Woman asked to give up seat on train for child.

Neil Polo · 10 Jun 2019

Here is a link to a news article I came across a day or two ago. What do people think about this? I would not have done so, I think there is to much deference to children these days. I'm
interested to know the general
opinion(s) on the forum.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/lon...-seat-on-the-tube-for-young-boy-a4159306.html

A woman has sparked a debate on tube etiquette after giving up her seat on the London Underground for a young boy.

The woman involved said the boy's mother asked her to let her son sit down because he was "just a child".

She later questioned whether she made the right decision.

The post led to some debating in what circumstance an adult should give up a seat for a child, while others shared their experiences of being asked to stand.

Describing the incident on Reddit, the woman said: “On the busy tube and managed to get a seat when a woman tells me give my seat to her son because ‘he’s just a child’.

“He looked 10 years old and she didn’t say he needed a seat for any particular reason.

“I stared at her in disbelief and didn’t even know what to say and then she raised her voice at me and told to get up. So I just got up and looked around and everyone seemed just as mystified.

RailUK Forums

PHILIPE · 10 Jun 2019

I have travelled into Cardiff from the Valleys on a Saturday and adults, including pensioners, standing with seats all along the carriage occupied by young children sitting with their parents.

TUC · 10 Jun 2019

Londoners agonising yet again about situations that (whether someone would give up a seat or not) would pass without comment elsewhere.

Ianno87 · 10 Jun 2019

Young children can be unsteady on their feet or unable to reach something to grab. They can also get tired very easily. So sitting down can be reasonable.

Robertj21a · 10 Jun 2019

Being London, I would say that the mother was very lucky to not receive a torrent of well-deserved abuse. It's utterly absurd (unless disabled etc) and these arrogant people need to be put in their place. A child is perfectly capable of standing, holding on as necessary.

AlterEgo · 10 Jun 2019

Children should stand. I used to.

Scottychoo · 10 Jun 2019

This weak woman should have stayed sitting and told the mother where to go, why can't people stand up(no pun intended) for themselves these days?

PeterC · 10 Jun 2019

I have given up my seat to a man carrying a toddler but at 10 I had already been told that I should give up my seat to a lady if necessary.

Bletchleyite · 10 Jun 2019

AlterEgo said:
Children should stand. I used to.

Children usually want to stand, it's fun at that age

Mag_seven · 10 Jun 2019

AlterEgo said:
Children should stand. I used to.

My mother always used to say to me that children should not occupy seats when adults were standing. Was she right?

holl1984 · 10 Jun 2019

Winds me up this sort of stuff does. My 7 year old suffers from hypermobility and low muscle tone and very often finds standing painful. He would be mortified if I asked someone to give up their seat for him! In fact he’s normally the first up and offering his seat if we’re on busy public transport

Ianno87 · 10 Jun 2019

Robertj21a said:
Being London, I would say that the mother was very lucky to not receive a torrent of well-deserved abuse. It's utterly absurd (unless disabled etc) and these arrogant people need to be put in their place. A child is perfectly capable of standing, holding on as necessary.

AlterEgo said:
Children should stand. I used to.

Bletchleyite said:
Children usually want to stand, it's fun at that age

Mag_seven said:
My mother always used to say to me that children should not occupy seats when adults were standing. Was she right?

Then cue lots of tutting and glances when child falls over and starts crying....

Or even better, people then complaining said non-sitting young children are moving around and bothering them.

There's no pleasing some miserable people.

radamfi · 10 Jun 2019

I'm sure buses in the 80s used to have signs saying that children should not occupy seats when adults are standing, or words to that effect. However, buses allowed smoking upstairs in the 80s, so just because something was OK back then, doesn't mean it is OK now.

Ianno87 · 10 Jun 2019

radamfi said:
I'm sure buses in the 80s used to have signs saying that children should not occupy seats when adults are standing, or words to that effect. However, buses allowed smoking upstairs in the 80s, so just because something was OK back then, doesn't mean it is OK now.

We did rationing in the 40s and 50s. Should we go back to that too?

Bald Rick · 10 Jun 2019

As a colleague once said to the RMT area rep when the latter was arguing against a minor change in working practice because “we’ve always done it this way”... “yes but we always used to send 5 year olds up chimneys, but that doesn’t mean it’s right”

I can see both sides of the argument. On the rare occasions I sat on the tube, I will offer my seat to a mum + child if it means the two of them can sit together. Sometimes kids need to sit down, and you don’t know their circumstances.

BJames · 10 Jun 2019

Ianno87 said:
We did rationing in the 40s and 50s. Should we go back to that too?

Forget the past. I have to admit that the initial response I would give would be, without hesitation, asking what specific reason there is that the child requires the seat. If this is adequate then of course, I'm not going to make them suffer by standing unnecessarily. Otherwise, there are no available seats and the child has to stand along with most passengers. I highly doubt the child is that upset about it to be honest.

In the article, it states the following:

I stared at her in disbelief and didn’t even know what to say and then she raised her voice at me and told to get up.

I'm afraid this would have been it with me. Any remaining sympathy has gone. This suggests a complete air of entitlement and in a city like London, I believe that she's lucky she didn't ask someone of a much less forgiving nature to be honest. You simply can't go round expecting.

