Best place for Pacers?

southern442 · 25 May 2019

Strangely enough I find myself in the predicament (luxury?) of having never been on a Pacer before. Since they will probably start disappearing soon, I have decided I will rectify that issue over the summer.

Obviously there are loads of places where they operate. What I'm asking is where's the best place to travel to in order to get the full pacer experience? i.e. maximum discomfort perhaps?

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PHILIPE · 25 May 2019

southern442 said:
Strangely enough I find myself in the predicament (luxury?) of having never been on a Pacer before. Since they will probably start disappearing soon, I have decided I will rectify that issue over the summer.

Obviously there are loads of places where they operate. What I'm asking is where's the best place to travel to in order to get the full pacer experience? i.e. maximum discomfort perhaps?

There is nowhere where you can get all three classes, i.e. 142,143 and 144. Briefly Yorkshire can give you 142s and 144s and South Wales (mostly Cardiff Valleys) will give you 142s and 143s and Exeter will provide 143s.

Andrew Holland · 25 May 2019

southern442 said:
Strangely enough I find myself in the predicament (luxury?) of having never been on a Pacer before. Since they will probably start disappearing soon, I have decided I will rectify that issue over the summer.

Obviously there are loads of places where they operate. What I'm asking is where's the best place to travel to in order to get the full pacer experience? i.e. maximum discomfort perhaps?

If you come to Manchester you'll see no end of the bloody things. Specifically class 142s which you'll see on many services from Manchester Piccadilly and Victoria alike. I live in Wigan and can tell you that if you get a train from either Piccadilly or Victoria to Wigan you're likely to get one, especially on services out of Victoria.

Your post and username suggests you are actually a southern (like me). I moved to Manchester in 2005 and I recall clearly the moment I first got on Pacer, it was from Marple (having arrived there earlier by bus) and thought it was some kind of joke as the nodding donkey screeched and bounced its way back into Manchester. They truly are an experience to behold, amusing and shocking in equal measure to us southern folk. I recall at that time being a regular user of the Silverlink North London line just before I moved up and thinking then that the 313s were a bit old and tatty and need replacing. Just months later I would come to regard them as high-class and quality trains when compared to Pacers, the 142s really are that bad!

Edit: nearly forgot but the 142s were (and maybe still are, will someone in manc please confirm?) a common sight on the Manchester to Chester and Manchester to Sheffield routes. Given that Pacers were meant only for quiet rural/regional routes not for routes that link major towns/cities that are a considerable distance apart together, you'll get an epic and "feature length" pacer experience if you take either of those routes also.

Andrew Holland · 25 May 2019

BTW, I thought initially your post was asking what is the best place for them to go when they are replaced this year. I think I speak for most non-rail buffs when I say that only place they should go after replacement is to the scrap yard to be crushed with extreme prejudice!

Mikey C · 25 May 2019

I'd hate to travel regularly on them, but personally don't mind them for occasional "leisure" based journeys as you do get a great view out, unlike the 150s

southern442 · 25 May 2019

Andrew Holland said:
BTW, I thought initially your post was asking what is the best place for them to go when they are replaced this year. I think I speak for most non-rail buffs when I say that only place they should go after replacement is to the scrap yard to be crushed with extreme prejudice!

Good God no, I wouldn't dream of suggesting they be re-used (except for cans and other metal products) :lol:

And yes I am indeed from the south, the trains down here are far too okay-ish for my liking!

Andrew Holland · 25 May 2019

southern442 said:
Good God no, I wouldn't dream of suggesting they be re-used (except for cans and other metal products)

And yes I am indeed from the south, the trains down here are far too okay-ish for my liking!

Yeah I know that feeling. I grew up and lived for 30 years in Greenwich so 15 years or so were spoilt by the likes of class 465s (which I now realise are awesome, though at least the north has the 323s which look and sound similar) and the DLR. I was truly taken aback when I realised the kind of cattle trucks the government expects northerners to be thrown around in like something out of Star Trek's Enterprise being shot at by Klingons!

Which bit of the south are you from then or what is your usual class of train you're spoilt by?

southern442 · 25 May 2019

Andrew Holland said:
Which bit of the south are you from then or what is your usual class of train you're spoilt by?

Mainly class 377s - largely trustworthy and well-built units, perhaps I'll appreciate them even more after travelling on the pacers!

Dave91131 · 25 May 2019

I don't know if it's still 142-operated since the timetable change or if the calling pattern is still the same - but back in March I had a pair of 142's on the 1949 Manchester Piccadilly - Sheffield, booked non-stop from I think Chinley to Dore & Totley which made for a very lively run along the Hope Valley.

PHILIPE · 25 May 2019

Dave91131 said:
I don't know if it's still 142-operated since the timetable change or if the calling pattern is still the same - but back in March I had a pair of 142's on the 1949 Manchester Piccadilly - Sheffield, booked non-stop from I think Chinley to Dore & Totley which made for a very lively run along the Hope Valley.

