Swedish Transport Agency - short notice of engineering works

jamesontheroad · 11 May 2019

I'm trying to plan a journey through Stockholm this summer, using SJ's night trains.

As of today, in mid-May, SJ still haven't opened booking on a number of dates in mid-July, because track maintenance planning underway.

Is such short notice confirmation of works normal in Sweden? It's making Network Rail in the UK look pretty good at confirming engineering works...

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Polarbear · 11 May 2019

I've recently had a similar experience, as I was looking to book sleeper berths on the Narvik - Stockholm service on 26 June. The train was only made available for booking in late April -roughly eight weeks out.

scarby · 12 May 2019

Which trains do you want to use? The section Stockholms Södra - Stockholm Central will be closed from some time in July to mid-August. If you take a sleeper to/from Malmö it will start/terminate at Flemingsburg, about 15 mins by local train from Stockholm.

jamesontheroad · 12 May 2019

We’re trying to get from London to Umeå.

That requires an overnight stop in Hamburg, as per the advice of Mark Smith on Seat61.com

Also to note, there’s engineering works between Hamburg and Copenhagen until the end of September, so that adds an extra train or bus most days this summer.

The issue is whether to get to Lund, Stockholm or maybe even Gothenburg at the end of day 2 to connect to a SJ sleeper for the last bit to Umeå. More time on night trains is preferable for us.

scarby · 12 May 2019

Yes, I have seen there is engineering on Hamburg-Copenhagen via the Puttgården ferry - that journey looks horrible with buses. I would recommend to go round to Copenhagen the other way, via Flensburg-
Fredericia.

I would suggest the Stockholm-Umeå overnighter would help.

Obviously it’s personal choice, but for me London-Stockholm is a hard slog with just one overnight stop. One delay can make it very tough. I would suggest a stop somewhere short of Hamburg - there are loads of interesting cities - and then somewhere en route to Stockholm.

I did Hook of Holland to Lubeck last summer in the heatwave, first class, and I was shattered when I got to Lubeck after over 11 hours on trains. One train was cancelled and I had to think on my feet to make the journey work, twice running in sheer heat to catch connecting trains. I will never attempt that length of travel in a day again, because it took all the pleasure away, but of course others may feel fine with it.

30907 · 12 May 2019

The Gothenburg-Umeaa sleeper doesn't go via Stockholm so shouldn't be much affected, but it does leave quite early evening and you'd need the first morning train from Hamburg to connect.
Further south, despite the bus journey, I would recommend a final trip on the Puttgarden Roedby train ferry: normal service on the route resumes mid Sept but only till December; AIUI services will thereafter be diverted via Flensburg and the Great Belt crossing. The IC3s are running through to Nykoebing/F so you could use the RRB from there with the locals instead of from Roedby.

BTW, check splitting your tickets (I assume using DB Europa Spezial?) at Oldenburg (Holstein) or Luebeck, even if you overnight in Hamburg.

Obviously if you are coming back via rail as well, take a different route - the alternative scarby suggests is well worth it.

jamesontheroad · 13 May 2019

30907 said:
The Gothenburg-Umeaa sleeper doesn't go via Stockholm so shouldn't be much affected, but it does leave quite early evening and you'd need the first morning train from Hamburg to connect.

Thanks 30907. This process has been confused a bit because the only time I ever took a SJ sleeper from Gothenburg to Umeå (on a Sunday in late November last year), it went via Stockholm. I assumed at the time that this was normal. I presume this was because of track work.

We have adjusted our dates slightly because, in addition to track works in Stockholm, there's work going on around Gävle from 29 July to 4 August 2019.

Edit:

During this time, the PDF timetables on Resrobot show that train 92 from Stockholm is replaced with train 10092, 29/7-4/8 only, leaving Stockholm a little earlier. This train would suit us perfectly, but it isn't yet visible in SJ's booking engine. (Not even visible but blocked out with the message 'track maintenance planning underway'... it's just not there).

Thanks also for the split ticket suggestion.

jamesontheroad · 13 May 2019

30907 said:
BTW, check splitting your tickets (I assume using DB Europa Spezial?) at Oldenburg (Holstein) or Luebeck, even if you overnight in Hamburg.

Quick PS. Thank you! Regarding the split in Lübeck; this does indeed save quite a bit on the international part of the trip; however bahn.de can't then quote a price for Hamburg Hbf to Lübeck Hbf on our preffered train, EC231. Is 'local' travel between these two stations not permitted on EuroCity trains?

AlexNL · 13 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
Regarding the split in Lübeck; this does indeed save quite a bit on the international part of the trip; however bahn.de can't then quote a price for Hamburg Hbf to Lübeck Hbf on our preffered train, EC231. Is 'local' travel between these two stations not permitted on EuroCity trains?

There is, indeed, a pick-up only restriction at Lübeck:

Note that there's no quoted arrival time, only a departure time.

jamesontheroad · 13 May 2019

AlexNL said:
There is, indeed, a pick-up only restriction at Lübeck:

View attachment 62918

Note that there's no quoted arrival time, only a departure time.

Ok, shame. So to avail ourselves of the savings of split ticketing at Lübeck, we'd need to take a local train earlier and change at Lübeck?

To update the thread, previously unavailable departures of SJ 92 from Stockholm to Umeå C are now showing up on sj.se... presumably, the details of track works around Gälve have been confirmed.

The plan is to buy DB Super Sparpreis Europa for two adults London - Hamburg on day one; DB Super Sparpreis Europa Hamburg - Stockholm on day two, and then the best available fare in a private compartment on SJ 92 from Stockholm Central to Umeå on the evening of day two.

