be planning to have more (if not all) HST diagrams worked by HSTs. It does seen to be improving (on the HML, at least), although I had a 170 on the 1901 Perth - Inverness (which is the 1739 from Edinburgh) last Friday instead of the booked HST...
 
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FtoE

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I was on the (170) 17:10 from Perth to Inverness last night. We passed what seemed to be a reconditioned HST (saw at speed from the corner of my eye) just south of Stanley. I suppose this would have been the 15:18 from Inverness.
 
Highlandspring

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FtoE said:
I was on the (170) 17:10 from Perth to Inverness last night. We passed what seemed to be a reconditioned HST (saw at speed from the corner of my eye) just south of Stanley. I suppose this would have been the 15:18 from Inverness.
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That was Classic set HA09.
 
jingsmonty

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FtoE said:
I was on the (170) 17:10 from Perth to Inverness last night. We passed what seemed to be a reconditioned HST (saw at speed from the corner of my eye) just south of Stanley. I suppose this would have been the 15:18 from Inverness.
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It's just the power cars that are refurbished - very few Inverness train crew have had the refurbished set conversion course yet, hardly any of us could work a 'refurb'. Hopefully this will change with the arrival of HA23 in Inverness
 
Esker-pades

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jingsmonty said:
It's just the power cars that are refurbished - very few Inverness train crew have had the refurbished set conversion course yet, hardly any of us could work a 'refurb'. Hopefully this will change with the arrival of HA23 in Inverness
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Has that still not happened? I thought that the arrival of the 3rd refurbished set would mean one got given to Inverness very quickly.
 
hexagon789

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Chrism20 said:
There are three standard carriages in an HST and then the mixed carriage. Label the standard ones A, B and C leaving the first class standard portion as unreserved.
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Mixed carriage? Are they only using part of the Trailer Firsts as 'proper' First Class then?
 
jingsmonty

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FelixtheCat said:
Has that still not happened? I thought that the arrival of the 3rd refurbished set would mean one got given to Inverness very quickly.
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We had HA24 (3rd set), but it was shifted to Eastfield after less than a week, to facilitate Queen St train crew training. We're waiting on the 4th set (HA23) to arrive, should be this week.
 
JLUK144

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A pair of Scotrail Inter7City liveried power cars and two FGW liveried Mk3s went down my line - the Glasgow South Western line - on the first of April. Could this be evidence that Wabtec have started work at Kilmarnock?

34F38CD2-7163-45FE-9D92-72AD1CFBAA25.jpeg
 
jingsmonty

jingsmonty

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Cashew said:
I take it that there is still no word about set 4.
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HA23 (Set 4) is supposed to be heading up from Doncaster to Dundee this week sometime (it was originally supposed to move last week, but was cancelled due to a compressor failure on one of the power cars). Its ultimate destination is supposed to be Inverness, to facilitate our training, as HA24 (Set 3) was moved away to Eastfield.
 
najaB

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JLUK144 said:
A pair of Scotrail Inter7City liveried power cars and two FGW liveried Mk3s went down my line - the Glasgow South Western line - on the first of April. Could this be evidence that Wabtec have started work at Kilmarnock?
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I can't see any other reason that Scotrail power cars would be taking Mk3s in that direction.
 
hexagon789

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DannyMich2018 said:
That's very optimistic considering just three have been delivered so far and it's May already tomorrow!!! :)
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Optimistic would be a full complement of 26 sets! That really would be optimistic.

I think 15 is doable, now Killie have started on the refurbs.
 
Stoney1979

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hexagon789 said:
Optimistic would be a full complement of 26 sets! That really would be optimistic.

I think 15 is doable, now Killie have started on the refurbs.
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I'll eat my hat if there are 10 or more refurbs in full regular service by 31/12/19. From today that would require 1 set per month to be delivered and be carrying passengers. Not going to happen.
 
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