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What's Happening to The 'Pretendolino' rake?

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hstmatt

hstmatt

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Hi All,
Having been past Crewe LNWR a few times recently, I've noticed the former 'Pretendolino' take stood outside the sheds.
I'm aware the original plan was for TPE to take the coaches on temporarily until the Mk5s were ready, however this was dropped due to accessibility issues?
Since then, other than for Class 68 driver training, they've had no use?
So, does anyone know what the plan is for them? (IF there even is one?)
I've not seen 82126 at Crewe, does anyone know if thats being stored elsewhere? Wasn't there also a spare buffet coach done for Virgin too?
TIA
Matt
(Auto Correct has done me on the title, if any admins could change if possible lol)
 
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59CosG95

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hstmatt said:
Hi All,
Having been past Crewe LNWR a few times recently, I've noticed the former 'Pretendolino' take stood outside the sheds.
I'm aware the original plan was for TPE to take the coaches on temporarily until the Mk5s were ready, however this was dropped due to accessibility issues?
Since then, other than for Class 68 driver training, they've had no us.
So, does anyone know what the plan is for them? (IF there even is one?)
I've not seen 82126 at Crewe, does anyone know if thats being stored elsewhere? Wasn't there also a spare buffet coach done for Virgin too?
TIA
Matt
Click to expand...
The ex-Pretendolino rake was indeed planned for TPE to use temporarily, but they were in a right state internally & below the solebar (enough of a state to be able to vote in the 2020 US Elections ;)), so TPE dropped the idea of using them. They'd also have needed to hire a lot more crew to work them (given they'd be using droplight slam-doors), and surplus crew is something they simply did not have at the time (that may well still be the case); the nugget of crew information is something passed on by an ex-TPE employee (whose work at Leeds was so stretched it impacted on his mental health).

Accessibility issues would have been another factor, of that I'm 95% certain.
DVT 82126 has since been acquired by DRS and is stored at Loram's works in Derby.
 
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Bletchleyite

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That's interesting reading. So basically they never wanted to use them once they saw the state of them, and the whole disability controversy was just a last straw?
 
hstmatt

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Didn't VT get the set overhauled just before its withdrawal? I remember they fitted tanks, new tables and new carpets ect? Or was it the storage at Long Rock thats caused the damage?
Spent many evenings behind it on 1K39 from Euston in my early teens!
 
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Bletchleyite

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hstmatt said:
Didn't VT get the set overhauled just before its withdrawal? I remember they fitted tanks, new tables and new carpets ect? Or was it the storage at Long Rock thats caused the damage?
Spent many evenings behind it on 1K39 from Euston in my early teens!
Click to expand...

Pretty sure it was just the standard IC70 interior with new seat covers, wasn't it?
 
43096

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59CosG95 said:
The ex-Pretendolino rake was indeed planned for TPE to use temporarily, but they were in a right state internally & below the solebar (enough of a state to be able to vote in the 2020 US Elections ;)), so TPE dropped the idea of using them. They'd also have needed to hire a lot more crew to work them (given they'd be using droplight slam-doors), and surplus crew is something they simply did not have at the time (that may well still be the case); the nugget of crew information is something passed on by an ex-TPE employee (whose work at Leeds was so stretched it impacted on his mental health).

Accessibility issues would have been another factor, of that I'm 95% certain.
DVT 82126 has since been acquired by DRS and is stored at Loram's works in Derby.
Click to expand...
The set is currently leased until the end of this year by TPE. It is also counted by Transport for the North as part of franchise’s (theoretical) capacity even though it will never be used.
 
DBS92042

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From Google Maps images, it looks like 82126 is stored at MoD Longtown along with DRS's other 37s and 57s
 
CosherB

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As of 2nd January 2020, I fully expect the Pretendolino (or what’s left of it) to be towed away for scrap.
 
xc170

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Just passed this at Crewe, externally it looks immaculate for something that has no use...

XC Take note.
 
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BeHereNow

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59CosG95 said:
The ex-Pretendolino rake was indeed planned for TPE to use temporarily, but they were in a right state internally & below the solebar (enough of a state to be able to vote in the 2020 US Elections ;)), so TPE dropped the idea of using them. They'd also have needed to hire a lot more crew to work them (given they'd be using droplight slam-doors), and surplus crew is something they simply did not have at the time (that may well still be the case); the nugget of crew information is something passed on by an ex-TPE employee (whose work at Leeds was so stretched it impacted on his mental health).

Accessibility issues would have been another factor, of that I'm 95% certain.
DVT 82126 has since been acquired by DRS and is stored at Loram's works in Derby.
Click to expand...