We will still have to navigate the track works between Stockholm Södra and Stockholm Central. This isn't a problem for us, as we won't have much luggage, but it does seem to have blocked out some DB Super Sparpreis Europa fares between Hamburg and Stockholm Central... it's fine Hamburg > Stockholm Södra, but the inclusion of the local train from Stockholm Södra to Central causes bahn.de to say "Unknown tariff abroad." I guess we just have to buy a local ticket on arrival at Södra, even though SJ promise that through tickets are valid.

30907 · 13 May 2019

The split at Oldenburg (H) gets round the Luebeck problem, but on a random check there doesn't actually seem to be very much of a saving.
As for Stockholm, I would be inclined to act ignorant, and the fares will be the same to S or C!

JonasB · 15 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
Thanks 30907. This process has been confused a bit because the only time I ever took a SJ sleeper from Gothenburg to Umeå (on a Sunday in late November last year), it went via Stockholm. I assumed at the time that this was normal. I presume this was because of track work.

At the time it was normal, but since the timetable change in december the sleepers from Gothenburg no longer go via Stockholm.

grid56126 · 16 May 2019

We were looking at going to St Petersburg via Stockholm (and ferry), but we were just a bit too tight to get visas squared off in time. To avoid the buses in Denmark we had decided to go via Berlin and use the overnight to Malmo which fortunately ran on the day we wanted to go. Certainly a more interesting way than the units / buses on the Lubeck route this summer.

On hold until next year when we we intend to do the same but with more time to plan.

jamesontheroad · 16 May 2019

JonasB said:
At the time it was normal, but since the timetable change in december the sleepers from Gothenburg no longer go via Stockholm.

Aha! Thanks for clarifying.

So did Stockholm “lose” a sleeper to the north, when the Gothenburg - Luleå train was re-routed? There still seem to be two departures every night northbound.

30907 · 16 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
Aha! Thanks for clarifying.

So did Stockholm “lose” a sleeper to the north, when the Gothenburg - Luleå train was re-routed? There still seem to be two departures every night northbound.

No, it still runs, just the Goteborg portion runs direct to somewhere further north, which ISTR is the "traditional" route.

JonasB · 16 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
Aha! Thanks for clarifying.

So did Stockholm “lose” a sleeper to the north, when the Gothenburg - Luleå train was re-routed? There still seem to be two departures every night northbound.

No there are still two sleepers to northern Norrland from Stockholm. Previously there used to be one train from Gothenburg that ran north via Stockholm and one that originated in Stockholm. Now they have been combined with the sleeper train to Jämtland.

So now there is one sleeper train that depart Gothenburg and one from Stockholm, each with coaches both to Jämtland and northern Norrland. They meet in Sundsvall were a bit of shunting takes place and a bit later one train leaves for Jämtland and one for Umeå and Luleå.

Then there is the Stockholm-Narvik train, that haven't changed.

This was partly made possible by the reopening of the Söderhamn-Kilafors line last year after a few years of extensive track works.

jamesontheroad · 16 May 2019

Superb. Thanks for the info.

The backstory to all of this is that I moving from the UK to Västerbotten... we'll ship our stuff and travel up by train. I will be trying to keep all my business travel to/from Stockholm to the train, although my employer does seem to favour the flights.

It may be a pipe dream for some time to come, but I will be investigating how I can support Back on Track EU and other groups to campaign for better international connections to/from Sweden. This page paints a tantalising if very ambitious picture of what could happen.

scarby · 16 May 2019

As that article mentions, there was a superb night train with modern stock from Amsterdam through Cologne to Copenhagen until 2017, which meant a big chunk of a UK-Scandinavia journey could be made overnight in the comfort of a bed.

The journey is so much harder to plan since its withdrawal.

JonasB · 16 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
Superb. Thanks for the info.
The backstory to all of this is that I moving from the UK to Västerbotten... we'll ship our stuff and travel up by train. I will be trying to keep all my business travel to/from Stockholm to the train, although my employer does seem to favour the flights.

The high speed trains between Umeå and Stockholm are great, but not that fast on average as the east coast line is not that fast and single track north of Gävle. But there are some plans to partially replace the current current single track with a 200 km/h double track line.

jamesontheroad said:
It may be a pipe dream for some time to come, but I will be investigating how I can support Back on Track EU and other groups to campaign for better international connections to/from Sweden. This page paints a tantalising if very ambitious picture of what could happen.

The current government are talking about subsidising night trains to the continent. No routes have been mentioned, but there has been rumours about Stockholm-Hamburg.

JonasB · 21 May 2019

jamesontheroad said:
I'm trying to plan a journey through Stockholm this summer, using SJ's night trains.

As of today, in mid-May, SJ still haven't opened booking on a number of dates in mid-July, because track maintenance planning underway.

Is such short notice confirmation of works normal in Sweden? It's making Network Rail in the UK look pretty good at confirming engineering works...

And to answer your original question, yes. Trafikverket has been pretty slow lately in providing the operators with updated schedules when there is some track maintenance going on.

jamesontheroad · 21 May 2019

JonasB said:
And to answer your original question, yes. Trafikverket has been pretty slow lately in providing the operators with updated schedules when there is some track maintenance going on.

Ok, good to know. I’m unable to buy a DB Europa Special Fare from Hamburg to Stockholm S because as long as the direct Copenhagen - Stockholm Södra trains are blocked off (Friday 26 July) DB can’t price it. Below is a screenshot of the SJ app.

Swedish Transport Agency - short notice of engineering works

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