Caledonian Sleeper

Essexman · 19 Jun 2019

BRX said:
Easy solution to that (for me) is to book a non ensuite cabin!

Never really see the point of ensuites myself. I know some people want them though.

I wouldn't normally pay the extra but that's what I was allocated with my Flexipass ticket.

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Erniescooper · 19 Jun 2019

Deafdoggie said:
Been past Longsight this lunchtime, they are still there

They won’t be there in the morning

ainsworth74 · 19 Jun 2019

BRX said:
In a building context you normally look for a minimum of 18mm per m; a pipe running half the length of a 20m coach would need 180mm fall but then you have to add the depth of whatever tank it's being collected in, plus the vertical drop from the shower tray... pretty easy to see how quickly that could eat into whatever space you have between floor level and lowest part of undercarriage which can't be more than about 600mm. And I imagine it's no simple matter to find a continuous straight run threaded through everything else that has to fit under the floor... and presumably in a moving vehicle which can be on gradients and canted track and so on, the rate of fall that works in a static building context quickly becomes irrelevant. So I can see why it's probably inevitable there has to be some kind of pumped system.

If you're draining the grey waste onto the track though why would you be threading anything through anything other than directly down to the ground?!

BRX · 19 Jun 2019

ainsworth74 said:
If you're draining the grey waste onto the track though why would you be threading anything through anything other than directly down to the ground?!

Sure - I was thinking of the scenario where it doesn't drain onto the track.

JModulo · 19 Jun 2019

BRX said:
Sure - I was thinking of the scenario where it doesn't drain onto the track.

The showers / sinks go into the same tanks as the bogs anyway so would be no need to run pipework the length of the coach.

BRX · 19 Jun 2019

JModulo said:
The showers / sinks go into the same tanks as the bogs anyway so would be no need to run pipework the length of the coach.

In that case gravity drainage would seem a bit risky because you don't want that tank backing up into the shower... I assume that a pumped system allows you to have one-way valves and so on.

TimboM · 19 Jun 2019

92043 returning the miscreant Mk5s to Polmadie tonight:

5Z92 23:15 Longsight Wheel Lathe - Polmadie
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O15439/2019/06/19/advanced

Scotrail84 · 19 Jun 2019

TimboM said:
92043 returning the miscreant Mk5s to Polmadie tonight:

5Z92 23:15 Longsight Wheel Lathe - Polmadie
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O15439/2019/06/19/advanced

They're needed at Wembley though, not Polmadie.

TimboM · 20 Jun 2019

Scotrail84 said:
They're needed at Wembley though, not Polmadie.

Looking like one more portion to be cancelled north-bound tomorrow night.

Siemens Trains · 20 Jun 2019

TimboM said:
92043 returning the miscreant Mk5s to Polmadie tonight:

5Z92 23:15 Longsight Wheel Lathe - Polmadie
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O15439/2019/06/19/advanced

When would these be due to travel down south again? Maybe tomorrow daytime as empty stock? Or tomorrow evening in service (with the other set 'resting' in Scotland, or subject some kind of repairs)?

Siemens Trains · 20 Jun 2019

TimboM said:
Looking like one more portion to be cancelled north-bound tomorrow night.

Ah, OK thanks.

TimboM · 20 Jun 2019

Siemens Trains said:
When would these be due to travel down south again? Maybe tomorrow daytime as empty stock? Or tomorrow evening in service (with the other set 'resting' in Scotland, or subject some kind of repairs)?

I believe they’ll just be reunited with the rest of the set at Polmadie on Friday and form a full southbound Lowlander service Fri night.

nlogax · 20 Jun 2019

Is it fair to make an assumption that it'll be the Edinburgh n/b portion to be cancelled this evening? Considering the repaired stock will be reunited in Polmadie tomorrow with the rest of the set, etc.

(asking for me.. tonight I'll either be onboard a sleeper train to Glasgow or a hotel adjacent to Gatwick airport)

TimboM · 20 Jun 2019

nlogax said:
Is it fair to make an assumption that it'll be the Edinburgh n/b portion to be cancelled this evening? Considering the repaired stock will be reunited in Polmadie tomorrow with the rest of the set, etc.

(asking for me.. tonight I'll either be onboard a sleeper train to Glasgow or a hotel adjacent to Gatwick airport)

Could be either - Glasgow was cancelled Sun/Mon then Edinburgh Tue/Wed nights.

Bit surprised there’s been no announcement from CS as it’s been known for a day or two now that the repaired Mk5s were going to Polmadie last night and hence at the “wrong” end for tonight.

Maybe loadings are light and they’re looking to get everyone on the one portion??

nlogax · 20 Jun 2019

TimboM said:
Bit surprised there’s been no announcement from CS as it’s been known for a day or two now that the repaired Mk5s were going to Polmadie last night and hence at the “wrong” end for tonight.

Looking at recent pages of this thread as well as tweets aimed at them from affected passengers-to-be, I'd not be surprised if they yet again failed to communicate bad news until the last minute. I booked direct but haven't seen any emails or texts from them so far today. Unless, as you suggest, they could run a single service due to lighter loads, a high percentage of passengers will need to make alternate plans at very short notice.

DelW · 20 Jun 2019

BRX said:
Never really see the point of ensuites myself. I know some people want them though.

