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Future of Diesel traction in the future and will unelectrified lines have another fuel type?

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supervc-10

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While definitely not impossible, a solar powered train would struggle in a wet dark British winter!

Having said that- this is basically a battery EMU with some solar panels on the top, which gets charged up at the terminus. A battery unit with a pantograph could be ideal for a lot of routes I'm sure. Think how much improvement there has been in electric cars- the first gen Nissan Leaf could barely do 100 miles, the new one is over double that.
 
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gordonthemoron

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I was in Newcastle NSW last week, they have a battery powered tram system where the batteries are recharged at stations using the pantograph. Any chance of something similar in the UK? The only OHLE they have is at the depot
 

Bob M

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Trams in Birmingham are going to run on batteries through the city centre.
 

ancientsolar

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some of those battery buses, with pantographs that charge at bus stops.
Similar can be done with trains, you won't need diesel, just add short electrified areas. or electrified stations.. as long as the train can charge sufficiently while waiting there.. you're good to go.

That's the plan for the welsh valleys ^
 

Kneedown

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I personally believe the answer is ohle on the easy sections, with trains switching to battery on the areas difficult to wire economically. Plenty of opportunity to top up batteries, whilst cutting the costs of electrification.
 

Jozhua

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I personally believe the answer is ohle on the easy sections, with trains switching to battery on the areas difficult to wire economically. Plenty of opportunity to top up batteries, whilst cutting the costs of electrification.

Keeping Lithium Ions well charged also makes them last longer. I highly doubt that running on mostly batteries for full journeys all day, everyday would be good for them. They are a useful tool for getting trains through some of the difficult sections, however I doubt their longevity should they be put under more intensive loads.

Still, it's relatively early days for battery technology, especially on the railways so we'll have to wait and see.
 

reddragon

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Keeping Lithium Ions well charged also makes them last longer. I highly doubt that running on mostly batteries for full journeys all day, everyday would be good for them. They are a useful tool for getting trains through some of the difficult sections, however I doubt their longevity should they be put under more intensive loads.

Still, it's relatively early days for battery technology, especially on the railways so we'll have to wait and see.

The learning point from EVs is that the most important thing to do to maintain battery life is to keep it between 20% and 80% charged as much as possible.

Frequent charges at all speeds have no effect, its just running a battery flat of charging to 100% that shorten battery life.

The BMS (battery management system) cycles batteries in the best way for a long life and like a PC with a full hard drive, the more space for the BMS to send the electrons the better.
 

AndrewE

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Surely lithium ion batteries add quite a bit of weight?
Apparently they are relatively light.
The ferries between Helsingor and Helsingborg are now battery powered (keeping their original diesels for standby.) The battery packs are located on the top deck which surprised me, but they must have looked at the ships' stability pretty carefully. The charging connection is done by a robot arm at each end, I guess with the current and voltages involved you can't afford any mistakes. There are videos of it somewhere online.
 

AndrewE

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So does a diesel engine and fuel tank!
(If you are referring to the ferry comment) They are down in the bowels of the ship and add to its stability. Putting the battery banks right on top is surprising if they are heavy - unless maybe the fire risk is such that you can't risk having them inside...
 
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