Class 442s - Now at the end of the road and to be withdrawn permanently

HamworthyGoods · 3 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
Another wrong route offered and not taken at Waterloo, apparently offered platform 6 which can’t hold a 10 car 44x unit anyway. Driver(s) stopped and queried.

Train was signalled into platform 8 (in which it would fit) but still not cleared. Driver didn’t take the route.

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pompeyfan · 3 Jul 2019

HamworthyGoods said:
Train was signalled into platform 8 (in which it would fit) but still not cleared. Driver didn’t take the route.

Ah thanks for clarifying. Nothing like railway rumours aye!

Adsy125 · 3 Jul 2019

Where is this Burrinton tunnel, I can’t find it on google?

pompeyfan · 3 Jul 2019

Buriton tunnel is about 3 miles country side of petersfield, and cuts through Buster Hill, part of the South Downs National park.

Thumper1127 · 3 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
Buriton tunnel is about 3 miles country side of petersfield, and cuts through Buster Hill, part of the South Downs National park.

A bit off topic I know but I’ve known entering Buriton Tunnel with no snow and coming out the Petersfield side into heavy snow!

Thumper1127 · 3 Jul 2019

Does anyone know whether non retractioned units will be able to pair with retractioned ones?

pompeyfan · 3 Jul 2019

Thumper1127 said:
A bit off topic I know but I’ve known entering Buriton Tunnel with no snow and coming out the Petersfield side into heavy snow!

Agreed it’s like entering Narnia sometimes.

mchd2000 · 3 Jul 2019

Spoke to the MD of SWR tonight at Waterloo station and I am told that there are 3 10-car 442s ready to enter service once NR have dealt with the outstanding track access restrictions - this is due to be resolved in the coming weeks so I am told

TEW · 3 Jul 2019

The problem is with the 442s we seem to have been promised something in a few weeks for about a year now, and it has amounted to very little so far.

theironroad · 3 Jul 2019

TEW said:
The problem is with the 442s we seem to have been promised something in a few weeks for about a year now, and it has amounted to very little so far.

It does seem that fleet believe more units are ready to enter service, not sure if rosters can cope with double manning drivers though!

Goldfish62 · 4 Jul 2019

mchd2000 said:
Spoke to the MD of SWR tonight at Waterloo station and I am told that there are 3 10-car 442s ready to enter service once NR have dealt with the outstanding track access restrictions - this is due to be resolved in the coming weeks so I am told

" The coming weeks". Well, anyone's guess as to how many that is!

trainmania100 · 5 Jul 2019

Are there still 2x 10 car 442s in service? I know that only one of the pairs has been out at any one time, but both have had a chance to try out 9B88. Anyone know when the next two units will be used on passenger working?

theironroad · 5 Jul 2019

trainmania100 said:
Are there still 2x 10 car 442s in service? I know that only one of the pairs has been out at any one time, but both have had a chance to try out 9B88. Anyone know when the next two units will be used on passenger working?

I think at the moment there is 1x10 car that runs up to Waterloo from Bournemouth in morning (although only in passenger service from southamoton) that 10 car then goes to have a rest and lunch in Clapham yard before returning to Waterloo to form the 1848 to Poole and back to Bournemouth depot for some sleep. Afaik, this is the only one in service.

Another 1x10 car does a couple of trips across the south coast between Portsmouth and Bournemouth for crew training purposes, but not in passenger service.

That's it at moment I think.

Who knows what surprises next week will bring though....

pompeyfan · 5 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
I think at the moment there is 1x10 car that runs up to Waterloo from Bournemouth in morning (although only in passenger service from southamoton) that 10 car then goes to have a rest and lunch in Clapham yard before returning to Waterloo to form the 1848 to Poole and back to Bournemouth depot for some sleep. Afaik, this is the only one in service.

Another 1x10 car does a couple of trips across the south coast between Portsmouth and Bournemouth for crew training purposes, but not in passenger service.

That's it at moment I think.

Who knows what surprises next week will bring though....

I read the question as how many sets of the 3 10 cars that are ready are they rotating between the passenger service runs? They’ve been using units B & E recently, not sure what the other units are lettered up as.

theironroad · 5 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
I read the question as how many sets of the 3 10 cars that are ready are they rotating between the passenger service runs? They’ve been using units B & E recently, not sure what the other units are lettered up as.

I think you're probably right, it briefly crossed my mind ..... After I posted.

I hadn't realised until the other day that the units had been assigned letters, but not really sure why tbh, but can confirm there is a 'K' but that was on an ecs.

trainmania100 · 5 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
I think you're probably right, it briefly crossed my mind ..... After I posted.

I hadn't realised until the other day that the units had been assigned letters, but not really sure why tbh, but can confirm there is a 'K' but that was on an ecs.

Yeah sorry what I should have said was , how many 442s have carried passengers with SWR yet

AFAIK 4 have been out, ( 2x 10 car units), just wondering if any more I have missed

pompeyfan · 5 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
I think you're probably right, it briefly crossed my mind ..... After I posted.

