Actually, that letter in between strikes me as the most serious part of this - suggesting that somebody at the company might actively have put into place a process to obtain money by disregarding the regulatory framework under which it operates - maladministration or even fraud, perhaps? How could anyone implement the regulations - the sole requirement of the job here - without reading them and therefore knowing they would be deceiving any recipients of the letter? Depending on the company's explanation, there might be grounds to open a criminal investigation here, or at least for the DfT to issue a franchise breach notice and to see that all cases are reviewed and compensation issued as appropriate to everyone who has been affected.
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Appealed for ticket fine denied even thought wrong ££ amount charged
- Thread starter king100011
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Can you imagine the response in reverse if you had sent a message before the end of your appeal deadline saying "I intend to appeal but I'm too busy to do this at the moment. If you don't get my appeal within 3 weeks from now, please get in touch to remind me!" ?
Just an analogy.
A relative overstayed the free period his blue badge entitled him to, on double yellows near his home (because there was no available parking closer to his home at the time due to residents using bins and cones to block resident bays). He was still in the wrong but appealed informally. This was rejected and he was told to pay the lower rate or wait for a NTO to appeal again. He wanted to make his make his noise upto the adjudicator.
When the NTO eventually came, he appealed again using the same grounds. He didn't get his chance to go before the adjudicator because his appeal was allowed for procedural irregularity, not his original grounds. It transpired,
1. The PCN was issued in the wrong amount
2. The NTO was also out of time.
My relative believes the council gave up because they would embarrass thelmselves before an adjucator. I like to think someone in the council (or likely their outsourced contractors) realised they had no right or authority to pursue him.
No one suggested he should pay an amended amount nor that the council are busy and had a right to delay their communication.
Frankly, I do think the OP or someone should ask the TOC and/or its appeals body, to explain the authority they have to amend Penalty Fare Regulations, which they are clearly doing, with a copy to the DFT.
A relative overstayed the free period his blue badge entitled him to, on double yellows near his home (because there was no available parking closer to his home at the time due to residents using bins and cones to block resident bays). He was still in the wrong but appealed informally. This was rejected and he was told to pay the lower rate or wait for a NTO to appeal again. He wanted to make his make his noise upto the adjudicator.
When the NTO eventually came, he appealed again using the same grounds. He didn't get his chance to go before the adjudicator because his appeal was allowed for procedural irregularity, not his original grounds. It transpired,
1. The PCN was issued in the wrong amount
2. The NTO was also out of time.
My relative believes the council gave up because they would embarrass thelmselves before an adjucator. I like to think someone in the council (or likely their outsourced contractors) realised they had no right or authority to pursue him.
No one suggested he should pay an amended amount nor that the council are busy and had a right to delay their communication.
Frankly, I do think the OP or someone should ask the TOC and/or its appeals body, to explain the authority they have to amend Penalty Fare Regulations, which they are clearly doing, with a copy to the DFT.
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Is there now an argument that the operator's appeal arrangements do not themselves comply with the regulations and therefore no penalty fare can be issued to anybody at the moment and everyone who paid may be granted an automatic refund?
The Appeal Procedure includes the 21 day requirement, amongst other things that might also have been breached.
Is it possible the company could be held to have failed to make such arrangements by substituting its own variation of the Appeal Procedure, including an extended time limit and an entitlement to vary the amount of the penalty on the original notice? I cannot understand how that 'in between' letter could have been sent by any company that provides an appeals service designed to satisfy the specific regulations that are in force.
The Appeal Procedure includes the 21 day requirement, amongst other things that might also have been breached.
Is it possible the company could be held to have failed to make such arrangements by substituting its own variation of the Appeal Procedure, including an extended time limit and an entitlement to vary the amount of the penalty on the original notice? I cannot understand how that 'in between' letter could have been sent by any company that provides an appeals service designed to satisfy the specific regulations that are in force.
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king100011
Member
- Joined
- 20 May 2019
- Messages
- 23
Furlong
As you can see I am really bad in writing letters. I can try and drafty a letter of complaint concerning issues raised above and would happily send them out.
Am thinking DFT in general, Minister of Transport, My local MP, Watchdog, Transport Focus and MSE.
As you can see I am really bad in writing letters. I can try and drafty a letter of complaint concerning issues raised above and would happily send them out.
