Caledonian Sleeper

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

Darandio said:
The problem here is that Caledonian Sleeper doesn't advertise itself as a train service, it advertises itself as an overnight hotel with high class accomodation, catering and attentive service by staff, things you would associate with a similarly priced hotel. Yet when the turd hits the fan it's allowed to hide behind a poor set of terms and conditions that revert the Caledonian Sleeper back to a train service.

Yes, precisely. A bus is a (slightly poor but) valid replacement for a train service. But a sleeper is something special in terms of accommodation, so the replacement really should have to be equivalent, which is a night in a hotel and a day train or flight.

Thinking on, are those Megabus sleeper coaches still knocking around? They're not as nice as CS, being more couchette style, but would probably be a reasonable replacement - I slept better on one of those than I did on a train due to the orientation meaning the cycle of "blood to head, blood to feet" at every corner didn't happen. Maybe CS needs to agree with Stagey a long term hire on them?

I had planned to take the boy in September/October to try out the new stock but there is absolutely zero chance now, regardless of whether the service improves dramatically or not.

My nephew wants to go on one, I think it's going to have to be the Riviera now. Might be better for him anyway as he'll be able to play on the beach when we arrive.

RailUK Forums

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

kingqueen said:
I wonder what the point is of the ticket seller collecting this personal data (phone number) given they don't pass it on. Personally I think that may be less GDPR compliant because they are collecting personal data they don't need or use.

In case they need to contact you about an issue regarding your booking (i.e. the actual booking process, not the train service on the day), or, if you consented, for marketing purposes.

It is a bit niche but is probably justifiable, e.g. if the card payment was charged back.

JModulo · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Thinking on, are those Megabus sleeper coaches still knocking around? They're not as nice as CS, being more couchette style, but would probably be a reasonable replacement - I slept better on one of those than I did on a train due to the orientation meaning the cycle of "blood to head, blood to feet" at every corner didn't happen. Maybe CS needs to agree with Stagey a long term hire on them?

The newer ones have all since been rebranded and used on different work. The 4 old B10s have been parked up and for sale since they came off the service.

GrimShady · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Legally? No, they aren't in the wrong. But as a premium operation it absolutely stinks and deserves to lose all its custom.

Agreed fully. I was a fairly regular user of CS until the last few months. I was planning on using it much more as I can't stand 390s and not willing to put up with garbage such as the 800s.

If I book the sleeper (at a premium) then I expect some horizontal sleep, not a bus or waiting 6hrs in some station on the first day service. As premium service it sounds like utter garbage at the moment.

The least the could do on a canceled service is give the passenger a choice of hotel + next day service or coach.

Essexman · 24 Jun 2019

CS not sounding so optimistic for Glasgow northbound tomorrow -.

Yesterday CS said - 'there are no scheduled or anticipated disruptions to this service'

Today CS said - 'We will let guests know as soon as possible if there are going to be any further service disruptions'

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

Essexman said:
CS not sounding so optimistic for Glasgow northbound tomorrow -.

Yesterday CS said - 'there are no scheduled or anticipated disruptions to this service'

Today CS said - 'We will let guests know as soon as possible if there are going to be any further service disruptions'

Does anyone get the feeling they are utterly floundering?

Do they perhaps need the nuclear option? Book a load of hotels, charter some daytime stock and/or aircraft, and bin a whole week's service (or more) with proper replacements?

Chrism20 · 24 Jun 2019

I’m on the southbound from Glasgow on Friday night, can’t say I’m looking forward to it much at the moment.

Booked on the Glasgow portion rather than the Edinburgh one as it was significantly cheaper and I’m able to work out of the Glasgow office on Friday so it worked out quite well - I thought!

Mainliner · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Does anyone get the feeling they are utterly floundering?

As I’ve said before, the failure to implement even minimal customer care measures, like hiring a couple of portaloos at Euston instead of telling people to go to Kings Cross, providing a trolley with hot drinks for passengers waiting on a cold platform at midnight, and dimming the lighting in the seated coaches when everyone is complaining that it’s far too bright, gives me the impression of a company that’s given up and is already looking for a way out.

GrimShady · 24 Jun 2019

Mainliner said:
As I’ve said before, the failure to implement even minimal customer care measures, like hiring a couple of portaloos at Euston instead of telling people to go to Kings Cross, providing a trolley with hot drinks for passengers waiting on a cold platform at midnight, and dimming the lighting in the seated coaches when everyone is complaining that it’s far too bright, gives me the impression of a company that’s given up and is already looking for a way out.

Hang on....they told people to go to Kings Cross to use a toilet?

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

GrimShady said:
Hang on....they told people to go to Kings Cross to use a toilet?