They are common on a daily basis on the Hope Valley route

_toommm_ · 25 May 2019

Staples for 142s:
- Sheffield to Leeds via Rotherham or via Castleford
- Sheffield to Hull (local stopper)
- Sheffield to Manchester Picc (admittedly quite a nice ride because of the big windows - recommend)
- Manchester Picc to New Mills Central/Rose Hill
- Manchester Picc to Chester via Altrincham
- Stalybridge to Victoria/Wigan NW (often 2x 142 or 150+142)
- Leeds to Knottingley

143s:
- Valley Lines (Cardiff)
- Exeter/Plymouth Locals

144s:
- Sheffield to Huddersfield - almost always three cars.

Roger100 · 25 May 2019

The best trip must be Sunday's 10:54 from Carlisle to Whitby, nearly 150 miles and if you stay on the train you can come all the way back again, arriving in Carlisle at 20:27. £34.50 anytime return. Often a 142 but sometimes a 156.

Otherwise loads of Pacers in the North East.

cactustwirly · 25 May 2019

_toommm_ said:
Staples for 142s:
- Sheffield to Leeds via Rotherham or via Castleford
- Sheffield to Hull (local stopper)
- Sheffield to Manchester Picc (admittedly quite a nice ride because of the big windows - recommend)
- Manchester Picc to New Mills Central/Rose Hill
- Manchester Picc to Chester via Altrincham
- Stalybridge to Victoria/Wigan NW (often 2x 142 or 150+142)
- Leeds to Knottingley

143s:
- Valley Lines (Cardiff)
- Exeter/Plymouth Locals

144s:
- Sheffield to Huddersfield - almost always three cars.

Leeds to Knottingley is mainly 144s from what I've seen

Marton · 25 May 2019

Roger100 said:
The best trip must be Sunday's 10:54 from Carlisle to Whitby, nearly 150 miles and if you stay on the train you can come all the way back again, arriving in Carlisle at 20:27. £34.50 anytime return. Often a 142 but sometimes a 156.

Otherwise loads of Pacers in the North East.

158s now on some Whitby services. Even though not yet refurbished they are ⭐️ No screeching and so much quieter (other than AirCon noise).

NorthernSpirit · 25 May 2019

Some of the Leeds to Morecambe services are often (well when I've used them they are) operated by class 142's, quite a lively run between Shipley and Leeds. Some of the new Huddersfield to Castleford services are operated by Pacers, expect a very bouncy ride as one passes over Horbury Junction and some of the Calder Valley Line services (usually the Leeds to Huddersfield via Brighouse service) are operated by them.

As a Northerner I am quite fond of the Pacers and will miss them when they have gone, primarily because of the bouncy ride.

anamyd · 25 May 2019

southern442 said:
Strangely enough I find myself in the predicament (luxury?) of having never been on a Pacer before. Since they will probably start disappearing soon, I have decided I will rectify that issue over the summer.

Obviously there are loads of places where they operate. What I'm asking is where's the best place to travel to in order to get the full pacer experience? i.e. maximum discomfort perhaps?

I'm in the same position as you. I'll sort of be rectifying that on the 19th of June when I sample the Welsh 142s and 143s, but they have fancy Chapman high back seats in them. Northern "bus bench seat" 142s are probably your best bet for the closest to original experience as possible (minus the 90s engine/gearbox/door/access upgrades), but I don't know how many of Northern's 79 (!) 142s have such seats in them.

Dave91131 · 25 May 2019

anamyd said:
I'm in the same position as you. I'll sort of be rectifying that on the 19th of June when I sample the Welsh 142s and 143s, but they have fancy Chapman high back seats in them. Northern "bus bench seat" 142s are probably your best bet for the closest to original experience as possible (minus the 90s engine/gearbox/door/access upgrades), but I don't know how many of Northern's 79 (!) 142s have such seats in them.

To my knowledge 041-049 and 051-058 have the 3+2 individual low-back seats. These are the ex Merseyside units which I think also still have the larger (dot matrix I think) destination screens above the cab windows.

The ex Northern Spirit units (a few examples which spring to mind are I think 015-020, 050, 066 and most if not all in the 08x and 09x number range) have the individual 2+2 high back seating.

The remainder have the bus benches.

So out of 79 there are 17 with the 3+2 individual seating, then I'd guess roughly 30 of each of the remaining 62 with bus benches and 2+2 high-back.

Specific info for each unit is I dare say available in a platform 5 book for example.

Hope this helps.

anamyd · 25 May 2019

Dave91131 said:
To my knowledge 041-049 and 051-058 have the 3+2 individual low-back seats. These are the ex Merseyside units which I think also still have the larger (dot matrix I think) destination screens above the cab windows.

The ex Northern Spirit units (a few examples which spring to mind are I think 015-020, 050, 066 and most if not all in the 08x and 09x number range) have the individual 2+2 high back seating.

The remainder have the bus benches.