I think it's more a case that some people need them, especially later in life :'(

. Though I'm sure that in the old stock, the sinks got regular use for the purpose :oops:

One aspect that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere, is whether CAF have built sleepers for other operators before, or whether the mk5s are a new departure for them? I realise that a standard European design might have needed modification to fit UK loading gauge, but some of what appear to be oversights in the layout seem surprising if they are basically an established design. But perhaps neither CAF nor anyone else has built any sleepers for a long time.

ashkeba · 20 Jun 2019

DelW said:
One aspect that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere, is whether CAF have built sleepers for other operators before, or whether the mk5s are a new departure for them?

CAF have been building Viewliner II sleepers for Amtrak but a similar time (because they're late) as the Mark 5. I don't know of others they've built. Renfe's sleepers were built by Talgo.

DelW · 20 Jun 2019

ashkeba said:
CAF have been building Viewliner II sleepers for Amtrak but a similar time (because they're late) as the Mark 5. I don't know of others they've built. Renfe's sleepers were built by Talgo.

Thanks, I hadn't realised that it was CAF building the latest Viewliner series. Though I imagine the internal layout might be quite different, since although Viewliners are small by US standards (vs the double deckers), I suspect they're still quite a bit bigger than the mk5s.

Essexman · 20 Jun 2019

Is it likely that CS will be able to claim from CAF for losses resulting from the recent incident?
Surely an automatic emergency brake application shouldn't cause severe wheel flats?

DelW · 20 Jun 2019

Essexman said:
Is it likely that CS will be able to claim from CAF for losses resulting from the recent incident?
Surely an automatic emergency brake application shouldn't cause severe wheel flats?

But isn't there a difference between full service application (which should not damage the wheels) and emergency? After all, if the train is about to hit e.g. a low-loader stranded on a level crossing (think Hixon) then a few wheel flats are a small price to pay for possibly reducing the impact (literally). Maybe the problem is how the on-board software can assess the severity of the potential emergency, and what input data it has for that purpose.

nlogax · 20 Jun 2019

Just spoken to CS customer service who tell me the Lowlander to Glasgow is 'definitely running' this evening. So I'm 10% more confident than I was half an hour ago

Mainliner · 20 Jun 2019

Essexman said:
Surely an automatic emergency brake application shouldn't cause severe wheel flats?

I think it was stated upthread that the wheel slide protection didn’t activate.

Essexman · 20 Jun 2019

Mainliner said:
I think it was stated upthread that the wheel slide protection didn’t activate.

Sorry I missed that.
As the trains are still running I assume it was considered to be an isolated event and not a fault with the fleet?

nlogax · 20 Jun 2019

Now confirmed on CS Twitter feed - Lowlander to Edinburgh cancelled tonight.

https://twitter.com/CalSleeper/status/1141638460140335104

kingqueen · 20 Jun 2019

The Guest Service Manager has emailed me to warn that the lounge on the (Fort William and Aberdeen portion of the?) northbound Highlander is out of action this evening.

MrEd · 20 Jun 2019

kingqueen said:
The Guest Service Manager has emailed me to warn that the lounge on the (Fort William and Aberdeen portion of the?) northbound Highlander is out of action this evening.

Wow that’s surprisingly well organised. Often you don’t find out till you walk past the lounge car and find it in darkness! Thankfully the northbound Highlander out of Euston has two Lounge cars (unless both are gubbed). Last time the Fort William/Aberdeen lounge was out of action on the Highlander (when I was on, also on a busy Friday night) first class passengers from the Fort William and Aberdeen portions were allowed to use the Inverness lounge, with a takeaway service for standard class passengers. Obviously it depends on the crew but something similar should hopefully be arranged tonight.

kingqueen · 20 Jun 2019

MrEd said:
Wow that’s surprisingly well organised. Often you don’t find out till you walk past the lounge car and find it in darkness!

I suspect that other passengers haven't been informed...

Last time the Fort William/Aberdeen lounge was out of action on the Highlander (when I was on, also on a busy Friday night) first class passengers from the Fort William and Aberdeen portions were allowed to use the Inverness lounge, with a takeaway service for standard class passengers. Obviously it depends on the crew but something similar should hopefully be arranged tonight.

Thank you for the thought, appreciated. Unfortunately it won't make any difference for me because I'm a wheelchair user. I can't get into the lounge car anyway because between London and Edinburgh the Fort William accessible sleeper cabin is not next to the lounge. As a result they offer disabled people occupying the Fort William accessible cabin, room service from the Fort William / Aberdeen lounge car. But they say they won't if the Fort William / Aberdeen lounge car is out.

Norther Monkey · 20 Jun 2019

kingqueen said:
The Guest Service Manager has emailed me to warn that the lounge on the (Fort William and Aberdeen portion of the?) northbound Highlander is out of action this evening.

Whilst those in the beds might be able to use the Inverness lounge, what are the prospects for those in the seats to get a nightcap or a brew in the morning?

VT 390 · 20 Jun 2019

If the Lounge/Club car is full if the other is out of use are passengers with Club/Double room tickets also allowed to buy meals to take back to there rooms if they do not want to wait for ages?

WesternLancer · 20 Jun 2019

DelW said:
One aspect that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere, is whether CAF have built sleepers for other operators before, or whether the mk5s are a new departure for them? I realise that a standard European design might have needed modification to fit UK loading gauge, but some of what appear to be oversights in the layout seem surprising if they are basically an established design. But perhaps neither CAF nor anyone else has built any sleepers for a long time.

I thought the former DB night stock (now with OBB) wasn't that old, but I've not checked who built them and when.

But I did find this - includes the info people invited to try them out!
https://www.nightjet.com/en/ausstattung/nightjetzukunft.html

Maybe if anyone from OBB reads this forum they should book a trip on CS as part of their design process...

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