I think that one is a bit unfair on CS. Facilities were unavailable at Euston due to flooding. There's not a lot they could really do bar tell passengers the location of the nearest alternative public toilet, which probably is either Kings X or St Pancras given the appalling provision of such in the UK. They couldn't have magicked some polybogs out of thin air in the time they had.

Mainliner · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I think that one is a bit unfair on CS. Facilities were unavailable at Euston due to flooding. There's not a lot they could really do bar tell passengers the location of the nearest alternative public toilet, which probably is either Kings X or St Pancras given the appalling provision of such in the UK. They couldn't have magicked some polybogs out of thin air in the time they had.

But my post referred to minimal measures. If a next step above minimal had been put in place - arranging extended opening of a lounge, which I gather has since been done elsewhere - the situation would have been alleviated.

stepho · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I think that one is a bit unfair on CS. Facilities were unavailable at Euston due to flooding. There's not a lot they could really do bar tell passengers the location of the nearest alternative public toilet, which probably is either Kings X or St Pancras given the appalling provision of such in the UK. They couldn't have magicked some polybogs out of thin air in the time they had.

If they were boarding on time or agreed to extend the Virgin First class lounge opening hours....

There feels a better way of making the impact of these issues a lot easier on the passengers affected, but the desire just doesn't seem to be there. In lieu of running as scheduled, a brew and biscuit and somewhere warm to wait goes a long way to making things better in the immediacy.

They are where they are with the stock issues without the top bods making a serious decision, but from ticket acceptance, communication, somewhere to wait and general customer service - they seem to have given up. The front line staff must be fuming with the position they have been put in and seemingly lack of support..

Kendalian · 24 Jun 2019

stepho said:
If they were boarding on time or agreed to extend the Virgin First class lounge opening hours....

There feels a better way of making the impact of these issues a lot easier on the passengers affected, but the desire just doesn't seem to be there. In lieu of running as scheduled, a brew and biscuit and somewhere warm to wait goes a long way to making things better in the immediacy.

They are where they are with the stock issues without the top bods making a serious decision, but from ticket acceptance, communication, somewhere to wait and general customer service - they seem to have given up. The front line staff must be fuming with the position they have been put in and seemingly lack of support..

Last night's debacle with the Edinburgh portion being yet another example of CS's general ineptitude.

The ECS from Polmadie had been stuck at Cambuslang for 40 minutes when CS tweeted it would be leaving on time...cue tweets from passengers stuck on other services behind it!

6Z09 · 24 Jun 2019

The front line staff are feeling the pressure,hence the looming union ballot.
Staff shortages,have on recent occassion , resulted in no lounge open on the Fort William portion.
The never ending "teething problems" on the new stock are causing staff to be in the firing line trying to defend the indefensible.The Highlander staff are up against the fact many passengers board expecting the new trains.

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

stepho said:
If they were boarding on time or agreed to extend the Virgin First class lounge opening hours....

I think in that specific case the issue related to the sewerage system and so there were no working toilets at all in the Euston complex, in the lounge or otherwise. It was a very exceptional case. The most they could have done would be to ask a TOC with a unit in a platform to release the doors and allow those to be used, though that would depend on staff being around to do so and a unit there that could be used for that purpose which late at night there may not be.

As you can see if you read up I am not short of criticism for CS, I just think calling them on this specific situation doesn't help the "anti" argument, as it is just about the only one of the issues they couldn't have done much better about.

Kendalian · 24 Jun 2019

6Z09 said:
The front line staff are feeling the pressure,hence the looming union ballot.
Staff shortages,have on recent occassion , resulted in no lounge open on the Fort William portion.
The never ending "teething problems" on the new stock are causing staff to be in the firing line trying to defend the undefensible.The Highlander staff are up against the fact many passengers board expecting the new trains.

This is another of CS's communication failures. I booked direct with CS and never received the email advising of the month's delay introducing the MkV's. I had heard on here and elsewhere I was not alone in not receiving the email and relayed this to CS, trying to be helpful pointing out they appeared to have a problem with their email system. The response was curt..."the emails were sent"....

Bletchleyite · 24 Jun 2019

Kendalian said:
This is another of CS's communication failures. I booked direct with CS and never received the email advising of the month's delay introducing the MkV's. I had heard on here and elsewhere I was not alone in not receiving the email and relayed this to CS, trying to be helpful pointing out they appeared to have a problem with their email system. The response was curt..."the emails were sent"....

Clearly the customer services staff are losing patience too. It has the feeling of being close to collapse.

The problem if it did collapse is...is that it, then, i.e. permanent closure?

Highlandspring · 24 Jun 2019

Bletchleyite said:
It has the feeling of being close to collapse.

