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Prospects of HSTs surviving on "Highland Chieftain" (London/Inverness VTEC)
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GW43125
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However that would require more units, potentially more crew and result in more downtime.
I assume the plan is to do an arrangement similar to the one seen at Bournemouth-London end unit gets dropped, shunts over (not necessary in this case) and then goes on the London end of the next up train.
However this assumes there isn't a mismatch in units-ie the first northbound gets to EDB in time to drop the unit and get it over to the first southbound, the last southbound is sufficiently after the last northbound to pick up its unit.
Obviously any Edinburgh terminators would (hopefully) already be 9 or 10 which would somewhat preclude attaching to them.
sprinterguy
Established Member
Are there really plans for that many of the Aberdeen and Inverness services to split at Edinburgh? The majority of LNER's bi-mode sets ordered for HST replacement are 9-car trains. Just over half of LNER's current HST diagrams include runs to or from Aberdeen or Inverness. Ergo, I would expect plenty of 9-car services north of Edinburgh.
I thought the small fleet of ten 5-car bi-modes would be at least partially tied up with work such as the Sunderland, Harrogate and proposed Middlesbrough services.
I thought the small fleet of ten 5-car bi-modes would be at least partially tied up with work such as the Sunderland, Harrogate and proposed Middlesbrough services.
TOCs don't really like trains and staff sitting around not doing anything though.
I'm not sure why we're talking about splitting services at Edinburgh? I have seen no evidence to suggest that there will be any 5-car operation north of Edinburgh and indeed the loadings on such services do not suggest that 5-car would be suitable. Plus if you consider the orders that have been placed include thirteen 9-car bi-modes, which lines up very nicely with the existing HST fleet, then unless people think that LNER will be using 9-car IETs to Hull in preference to say Aberdeen I would suggest it quickly becomes obvious what will be going north to Inverness and Aberdeen!
I could, possibly, see a splitting service that goes onto to Stirling or Glasgow but Aberdeen and Inverness are clearly still going to be getting 9-car units.
I could, possibly, see a splitting service that goes onto to Stirling or Glasgow but Aberdeen and Inverness are clearly still going to be getting 9-car units.
That's what I thought would be the case.
sprinterguy
Established Member
Hear hear, my point exactly.
I was told by someone who knows (I won’t say his job title on here) and he was quite certain that services would be splitting at Edinburgh, he mentioned the Aberdeen, Inverness and Stirling ones but he never mentioned the Glasgow Central one. He did imply that some would be 9-coaches too though.
It probably wasn’t/isn’t set in stone though, and may change.
It probably wasn’t/isn’t set in stone though, and may change.
Are they not catering for growth long term? Surely longer trains are needed in the future not shorter? Or a higher frequency of trains.
The TMS in the Class 80x trains supports lengths of up to 12 carriages so there's scope for longer trains - and that's ignoring the fact that the intermediate vehicles are 26m long as opposed to 23m for HSTs.
From what I've read, a five carriage IET will have 45 first and 270 standard class seats.
Morpethcurve
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Planning an HST KGX to NCL Thurs 30th - I can only find diagrams up to May 18th. Shall I just ensure I get on a no-change INV, ABZ or STG? (SUN appears too late).
I see that its theoretically possible to travel KGX to NCL on the STG train at 15:00, and pay rather less if I bought a ticket to STG (£59.50) vs. to NCL (£86). I presume this is against the rules, but surly one could avoid exiting through a barrier by changing platforms at NCL and departing on another train.
I see that its theoretically possible to travel KGX to NCL on the STG train at 15:00, and pay rather less if I bought a ticket to STG (£59.50) vs. to NCL (£86). I presume this is against the rules, but surly one could avoid exiting through a barrier by changing platforms at NCL and departing on another train.
cactustwirly
Established Member
No 800s are north of Leeds until July
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Presuming these are both Advances, that is indeed not allowed. For an Advance you must make the precise journey specified on the ticket, in full. There are indeed workarounds, but these could still get you in a lot of bother if caught.
Morpethcurve
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Many Thanks cactustwirly - I should have emphasised that I'm specifically after an HST this trip.
BRX
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If it's one of those off super off peak singles that you can buy on the LNER website (without needing to buy a return one) though... it would be ok.
BRX
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I'm a bit behind on this - and has already been mentioned on other threads - but seemingly the Chieftain will not remain as HST beyond December - sad news as far as I'm concerned.
https://www.railmagazine.com/news/n...for-azuma-introduction-onto-highland-services
So, December 8th the last run? Not sure how likely that is to change.
https://www.railmagazine.com/news/n...for-azuma-introduction-onto-highland-services
So, December 8th the last run? Not sure how likely that is to change.
Well as the service is transferring to Azuma on 8 December it would seem odd for it to then change back to anything else after that?
cactustwirly
Established Member
Yeah, it'll be an 800.
I will definitely be doing a run on it before then!
I was referring to the discussion about attachments and detachments actually, and in particular the claim that the train will be formed of 5 coaches to and from Inverness... I thought that was obvious, sorry.
If LNER have not confirmed this then fine, I was only asking...
If LNER have not confirmed this then fine, I was only asking...
Failed Unit
Established Member
I understand that it is staying as 9. Loading too high.
I know it is off topic but I don’t get this splitting and joining. Seems an operational nightmare.
Let’s say they did only run 5 north of Edinburgh. A portion could return south on the 1730. But what happens if the London - Inverness is late? Send the 1730 South with 5?
the only LNER route 5 makes sense is Lincoln. The rumours of dropping 5 at Edinburgh/ Leeds seems a recipe for problems.
I quite agree. Nothing suggests to me that it was ever planned to be anything but a 9. However there are certain people who refuse to be convinced by this so I was just wondering if a statement to that effect has ever been made. If it hasn't yet then fair enough.
Failed Unit
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the only press release I have seen from LNER was explicit it would be 9 coach.
I don't think that was ever more than a forum suggestion in the case that Virgin/LNER wanted to increase the frequency to twice daily.
Peter Kelford
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Let me invent an excuse to go up to Aberdeen or Inverness then.
Peter Kelford
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Surely it was somewhat profitable to offer an intercity-style service to Inverness? Of course, Scotrail can do it itself now.
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