Exactly, they never wanted to use them, they didn't ever have enough crews to work them. They are just like any other contractor, bidding a good price and then doing the absolute bare minimum required: and often much less.
 
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fgwrich said:
I doubt that will be happening to all of it. They'll be a few organisations interested in those Mk3s!
Click to expand...

No there won't - if anyone wants Mk3s they will take the best ones from the Anglia fleet or maybe even wait for Mk4s with power doors.

They are of no use for spot hire to mainline operators after 1 January 2020.

Moreover, it would appear that there is a strong possibility that coaches with droplights won't be permitted on the mainline railway some time in the early 2020s even for charter operations.
 
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JonathanH said:
Moreover, it would appear that there is a strong possibility that coaches with droplights won't be permitted on the mainline railway some time in the early 2020s even for charter operations.
Click to expand...

If that does happen someone will design an internal handle for such stock, though more for fresh air Mk1/Mk2 stock. People won't pay for a steam charter with Mk4s behind it and no chance to smell the smoke etc.
 
38Cto15E

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The top levels of football are awash with money.
IMHO The Premier League should buy a suitable rake of coaches, bring them up to current standards regarding doors and toilets etc and then hire them out to clubs (inc Champioship etc) as required. After all football is now usually 6 days a week including some very late finishes, so I am sure that work could be found for the stock for say 5 days with 2 days maintenance.
Bring back Footex's :)
 
43096

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JonathanH said:
No there won't - if anyone wants Mk3s they will take the best ones from the Anglia fleet or maybe even wait for Mk4s with power doors.

They are of no use for spot hire to mainline operators after 1 January 2020.

Moreover, it would appear that there is a strong possibility that coaches with droplights won't be permitted on the mainline railway some time in the early 2020s even for charter operations.
Click to expand...
Given the catering facilities on the Anglia sets, I would expect the two TPE RFMs to find a home.
 
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Bletchleyite said:
If that does happen someone will design an internal handle for such stock, though more for fresh air Mk1/Mk2 stock. People won't pay for a steam charter with Mk4s behind it and no chance to smell the smoke etc.
Click to expand...

Nothing to stop some form of 'sound opening' or an opening window sufficiently small that it is impossible to put body parts out of it (think 317 style 'letterbox' or underground style slide vents) being fitted to the Mk4 carriages.
 
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43096 said:
Given the catering facilities on the Anglia sets, I would expect the two TPE RFMs to find a home.
Click to expand...

Aren't the catering vehicles the ones which suffer from the most corrosion? Given the charter trains operate with a full kitchen now, it might be easiest to start again with an 'open coach' and transplant cooking equipment into it.
 
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JonathanH said:
Nothing to stop some form of 'sound opening' or an opening window sufficiently small that it is impossible to put body parts out of it (think 317 style 'letterbox' or underground style slide vents) being fitted to the Mk4 carriages.
Click to expand...

It'd probably be easier to fit interior handles to Mk1s/Mk2s and seal the droplight. Windows are structural in some modern stock...
 
43096

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JonathanH said:
Aren't the catering vehicles the ones which suffer from the most corrosion? Given the charter trains operate with a full kitchen now, it might be easiest to start again with an 'open coach' and transplant cooking equipment into it.
Click to expand...
There’s a lot of work in doing that, including adding an additional MA set (or more likely a static converter these days) and that’s before you get to hacking around the bodyshell. It’s not as if the standard vehicles are rot free, either - just ask ScotRail!
 
diffident

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Gus said:
The top levels of football are awash with money.
IMHO The Premier League should buy a suitable rake of coaches, bring them up to current standards regarding doors and toilets etc and then hire them out to clubs (inc Champioship etc) as required. After all football is now usually 6 days a week including some very late finishes, so I am sure that work could be found for the stock for say 5 days with 2 days maintenance.
Bring back Footex's :)
Click to expand...

What you've suggested there is actually a very, very good idea.
 
BMIFlyer

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The spare (anglia) buffet has gone to GWR for use on the sleeper/as a spare whilst one of the actual sleeper buffet cars is being refurbished.

TPE had enough drivers and guards for the MK3’s so I am unsure where the myth that there weren’t enough has come from.

The extra staff also required on the trains in service would have been door marshals used to stop idiots from hanging out of windows primarily, but also to assist door closing at stations, etc.
 
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BeHereNow

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BMIFlyer said:
TPE had enough drivers and guards for the MK3’s so I am unsure where the myth that there weren’t enough has come from.
Click to expand...

I think it's because of all the cancellations that were and continue to be due to staff shortages.
 
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