Only to those folk getting whipped up into a frenzy and hyperventilating in the RailUK Forums echo chamber. No wonder the previous thread was closed.

Chrism20 · 24 Jun 2019

I don’t think it’s ready to collapse but something must be ready to pop given that we are moving from late boarding, maintenance and customer service issues to an inability to actually run the full service.

Essexman · 24 Jun 2019

If CS are going to have to cancel a portion tomorrow it would be helpful if they told us now whether it would be Glasgow or Edinburgh, so at least half of their Lowlander customers would know they don’t have to worry.

AY1975 · 24 Jun 2019

tsr said:
VTWC have also been accepting CS tickets tonight on various services.

Yes, and they are also accepting CS tickets both today and tomorrow for passengers booked on tonight's cancelled southbound Glasgow portion.

I wonder if LNER will do the same if there are any more cancellations of the Edinburgh portion. AFAIK they haven't done so far.

Darandio · 24 Jun 2019

AY1975 said:
Yes, and they are also accepting CS tickets both today and tomorrow for passengers booked on tonight's cancelled southbound Glasgow portion.

But not on the 0428, which would arguably have been useful for those needing to get there at around 9am.

jamesst · 24 Jun 2019

What's exactly gone wrong? Have all the problems started with the new stock or is it that all the problems are coming to a head at the same time?
Must admit I've never taken much interest in the sleeper before now, sleeping on a train just doesn't appeal to me

Essexman · 24 Jun 2019

CS seem to have disappeared from Twitter again. No activity for three hours. Questions not being answered. Poor communication is not acceptable particularly at this time

AY1975 · 24 Jun 2019

Essexman said:
CS seem to have disappeared from Twitter again. No activity for three hours. Questions not being answered. Poor communication is not acceptable particularly at this time

Their last message on Twitter was 7 hours ago, and it says they are currently contacting all guests who booked directly through CS. Whether this is actually happening, though, is a different matter.

Chrism20 · 24 Jun 2019

AY1975 said:
Their last message on Twitter was 7 hours ago, and it says they are currently contacting all guests who booked directly through CS. Whether this is actually happening, though, is a different matter.

They have however replied to people about three hours ago.

Nothing answered since around 3:30pm by the look of it.

adrock1976 · 24 Jun 2019

Essexman said:
If CS are going to have to cancel a portion tomorrow it would be helpful if they told us now whether it would be Glasgow or Edinburgh, so at least half of their Lowlander customers would know they don’t have to worry.

Should if the northbound Glasgow portion is unfortunately cancelled tomorrow, would the Fort William be any use as an alternative?

This would normally mean staying on to Dalmuir and catching a train back east to Glasgow Central or Queen Street. Although the Fort William calls at Glasgow Queen Street, this is to pick up only from London and set down only to London, although if you explain nicely to the guard or other member of onboard staff, they may let you off the train at Queen Street given the circumstances.

VT 390 · 24 Jun 2019

adrock1976 said:
Should if the northbound Glasgow portion is unfortunately cancelled tomorrow, would the Fort William be any use as an alternative?

This would normally mean staying on to Dalmuir and catching a train back east to Glasgow Central or Queen Street. Although the Fort William calls at Glasgow Queen Street, this is to pick up only from London and set down only to London, although if you explain nicely to the guard or other member of onboard staff, they may let you off the train at Queen Street given the circumstances.

I would have thought that at this time of year the Fort William sleeper would be quite full already.

Essexman · 24 Jun 2019

I've just phoned CS and they assured me that Euston to Glasgow will definitely be running tomorrow. He said that they have located the cause of the problem and it will run.

If it wasn't running my plan was to book one of the few remaining berths on the Fort William and get off at Dumbarton.

causton · 24 Jun 2019

Mainliner said:
As I’ve said before, the failure to implement even minimal customer care measures, like hiring a couple of portaloos at Euston instead of telling people to go to Kings Cross, providing a trolley with hot drinks for passengers waiting on a cold platform at midnight, and dimming the lighting in the seated coaches when everyone is complaining that it’s far too bright, gives me the impression of a company that’s given up and is already looking for a way out.

Who is planning the logistics for this?

A TOC can't just dump some portaloos on Euston concourse. They would have to have it booked well in advanced and signed off by quite a few people. Neither could they open a lounge, would you as a VT member of staff probably living quite a way away from Euston come down to open it up for a few hours? And then the CS customers use up all the supplies and make a mess so the VT passengers have to suffer the next day. And where is this trolley going to come from, with what supplies, with who running it? Lots of things on the railway are meticulously planned - you can't just rock up and do whatever you want with someone else's property, on someone else's station, with some magical staff that pop out of nowhere at the middle of the night (cause I can't see the CS staff guiding a portaloo into the middle of Eversholt Street!)

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