Am thinking DFT in general, Minister of Transport, My local MP, Watchdog, Transport Focus and MSE.
king100011
Member
- Joined
- 20 May 2019
- Messages
- 23
Formal Letter of Complaint
To Whom it may concern
Please accept this letter as a formal complaint against the Appeal Service.
I believe that the Appeal Service is in breach The Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 in numerous situations.
The Appeals Service must abide by these regulations to the letter yet they seem to changing them to suit their own requirements.
In my case the Appeals Service has breached the following -
Schedule 2-6. Where an Appeal Panel receives an appeal under regulation 16 or 17, it must decide whether to allow or not allow the appeal before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the appeal is received.
I appealed on the 01/04/2019, 2 weeks later I received this letter. See Attachment 1.
Thank you for your correspondence concerning the issue of the above referenced Penalty Fare.
This case is currently on hold and is awaiting full assessment. We are currently experiencing a high level of
appeals and apologise for the delay. We are committed to ensuring your appeal is fully investigated and, on
occasion, this can take extra time to investigate.
All communication received within AS is dealt with in order of date received, a full response will be issued as soon
as possible. If you have not received a response within 3 weeks of the date of this letter please contact us at the
address above, or through the website www.appealservice.co.uk.
Then on the 4th May I received another letter denying my appeal. See Attachment 2.
Thank you for your correspondence concerning the above referenced Penalty Fare Notice issued by Greater
Anglia on Monday 01 April 2019.
The Appeals Service (AS) is not associated with Greater Anglia. AS provide a service which gives the recipient of
a Penalty Fare Notice the opportunity to dispute the issue. To ensure consistency, AS follow a Code of Practice
compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 when making assessments of
Penalty Fare Notice appeals.
All transport companies operating a Penalty Fare scheme display warning notices which advise transport users of
their obligations and the potential consequences in failing to meet these.
The transport user is required to show on request a valid ticket. A ticket is evidence of permission to make a rail
journey and it is the passenger's responsibility to keep it safe. It is the ticket, not the receipt, which permits travel.
Tickets or receipts produced at a later date in support of an appeal will not be considered.
On assessment your appeal has been declined.
Payment of £43.80 must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options and information
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed with this response.
IMPORTANT: Please note that failure to pay or further appeal within this stated time may result in Greater Anglia
taking further action to recover the outstanding debt.
Finally, as an appeals service which is independent of Greater Anglia we are unable to investigate complaints
concerning Greater Anglia service or staff conduct. Please therefore contact Greater Anglia direct with your
requests and concerns.
As you can see the response was not within the stated 21 days.
There is no regulation allowing As Appeals to extend this 21 days in the regulations, as the response was over 21 days the appeal should have been accepted.
After further reading I realised that the amount charged for the fine was more than the regulation states to charge
9.—(1) Where a penalty fare is charged under regulation 5(1) to a person travelling by, present on, or leaving a train, the amount of that penalty fare is £20 or twice the full single fare applicable, whichever is greater.
I was charged £43.80 as advised in the above letter, but the correct penatly charge was actually £42.80, this alone should have been enough for the appeal to be granted yet the appeals service decided that the penalty charge would be reduced to the correct charge and that the penalty charge stands. Please see below for the letter. Attachment 3.
Thank you for your further appeal in respect of the above referenced Penalty Fare Notice issued by Greater
Anglia.
The function of the Appeals Service (AS) is to examine the circumstances surrounding why a notice has been
issued. As previously advised, to ensure fairness and consistency when making assessments, AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018.
All transport companies operating a Penalty Fare scheme display warning notices which advise transport users of
their obligations and the potential consequences in failing to meet these. These warning notices confirm that you
are required to purchase a valid ticket for your journey prior to boarding the train or you may be liable to a Penalty
Fare.
The transport user is required to show on request a valid ticket. When travelling on Greater Anglia Trains, you
must be able to produce a ticket at all times during travel. It is the production of your ticket which permits travel.
Whilst I acknowledge you had purchased a ticket as you were unable to produce the ticket, the inspector was
correct to issue a Penalty Fare. Copies of the ticket, receipts and bank statements produced at a later date cannot
be considered.
Transport Focus is the official watchdog organisation representing the interests of transport users outside London.
