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How far in advance do train drivers get their weekly roster?
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It varies. I know from my application I had with Freightliner that Heavy Haul worked on a week on week basis, whereas Intermodal was more structured. From what I’ve seen here, freight seems less structured in this respect that a TOC tends to be. There are loads of people here with hands on experience so I may be corrected yet haha.
Undiscovered
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As a guard, I know my roster until December, when the timetable changes, and my rest days well into next year and the year beyond. Most drivers are the same.
The only things that alter are 'spare' turns. I have a start and end time in my long term rota, but I can be moved a set number if hours earlier or later as required, provided the minimum 12hrs between shifts is maintained.
Likewise, I may not find out if I've been granted a floating leave day until 48hrs before, if I applied and was put in abeyance. There's more info on the Railway worker booking sick thread in the UK rail discussion forum.
The only things that alter are 'spare' turns. I have a start and end time in my long term rota, but I can be moved a set number if hours earlier or later as required, provided the minimum 12hrs between shifts is maintained.
Likewise, I may not find out if I've been granted a floating leave day until 48hrs before, if I applied and was put in abeyance. There's more info on the Railway worker booking sick thread in the UK rail discussion forum.
Highlandspring
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It's the same for Network Rail Signallers and Controllers, roster published at 12:00 on Thursday for the week starting at 00:01 on Sunday. You just live with it.
driver9000
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My base link can change every period so 6 weeks or so. This tends to be minor changes to the jobs but the rest day pattern is set for 12 months each December. The daily rosters giving any changes to a Driver being marked to a job from Spare of alterations due to engineering work are posted 7 days in advance but can be altered up to 72 hours notice.
On passenger I know the year ahead. Even with May/December time table changes it won't affect time significantly.
Even you the three hour movement TOCs will early step you up/down shifts (earlies to lates or vice versa)
Freight (heavy haul) shifts on a Friday but no guarantee they'll remain the same for the week due to changes in work. Atleast that was my experience
Even you the three hour movement TOCs will early step you up/down shifts (earlies to lates or vice versa)
Freight (heavy haul) shifts on a Friday but no guarantee they'll remain the same for the week due to changes in work. Atleast that was my experience
kevconnor
Member
Are you please able to share where this comes from? I work in employment law and cannot think of such a legal requirement.
Trainguy90
Member
you’ll have a link in which you’ll know your days off but on freight you usually won’t find out your actual shifts until a few days before the week is about to start
Passenger it changes with the timetable so you should know your shifts for at least 6months
Passenger it changes with the timetable so you should know your shifts for at least 6months
I saw it mentioned in a couple of articles last year but haven't saved the links so can't remember which ones they were unfortunately. I've removed it from the post, it's a lot more believable coming from someone who actually works in employment law!
Thanks for the replies everyone!
whoosh
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Often laws regarding working time etc. have an exemption for transport workers.
That’s interesting. So you don’t know what days you have off next Christmas for example? I can tell you what I’m due to work Xmas 2040! I don’t know the job obviously but I know wether or not I’ll be working.
Is it true they can move you +/- 12 hours from your job too?
Llanigraham
On Moderation
True, but as a Resident generally I could mark my diary for a whole year to show days, nights and rest days. The only alterations were if we were asked to cover someones sickness, training, etc.
That would all depend on your t&cs.
driver9000
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No apart from having Christmas day and Boxing day off. We can be moved +/- 3 hours from Spare.
Tom Quinne
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Relief men get the rough end of the stick rest days only, even then you could lose 12hrs of it if your booked nights into it.
theironroad
Established Member
Not sure who you work for, but no railway roster can guarantee what you'll be working in 2040. You might be able to work it out based on your current roster, but all it needs is 1 line added and it throwss the whole thing out.
We're due a major roster change in December this year,( at the timetable change) and the only requirement his that the roster is displayed 7 days before commencement.
I think the suggestion is that it's a 3 week repeating rest day pattern which is common on the railway. You can't just add one line to this kind of roster - and they don't. Presumably you are not on a fixed repeating RD pattern so they can add and remove any number of lines. The problem with this kind of roster is you need the LDC to be all over it like a rash to ensure a fair spread of rest days.
Yeah at my toc which I think is the same as bionic our rest days never change so I know exactly what I'm working in 20 years.
Only way it would change is with a massive overhaul of the roster and that's something the union would have to agree.
I dont think it will happen.
Only way it would change is with a massive overhaul of the roster and that's something the union would have to agree.
I dont think it will happen.
Things can change and in my experience often will. Our best roster had a fixed RD pattern. It didn't last. Our links have changed size many many times over the years and with December looming and with a loss of work on the horizon.. There is an opportunity for the depot to become a single link or drop lines.
How does your TOC deal with change ? Establishment levels increase and decrease and links often get lines added or dropped. How do you keep a fixed rest day pattern ? What happened when everyone moves depots and gets redeployed ? What about movement between links ?