So out of 79 there are 17 with the 3+2 individual seating, then I'd guess roughly 30 of each of the remaining 62 with bus benches and 2+2 high-back.

Specific info for each unit is I dare say available in a platform 5 book for example.

Hope this helps.

Yes that's great info and thanks for taking the time to write that! It may come in useful for the original poster too

Dave91131 · 25 May 2019

anamyd said:
Yes that's great info and thanks for taking the time to write that! It may come in useful for the original poster too

No problem.

I shall be in Wales in the near future too, possibly even during the. same week you mention you are.

I got my last 2 Northern 142's for travel earlier this week, just 4 Cardiff ones left now.

61653 HTAFC · 25 May 2019

NorthernSpirit said:
Some of the Leeds to Morecambe services are often (well when I've used them they are) operated by class 142's, quite a lively run between Shipley and Leeds. Some of the new Huddersfield to Castleford services are operated by Pacers, expect a very bouncy ride as one passes over Horbury Junction and some of the Calder Valley Line services (usually the Leeds to Huddersfield via Brighouse service) are operated by them.

As a Northerner I am quite fond of the Pacers and will miss them when they have gone, primarily because of the bouncy ride.

Since the timetable change I've noticed more Pacers in the Huddersfield to Leeds via Bradford than previously, but still can be anything from 142-158. Have only seen 153s on Huddersfield to Castleford, though 2-car Pacers could do it (as could 2-car 150s).

Huddersfield to Sheffield was mentioned upthread, during the week it's solid 3-car 144 territory with the odd 2-car 144 or 142 thrown in. The late night Northbound services occasionally throw a 158. At weekends you're more likely to get something other than a 144.

P.S. upon seeing this thread I was poised to suggest they be dumped in the sea off the coast of Dawlish, to help protect the sea wall!

Chris217 · 26 May 2019

The Exeter 143s with GWR
Normally operate
Exmouth-Barnstaple via Exeter
and Exeter-Paignton services.
I still need 143 609.

Good luck on your hunt.

peri · 26 May 2019

Just wondering which route would provide the absolute best/worst pacer experience (including the low back seats of course).

_toommm_ · 26 May 2019

peri said:
Just wondering which route would provide the absolute best/worst pacer experience (including the low back seats of course).

The Hope Valley provides the best experience - with the bench seats and big bus windows, you get great views, and as it's a local stopper, you get more time to enjoy them.

xotGD · 26 May 2019

If you can get one on a Leeds - Southport turn that would be a test of endurance.

Man Pic to Oxford Road is plenty far enough before you escape the suffering.

Killingworth · 26 May 2019

PHILIPE said:
They are common on a daily basis on the Hope Valley route

Unless you count on them! Mostly 150s and an odd 156 now. Even then they have difficulty coping with the peak hour loads.

I did get a double Pacer last Tuesday for the 16.49 out of Piccadilly. Absolutely rammed full following cancellation of preceding fast East Midlands and following TPE fast services! That's usually a Pacer formed train, although many days the lead unit is a 150.

Despite what some may say about them, Hope Valley users have a love hate relationship with Pacers. We love any train that turns up. We're from the north, rugged folks from the hills, used to walking long distances in all weathers. All the fancy furnishings and electronic gadgetry on newer trains doesn't make them come on time, or on many days come at all. We can put up with Pacers a bit longer - but please can Network Rail sort out the tracks so we can at least have a reliable hourly service to all stations? The current skip stopping is a total pain.

I'd point out that the Hope Valley line stations are all in the worst 100 in the country for punctuality of trains, and we don't blame the poor Pacers for that.

GrahamD83 · 26 May 2019

Can anyone advise on the best place to spot Newton Heath's pacers, other than Manchester? What's the closes to the North East? I have seen the odd one in York before but not very often.

xotGD · 27 May 2019

GrahamD83 said:
Can anyone advise on the best place to spot Newton Heath's pacers, other than Manchester? What's the closes to the North East? I have seen the odd one in York before but not very often.

You would see a few in Leeds.

Dave91131 · 27 May 2019

Just to add a bit more info for the OP - I believe that the new hourly Sheffield - Gainsborough Central service is also a regular for Pacers as this inter-works with the Sheffield - Hull and Sheffield Adwick services.

47403 · 27 May 2019

The scrap yard!!! In all seriousness, the lads have given you all the gen you need and really can't add no more. A weeks Freedom of the North East covers most of the areas Newcastle, Darlington, York, Leeds, Sheffield, Doncaster and a return to Manchester from Huddersfield will cover most of the bouncing bombs stronghold.
Theres some NH bouncing bombs end up in Leeds, Sheffield and Doncaster, even Carlisle at times. Preston is a good bet for a few of them too.

Chris217 · 27 May 2019

The scrap yard?
None have gone there yet.
In all seriousness,that was not helpful.

I wouldn't worry about chasing them just yet. They will become BBC headline news on 1st January 2020...as they will still be in service lol.

Best place for Pacers?

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