Although unable to overrule the decision made by AS, Transport Focus can consider whether due process has
been followed. They can be contacted at Freepost RTEH-XAGE-BYKZ, PO Box 5594, Southend on Sea SS1
9PZ, telephone 0300 123 2350, email [email protected], website www.transportfocus.org.uk
I acknowledge the points raised by yourself and this case has been fully reviewed. Being confident that AS have
followed the correct procedure, I can confirm that our initial decision remains and payment of the outstanding
balance of £42.80 is now due. The Penalty fare amount has been reduced by £1.00 as the penalty fare should of
been charged at £42.80.
If you are still dissatisfied, a further appeal can be made within 14 days of the date of this letter, clearly quoting the
notice number on all communications, to the Independent Appeals Panel (IAP). You may do this online at
www.appealservice.co.uk, send by fax to 0844 544 8454 or by post to IAP, PO Box 267, Petersfield GU32 9FH.
Payment, or further appeal, must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed in this response.
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to admend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that "AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018" which they clearly dont.
This is of serious concern as the appeals service themselves do no comply with the these regulations and therefore no penalty charge can be issued to anybody at the moment. Any historical fines that have had their appeals denied would be due a refund if the response was not within 21 days. They have substituted their own variation of the appeals procedure, including extending the time limit and an entitlement to vary the amount of the penatly charge notice.
Please note this letter has been sent to the following
To Whom it may concern
Please accept this letter as a formal complaint against the Appeal Service.
I believe that the Appeal Service is in breach The Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 in numerous situations.
The Appeals Service must abide by these regulations to the letter yet they seem to changing them to suit their own requirements.
In my case the Appeals Service has breached the following -
Schedule 2-6. Where an Appeal Panel receives an appeal under regulation 16 or 17, it must decide whether to allow or not allow the appeal before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the appeal is received.
I appealed on the 01/04/2019, 2 weeks later I received this letter. See Attachment 1.
Thank you for your correspondence concerning the issue of the above referenced Penalty Fare.
This case is currently on hold and is awaiting full assessment. We are currently experiencing a high level of
appeals and apologise for the delay. We are committed to ensuring your appeal is fully investigated and, on
occasion, this can take extra time to investigate.
All communication received within AS is dealt with in order of date received, a full response will be issued as soon
as possible. If you have not received a response within 3 weeks of the date of this letter please contact us at the
address above, or through the website www.appealservice.co.uk.
Then on the 4th May I received another letter denying my appeal. See Attachment 2.
Thank you for your correspondence concerning the above referenced Penalty Fare Notice issued by Greater
Anglia on Monday 01 April 2019.
The Appeals Service (AS) is not associated with Greater Anglia. AS provide a service which gives the recipient of
a Penalty Fare Notice the opportunity to dispute the issue. To ensure consistency, AS follow a Code of Practice
compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 when making assessments of
Penalty Fare Notice appeals.
All transport companies operating a Penalty Fare scheme display warning notices which advise transport users of
their obligations and the potential consequences in failing to meet these.
The transport user is required to show on request a valid ticket. A ticket is evidence of permission to make a rail
journey and it is the passenger's responsibility to keep it safe. It is the ticket, not the receipt, which permits travel.
Tickets or receipts produced at a later date in support of an appeal will not be considered.
On assessment your appeal has been declined.
Payment of £43.80 must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options and information
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed with this response.
IMPORTANT: Please note that failure to pay or further appeal within this stated time may result in Greater Anglia
taking further action to recover the outstanding debt.
Finally, as an appeals service which is independent of Greater Anglia we are unable to investigate complaints
concerning Greater Anglia service or staff conduct. Please therefore contact Greater Anglia direct with your
requests and concerns.
As you can see the response was not within the stated 21 days.
There is no regulation allowing As Appeals to extend this 21 days in the regulations, as the response was over 21 days the appeal should have been accepted.
After further reading I realised that the amount charged for the fine was more than the regulation states to charge
9.—(1) Where a penalty fare is charged under regulation 5(1) to a person travelling by, present on, or leaving a train, the amount of that penalty fare is £20 or twice the full single fare applicable, whichever is greater.
I was charged £43.80 as advised in the above letter, but the correct penatly charge was actually £42.80, this alone should have been enough for the appeal to be granted yet the appeals service decided that the penalty charge would be reduced to the correct charge and that the penalty charge stands. Please see below for the letter. Attachment 3.
Thank you for your further appeal in respect of the above referenced Penalty Fare Notice issued by Greater
Anglia.
The function of the Appeals Service (AS) is to examine the circumstances surrounding why a notice has been
issued. As previously advised, to ensure fairness and consistency when making assessments, AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018.