Cheers in advance.
How does your TOC deal with change ? Establishment levels increase and decrease and links often get lines added or dropped. How do you keep a fixed rest day pattern ? What happened when everyone moves depots and gets redeployed ? What about movement between links ?
Cheers in advance.
It stays the same regardless, we are on a 3 week rotation and I dont think its changed in 25 years.
There are 3 shifts, each shift at each depot always does the same days as the other depots.
5 day long weekend every 3 weeks ,
Shifts swap over from lates after the Wednesday Thursday rest days to earlies.
Its a 4 day week sundays outside , no single rest days.
There are 3 shifts, each shift at each depot always does the same days as the other depots.
5 day long weekend every 3 weeks ,
Shifts swap over from lates after the Wednesday Thursday rest days to earlies.
Its a 4 day week sundays outside , no single rest days.
In 25yrs the depot has never had the links increase or decrease ? Or do they always increase or decrease in groups of 3 lines.
I do like your 3 shift approach and love the way it never changes but (at my TOC) things change pretty much all the time. You either have a really strong LDR or there is some kind of advantage to keeping such a pattern and very fixed mentality.
I do like your 3 shift approach and love the way it never changes but (at my TOC) things change pretty much all the time. You either have a really strong LDR or there is some kind of advantage to keeping such a pattern and very fixed mentality.
Yeah, exactly the same as my TOC. they’ve been on this rest day pattern since before I was born I believe.
Of course things may change, and they will in the near future regarding sundays. But I work every Sunday as it is so that’s not going to affect me. My rest days are going to stay the same bar some massive shake up and our depot is only getting bigger. If they add a line then that’s all they do, I won’t move off mine. And our depot is growing so fast they actually added a link, not a line. Our block leave can also be worked out for the next 20 years too (barring a massive shake up, which is unlikely)
I think I know who you work for and I’d heard the rumour of the 12 hours thing. Maybe it’s been started by our management to stop us leaving!! Haha.
theironroad
Established Member
For those of you who have never had a change in FD pattern in 20 odd years, you'll be in for a shock if it happens. Not all links have frequent enough repeating pattern to abosrb new drivers.
When there is an increase in the number of drivers due to extra work at a depot in excess of vacant lines, lines are often added onto existing links this changing the FD pattern
Most people can accept that a FD pattern can change, what people can't accept is that the minimum requirement is only 7 days notification. Usually there will be a heads up that a FD pattern change is on the horizon, but it's useless when you're trying to book holidays etc
When there is an increase in the number of drivers due to extra work at a depot in excess of vacant lines, lines are often added onto existing links this changing the FD pattern
Most people can accept that a FD pattern can change, what people can't accept is that the minimum requirement is only 7 days notification. Usually there will be a heads up that a FD pattern change is on the horizon, but it's useless when you're trying to book holidays etc
Well the advantage is you know what you're doing years in advance lol
The lines have increased but only by so much that the roster can still maintain a 3 week rotation.
If it needs more lines they just make them vacant lines.
Bromley boy
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Do you at least know which days you’re working? It must be very difficult to plan anything otherwise.
I must admit stories like this are what put me off ever working for a FOC - TOC shift patterns can be anti social enough!
That sounds pretty good to me.
Where I am the company stated the roster would be fixed for a year and a few months later bunged another few lines in. People had booked annual leave for days which became rest days, paid for flights for family holidays etc. and basically had a choice of unpaid leave or calling in sick.
Your place obviously has LDRs who know what they’re doing and aren’t just management stooges.
There has to be a justifiable reason from a Management perspective too to keep the fixed pattern for so long. My personal thoughts on our LDR are unprintable but the goal posts have changed over the years. Our changes have mostly come about because our terms and conditions have changed, and that Management want something from us. LDR, lean over and push back.
Sundays - Only on Late shift - This was complained about, denied, eventually changed
Fixed rest day pattern - Told it wasn't possible, got one, changed again
Mid week shift swap - Told it wasn't allowed, shift swap on a saturday, now random shift swapping mid week.
52/26 line link banned - Got one, then changed again
I've been told by LDR so much crap over the years that now I stop listening. I plan purely between roster changed (Dec/May) and everything else I take with a pinch of salt.
Personally I would work a 4/4 pattern. Got told that it wasn't ever going to be possible because of fixed rest days/shift swapping mid week and inbalance of early/late/weekends.
We are about to have a major change in December Getting told by LDR that the loss of work isn't confirmed, then an email going out to a specific group telling them its been confirmed shows how dishonest the LDR can be. I don't think they are stooges, just weak.
What bugs me the most is that you see other TOC and the way they run their rosters (examples above) that things are possible and that it can work. AS I said in a different thread. The railway needs to be dragged kicking and screaming into modern working practices.
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