Bald Rick said:
I can see both sides of the argument. On the rare occasions I sat on the tube, I will offer my seat to a mum + child if it means the two of them can sit together. Sometimes kids need to sit down, and you don’t know their circumstances.

I do try and do this if it means they sit together, but as stated above, not if someone has the gall to try to raise their voice to do so.

Bertie the bus · 10 Jun 2019

Ianno87 said:
Then cue lots of tutting and glances when child falls over and starts crying....

Or even better, people then complaining said non-sitting young children are moving around and bothering them.

There's no pleasing some miserable people.

It’s so difficult for a child’s parent to hold on to a hand rail with one hand and steady their child with the other isn’t it? Unless the child in this case has certain issues I see no reason why a 10 year old can’t hold a hand rail. It doesn’t take much mental or physical skill. In the good old days when kids used to do stuff 10 year olds used to ride skateboards which is a lot more difficult than managing to stand up in a moving vehicle.

My child, other people’s problem. Typical of today.

Mutant Lemming · 10 Jun 2019

She didn't mention if it was a cultural issue. It is customary in many East European countries for a Бабушка (grandmother) to stand and let any children in her charge sit down on the metro and buses whereas here anyone not paying the full adult fare was supposed to give up their seat to full fare paying passengers.

TUC · 10 Jun 2019

Mutant Lemming said:
She didn't mention if it was a cultural issue. It is customary in many East European countries for a Бабушка (grandmother) to stand and let any children in her charge sit down on the metro and buses whereas here anyone not paying the full adult fare was supposed to give up their seat to full fare paying passengers.

So what? If you’re in a different country you wouldn’t expect people in that country to do something just because it’s your culture, would you?

AlterEgo · 10 Jun 2019

Ianno87 said:
Then cue lots of tutting and glances when child falls over and starts crying....

Or even better, people then complaining said non-sitting young children are moving around and bothering them.

There's no pleasing some miserable people.

They aren’t necessarily the same people though.

Kids are tough and can stand.

Mutant Lemming · 10 Jun 2019

TUC said:
So what? If you’re in a different country you wouldn’t expect people in that country to do something just because it’s your culture, would you?

I just mentioned it as a possible explanation of the expectation to give up a seat for a child. London is a diverse city with many cultural differences which aren't understood by everybody - in many instances the 'minority' are actually in a majority.

civ-eng-jim · 10 Jun 2019

TUC said:
So what? If you’re in a different country you wouldn’t expect people in that country to do something just because it’s your culture, would you?

Well, actually yes, you would as a default position unless you know that something is a cultural faux pas.

BJames · 10 Jun 2019

Mutant Lemming said:
She didn't mention if it was a cultural issue. It is customary in many East European countries for a Бабушка (grandmother) to stand and let any children in her charge sit down on the metro and buses whereas here anyone not paying the full adult fare was supposed to give up their seat to full fare paying passengers.

TUC said:
So what? If you’re in a different country you wouldn’t expect people in that country to do something just because it’s your culture, would you?

I wouldn't even have thought of this if I had been sitting on the tube. Mainly because I'm in London and this isn't our culture. I know London is a hugely diverse place - and I get that - and I appreciate that this is not going to be agreed by everyone, but this is why I would ask the woman whether there was a specific reason why I needed to give up my seat for her child. I don't see this to be a reason but you never know, there might be a hidden disability that prevents standing. I wouldn't give up my seat without a response though in this case, especially if she chose to raise her voice to try to get me to leave my seat.

Islineclear3_1 · 10 Jun 2019

Mother could have sat the child on her lap

If the mother was that aggrieved, she should have given up her seat instead of asking someone else

TFN · 10 Jun 2019

I grew up in a country where children sitting down WASN'T ALLOWED on public transport.

That said in my time in London my dad would only allow me to sit down if the train wasn't busy. Otherwise I sat on his lap. He would always tell me to get up for an elderly or pregnant woman so it is pretty much engrained into my mind now.

I would only get up for the less-abled, the elderly and the pregnant. No exceptions.

bramling · 10 Jun 2019

Ianno87 said:
There's no pleasing some miserable people.

Which is why, regrettably, it’s easier to simply worry about no.1, rather than worry about other people and their problems / preciousness.

Want a seat? Then plan the journey accordingly - it’s not that difficult if one gives the matter some thought.

AlterEgo · 10 Jun 2019

robert7111a said:
Mother could have sat the child on her lap

The child was ten in this case.

Bantamzen · 11 Jun 2019

My simple answer would be "Sorry, but no".

Pete_uk · 11 Jun 2019

AlterEgo said:
The child was ten in this case.

I wouldn't have stood up.

Robertj21a · 11 Jun 2019

Ianno87 said:
Then cue lots of tutting and glances when child falls over and starts crying....

Or even better, people then complaining said non-sitting young children are moving around and bothering them.

There's no pleasing some miserable people.

If there's no good reason for the child to sit down then why should someone else have to give up their seat ?. What happened to holding the mother's hand ?
What a crazy world we're becoming.

Woman asked to give up seat on train for child.

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