All transport companies operating a Penalty Fare scheme display warning notices which advise transport users of
their obligations and the potential consequences in failing to meet these. These warning notices confirm that you
are required to purchase a valid ticket for your journey prior to boarding the train or you may be liable to a Penalty
Fare.
The transport user is required to show on request a valid ticket. When travelling on Greater Anglia Trains, you
must be able to produce a ticket at all times during travel. It is the production of your ticket which permits travel.
Whilst I acknowledge you had purchased a ticket as you were unable to produce the ticket, the inspector was
correct to issue a Penalty Fare. Copies of the ticket, receipts and bank statements produced at a later date cannot
be considered.
Transport Focus is the official watchdog organisation representing the interests of transport users outside London.
Although unable to overrule the decision made by AS, Transport Focus can consider whether due process has
been followed. They can be contacted at Freepost RTEH-XAGE-BYKZ, PO Box 5594, Southend on Sea SS1
9PZ, telephone 0300 123 2350, email [email protected], website www.transportfocus.org.uk
I acknowledge the points raised by yourself and this case has been fully reviewed. Being confident that AS have
followed the correct procedure, I can confirm that our initial decision remains and payment of the outstanding
balance of £42.80 is now due. The Penalty fare amount has been reduced by £1.00 as the penalty fare should of
been charged at £42.80.
If you are still dissatisfied, a further appeal can be made within 14 days of the date of this letter, clearly quoting the
notice number on all communications, to the Independent Appeals Panel (IAP). You may do this online at
www.appealservice.co.uk, send by fax to 0844 544 8454 or by post to IAP, PO Box 267, Petersfield GU32 9FH.
Payment, or further appeal, must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed in this response.
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to admend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that "AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018" which they clearly dont.
This is of serious concern as the appeals service themselves do no comply with the these regulations and therefore no penalty charge can be issued to anybody at the moment. Any historical fines that have had their appeals denied would be due a refund if the response was not within 21 days. They have substituted their own variation of the appeals procedure, including extending the time limit and an entitlement to vary the amount of the penatly charge notice.
Please note this letter has been sent to the following
I realise you have included the attachments in full in the text above for our benefit.
It would help the recipients of the letter immensely - and therefore benefit you - if the letter itself could be read in a way that made sense on its own. Could you summarise the content of each reply in a sentence or two? Obviously attach the replies in full as well.
You might be wise not to send your letter until your final appeal is concluded, as otherwise the recipients will likely refer it back down the food chain.
It would help the recipients of the letter immensely - and therefore benefit you - if the letter itself could be read in a way that made sense on its own. Could you summarise the content of each reply in a sentence or two? Obviously attach the replies in full as well.
You might be wise not to send your letter until your final appeal is concluded, as otherwise the recipients will likely refer it back down the food chain.
ForTheLoveOf
Established Member
- Joined
- 7 Oct 2017
- Messages
- 6,416
Agreed; it is better to wait until the Penalty Fare at hand is resolved rather than to "kick the hornet's nest" now.
king100011
Member
- Joined
- 20 May 2019
- Messages
- 23
Edited Version
Formal Letter of Complaint
To Whom it may concern
Please accept this letter as a formal complaint against the Appeal Service.
I believe that the Appeal Service is in breach The Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 in numerous situations.
The Appeals Service must abide by these regulations to the letter yet they seem to changing them to suit their own requirements.
In my case the Appeals Service has breached the following -
Issue 1
Schedule 2-6. Where an Appeal Panel receives an appeal under regulation 16 or 17, it must decide whether to allow or not allow the appeal before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the appeal is received.
I appealed on the 01/04/2019, 2 weeks later I received this letter. See Attachment 1.
"If you have not received a response within 3 weeks of the date of this letter please contact us at the
address above, or through the website www.appealservice.co.uk."
Allowing the Appeals Service a total of 5 weeks to review my appeal.
Then on the 4th May I received another letter denying my appeal. See Attachment 2.
"Payment of £43.80 must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options and information
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed with this response."
As you can see the response to my 1st Appeal under Section 16 was not within the stated 21 days, by responding to an appeal under section 16 over the 21 days this is in breach of Schedule 2 Section 6.
The operator, in this case As Appeals has not satisfied the appeals requirements above.
14.—(1) Where, at any time, an operator does not satisfy the appeals requirements the operator must ensure that a collector authorised by the operator does not charge a penalty fare on the operator’s behalf.