I hadn't realised until the other day that the units had been assigned letters, but not really sure why tbh, but can confirm there is a 'K' but that was on an ecs.

It’s to help passenger identify which coach they are in for short platforms, so guard makes a manual announcement saying you need to be in coaches A, if you see B you need to move forward.

theironroad · 5 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
It’s to help passenger identify which coach they are in for short platforms, so guard makes a manual announcement saying you need to be in coaches A, if you see B you need to move forward.

Ok, thanks. I thought PIS was being installed, the screens seem to be in place.

samuelmorris · 5 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
I read the question as how many sets of the 3 10 cars that are ready are they rotating between the passenger service runs? They’ve been using units B & E recently, not sure what the other units are lettered up as.

Does this definitely refer to individual vehicle letters? I'm a bit confused...

43096 · 5 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
I read the question as how many sets of the 3 10 cars that are ready are they rotating between the passenger service runs? They’ve been using units B & E recently, not sure what the other units are lettered up as.

Presumably in numerical order, as it's sets 2403/08 currently. Guess the others depend if they're using the letters I and O. If they are, then this would seem to be the match:
2402 A
2403 B
2404 C
2406 D
2408 E
2409 F
2410 G
2411 H
2413 I
2414 J
2415 K
2416 L
2417 M
2418 N
2419 O
2420 P
2422 Q
2423 R

theironroad · 5 Jul 2019

samuelmorris said:
Does this definitely refer to individual vehicle letters? I'm a bit confused...

Each vehicle is not individually lettered , all 5 cars of a unit will have the same letter displayed.

442 only have door opening of all coaches or the front 5.

So if Unit lettered E was leading and K trailing, at short platforms the guard would announce that anyone in coaches with the letter K displayed would need to move forward in order to alight at stations with short plstforms.

pompeyfan · 5 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
Ok, thanks. I thought PIS was being installed, the screens seem to be in place.

PIS isn’t clever enough to know which unit is at the front for SDO as I understand it. Don’t think the pis codes work for the current calling pattern either

aleggatta · 5 Jul 2019

I'm honestly surprised that they have not fitted the SDO system that was fitted to the 458's, they know the kit works and would standardise operations across the fleets

theironroad · 5 Jul 2019

pompeyfan said:
PIS isn’t clever enough to know which unit is at the front for SDO as I understand it. Don’t think the pis codes work for the current calling pattern either

As there is no tms, that's understandable so I guess the lettering *may* help some, but it's a real backward step since asdo was introduced. I've not been on a train in passenger service , on the cushions since introduction, so not really sure what the pis shows .

samuelmorris · 5 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
Each vehicle is not individually lettered , all 5 cars of a unit will have the same letter displayed.

442 only have door opening of all coaches or the front 5.

So if Unit lettered E was leading and K trailing, at short platforms the guard would announce that anyone in coaches with the letter K displayed would need to move forward in order to alight at stations with short plstforms.

Thanks for confirmation - never seen that before. Why does each set have a different letter then? Is that necessary?

TEW · 6 Jul 2019

theironroad said:
Ok, thanks. I thought PIS was being installed, the screens seem to be in place.

PIS screens are the same that were installed in Gatwick Express days by the looks of it.

TEW · 6 Jul 2019

aleggatta said:
I'm honestly surprised that they have not fitted the SDO system that was fitted to the 458's, they know the kit works and would standardise operations across the fleets

The 458 ASDO system had a lot of issues at first although it does seem to have settled down now.

Goldfish62 · 6 Jul 2019

TEW said:
The 458 ASDO system had a lot of issues at first although it does seem to have settled down now.

Still has issues with random doors not opening, but better than it was.

43096 · 6 Jul 2019

Goldfish62 said:
Still has issues with random doors not opening, but better than it was.

To be fair, it is ages since I last saw one have that defect - must be at least 18 months, probably longer, and I use them regularly.

theironroad · 6 Jul 2019

samuelmorris said:
Thanks for confirmation - never seen that before. Why does each set have a different letter then? Is that necessary?

To be fair, I've not seen it before either and certainly seems to be a recent addition as the letters weren't there when the 442s left swt 10+ years ago.

It seems the PIS (Passenger Information System) screens inside each carriage aren't capable of displaying the coach number, unlike swr desiros which had the faculty added.

Often when people board they don't know what carriage they are in and people being in the wrong part of the train at short platforms is still a problem. At least with the desiros, when the guard says you need to bein the front 5 for the next station, people can refer to the screen and see they are in coach 7 and need to move forward.

The 2105 Waterloo to Poole which is supposed to be a 442 eventually, will stop at a number of stations which are short platforms. We'll have to wait and see how effective the lettering system is, but it seems to be a good idea if the PIS isn't capable of displaying it.

Class 442s - Now at the end of the road and to be withdrawn permanently

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