Therefore in this case the appeal should have been accepted.
There is no regulation allowing As Appeals to extend this 21 days in the regulations.
Issue 2
After further reading I realised that the amount charged for the fine was more than the regulation states to charge
9.—(1) Where a penalty fare is charged under regulation 5(1) to a person travelling by, present on, or leaving a train, the amount of that penalty fare is £20 or twice the full single fare applicable, whichever is greater.
I was charged £43.80 as advised in the above, but the correct penalty charge was actually £42.80, this alone should have been enough for the appeal to be granted yet the appeals service decided that the penalty charge would be reduced to the correct charge and that the penalty charge stands. Please see below for the letter. Attachment 3.
"I acknowledge the points raised by yourself and this case has been fully reviewed. Being confident that AS have
followed the correct procedure, I can confirm that our initial decision remains and payment of the outstanding
balance of £42.80 is now due. The Penalty fare amount has been reduced by £1.00 as the penalty fare should of
been charged at £42.80."
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to amend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that
"AS follow a Code of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018"
which they clearly dont.
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to admend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that "AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018" which they clearly dont.
Issue 3
Full payment options including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed in this response.
Schedule 2 Section 12 states
Where an Appeal Panel notifies its decision not to allow an appeal under regulation 17 it must provide the appellant with a statement that—
(b)the operator will be entitled to commence court proceedings to recover the penalty fare if the appellant does not—
No details are in the letter stating that the operator will be entitled to commence court proceedings to recover the penalty fare if I do not pay the fine.
This is of serious concern as the appeals service are not complying with the these regulations and therefore no penalty charge can be issued to anybody at the moment. Any historical fines that have had their appeals denied would be due a refund if the response was not within 21 days. They have substituted their own variation of the appeals procedure, including extending the time limit, an entitlement to vary the amount of the penalty charge notice and not informing the appellant of their payment options or entitlement of the operator to commerce court proceedings
Please note this letter has been sent to the following
Think thats better?
Yes not going to send until I get the 3rd appeal denied
lol
Formal Letter of Complaint
To Whom it may concern
Please accept this letter as a formal complaint against the Appeal Service.
I believe that the Appeal Service is in breach The Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 in numerous situations.
The Appeals Service must abide by these regulations to the letter yet they seem to changing them to suit their own requirements.
In my case the Appeals Service has breached the following -
Issue 1
Schedule 2-6. Where an Appeal Panel receives an appeal under regulation 16 or 17, it must decide whether to allow or not allow the appeal before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the appeal is received.
I appealed on the 01/04/2019, 2 weeks later I received this letter. See Attachment 1.
"If you have not received a response within 3 weeks of the date of this letter please contact us at the
address above, or through the website www.appealservice.co.uk."
Allowing the Appeals Service a total of 5 weeks to review my appeal.
Then on the 4th May I received another letter denying my appeal. See Attachment 2.
"Payment of £43.80 must be received within 14 days of the date of this letter. Full payment options and information
including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed with this response."
As you can see the response to my 1st Appeal under Section 16 was not within the stated 21 days, by responding to an appeal under section 16 over the 21 days this is in breach of Schedule 2 Section 6.
The operator, in this case As Appeals has not satisfied the appeals requirements above.
14.—(1) Where, at any time, an operator does not satisfy the appeals requirements the operator must ensure that a collector authorised by the operator does not charge a penalty fare on the operator’s behalf.
Therefore in this case the appeal should have been accepted.
There is no regulation allowing As Appeals to extend this 21 days in the regulations.
Issue 2
After further reading I realised that the amount charged for the fine was more than the regulation states to charge
9.—(1) Where a penalty fare is charged under regulation 5(1) to a person travelling by, present on, or leaving a train, the amount of that penalty fare is £20 or twice the full single fare applicable, whichever is greater.
I was charged £43.80 as advised in the above, but the correct penalty charge was actually £42.80, this alone should have been enough for the appeal to be granted yet the appeals service decided that the penalty charge would be reduced to the correct charge and that the penalty charge stands. Please see below for the letter. Attachment 3.
"I acknowledge the points raised by yourself and this case has been fully reviewed. Being confident that AS have
followed the correct procedure, I can confirm that our initial decision remains and payment of the outstanding
balance of £42.80 is now due. The Penalty fare amount has been reduced by £1.00 as the penalty fare should of
been charged at £42.80."
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to amend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that
"AS follow a Code of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018"
which they clearly dont.
Nowhere in the regulations does it allow for the appeals service to admend a penalty charge, they even state in the letter stating that "AS follow a Code
of Practice compliant with the criteria set out in the Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018" which they clearly dont.
Issue 3
Full payment options including, what will happen if you do not pay, are detailed in this response.
Schedule 2 Section 12 states
Where an Appeal Panel notifies its decision not to allow an appeal under regulation 17 it must provide the appellant with a statement that—
(b)the operator will be entitled to commence court proceedings to recover the penalty fare if the appellant does not—
No details are in the letter stating that the operator will be entitled to commence court proceedings to recover the penalty fare if I do not pay the fine.
This is of serious concern as the appeals service are not complying with the these regulations and therefore no penalty charge can be issued to anybody at the moment. Any historical fines that have had their appeals denied would be due a refund if the response was not within 21 days. They have substituted their own variation of the appeals procedure, including extending the time limit, an entitlement to vary the amount of the penalty charge notice and not informing the appellant of their payment options or entitlement of the operator to commerce court proceedings
Please note this letter has been sent to the following
Think thats better?
Yes not going to send until I get the 3rd appeal denied
lolBelperpete
Established Member
- Joined
- 17 Aug 2018
- Messages
- 1,650
I note that the regulations say that the appeals body has 21 days in which to decide whether or not to allow the appeal. From the extracts that you have quoted, it does not appear to say that it has to inform you of its decision within 21 days. In which case, it could make its decision on the 21st day, and inform you of that decision anytime later, and still be compliant.
king100011
Member
- Joined
- 20 May 2019
- Messages
- 23
And we have an answer to my 3rd and final appeal.
APPEAL ACCEPTED
Thanks for all the help.
Now to file the complaint.
APPEAL ACCEPTED
Thanks for all the help.
Now to file the complaint.
gray1404
Established Member
What was the full wording of the result of the Third Appeal out of interest? Glad it was finally accepted.
jumble
Member
- Joined
- 1 Jul 2011
- Messages
- 1,110
It is great that it occurred to the person managing the final the appeal that they should implement Parliament's intentions
Adam Williams
Established Member
Hopefully the complaint is taken seriously.king100011
Member
- Joined
- 20 May 2019
- Messages
- 23
Dear Sir / Madam,
I am hereby submitting an third stage appeal under Regulation 18 of The Railways (Penalty Fares) Regulations 2018 against Penalty Fare no. GA on the following two grounds.
(1) The Appeals Panel has previously accepted, in response to my second stage appeal under Regulation 17, that the Penalty Fare was issued for an incorrect amount, as it was not issued for the amount which Regulation 9(1) prescribes.
This means that the Appeals Panel was satisfied that a ground for appeal under Regulation 16(3)(a) applied - being that the Penalty Fare was not charged in accordance with the requirements of the Regulations.
The Appeals Panel was not permitted to attempt to vary the Penalty Fare after it had been issued, and neither is it within the remit of the Final Appeal Panel to do so; Regulation 18(4), analogous to Regulation 17(4) for the second stage appeal, is explicitly clear that:
"If the relevant Final Appeal Panel, after considering an appeal under this regulation, concludes that any ground specified in regulation 16(3) applies, it must, subject to paragraph (7), allow the appeal."
Accordingly, I am not liable to pay the Penalty Fare, as it is clear that a ground for appeal under Regulation 16(3)(a) exists.
(2) Furthermore, paragraph 6 of Schedule 2 of the Regulations required the Appeals Panel, in respect of my first stage appeal under Regulation 16, to:
"decide whether to allow or not allow the appeal before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the appeal is received."
The Appeals Panel failed to do so; I submitted my appeal on 01/04/2019 but the Appeals Panel only made its decision about my appeal on 04/05/2019. This is substantially longer than the permitted period of 21 days.
Whilst the Appeals Panel gave an interim response stating that my appeal was "awaiting assessment", there is no provision in the Regulations for the time period of 21 days (for the Appeals Panel to respond) to be extended for any reason.
Regulation 16(11)(b) provides that:
"Where the relevant Appeal Panel [...] fails to adhere to the time period specified in paragraph 6 of Schedule 2, the appellant is not liable to pay the penalty fare in question."
Accordingly, I am not liable to pay the Penalty Fare, due to the provisions of Regulation 16(11)(b).
I await your appeal response confirming that my appeal has been upheld.
- Status