Shall we worry about Bedford station when we have a route for the cambridge section all agreed?
Stop talking sense!
Shall we worry about Bedford station when we have a route for the cambridge section all agreed?
What reason is there for overtaking on the Down Fast? It's never needed except in very out of course running, and if it had to be done then the train to be overtaken would just cross to the Slows. Also any loop turnouts would be on the curve mentioned, which would almost certainly reduce further the permitted speed for non-stopping trains.for bedford it would probably make platform 4 into an island(creating platform 5), so stoppers would take the points and come in on the rear side of the present platform(where the substation is), leaving faster trains a place to bypass as required through present P4.
I think do-able as the present curvature of the line restricts the speed of the trains going through anyway(I think it's 80mph). for a stopper they are approaching at perhaps 40mph in any case it's not going to cause a problem.
the new P5 would be about 200m Long so could cope with a 5 car 22x/18x without much issue...could handle an 8 car 360 no problem too.
platform 1a definitiely needs knocking through to make a new one capable of holding/dispatching a train of reasonable length( ie 8 or 12 car) all the way through.
Why would we wait for ewr to choose a route?
All trains will terminate at Bedford for years before all that gets built.
Not just the tracks and layout, the car park is full at 0730am. Station is currently running at full capacity already. It's shameful and blind hope that any of this is considered beforehand. The station plans should be first, then build the railway.
The length of the train procurement is definitely important at this stage as Bedford cannot park more trains in p1 or P2 that would be ridiculous.
EWR terminating at Bedford is a few years away. EWR running through to Cambridge is many years away. If the decision is rushed on what to do at Bedford then there is a risk of building something unnecessary (because you provided for EWR to pass through and it ended up taking another route or didn't happen at all) or building something that only lasts a few years (because you assumed EWR would take a different route and it ended up passing through Midland). That's exactly the sort of situation where the railway is accused of wasting money.I get the options. There are many option to procrastinate should be taken off the list.
Railways are a very sensitive issue at Bedford due to events happening in the past 18 months. The sensitivity doesn't end there.
Car park is at capacity, would the car park be further restricted during any works?
If you wait until the EWR railway is complete from Oxford to Bedford and then you decide to rebuild Bedford. Yeah that would NOT go down popular as traffic at rush hour is already grid locked as Bromham road bridge is out. The Wellingborough replacement special bus probably takes 1 hour plus as it takes the diversionary route that EVERYONE IS TAKING. Thameslink have given Bedfordians absolute hell for 18 months already. Something needs to be talked about now.
Bedford is a huge huge part of EWR. If Bedford isn't done right, none of it is.
EWR terminating at Bedford is a few years away. EWR running through to Cambridge is many years away. If the decision is rushed on what to do at Bedford then there is a risk of building something unnecessary (because you provided for EWR to pass through and it ended up taking another route or didn't happen at all) or building something that only lasts a few years (because you assumed EWR would take a different route and it ended up passing through Midland). That's exactly the sort of situation where the railway is accused of wasting money.
But doesnt buying a 4 car unit procurement next week kind of force the issue if that were to happen?
Basically im only mentioning Bedford because of the notification that ewr are asking vendors for design ideas and that spec will include the amount of seats and carriage stock per unit. So Bedford will be the bottleneck in that decision making process. Or at least it will potentially force a rebuild of Bedford to some degree. Otherwise Bedford is not fit for purpose.
I don't like knowing one bit without the other. Shouldn't be procuring stock without a planned route.
According to RAIL magazine (See https://www.railmagazine.com/news/network/tender-set-to-be-issued-for-east-west-rail-rolling-stock ) EWR are going for 3 carriage trains initially.
Also EWR are talking about 1tph Bedford to Oxford initially (See https://eastwestrail.co.uk/the-project/western-section).
Of course the Oxford to Bedford service will be faster than the existing Vale trains so there will be some "catching up" but as we are only talking 2tph, the existing platform 1A at Bedford will be fine.
The choice of route for the Bedford to Cambridge section and what happens at Bedford station are closely bound together though.
It was unfortunate that the consultation didn't explicitly say what works would happen at Bedford (and the likely temporary impact).
If the fast train from Oxford to Bedford is to be extended towards East Anglia, it could be routed via Corby and a new curve near Manton to Peterborough.
It isn't a difficult problem.
Haha, tell that to Bedford commuters about the time table changes.
Very simple changes can have severe repercussions. Moving anything to the right will eat into the taxi lay by and potentially spill out into Ashburnham road. If P1A is extended north of the current station building that will take away the motorcycle and cyclists storage area. There isn't space that is currently expendable without losing something important.
I think with what Dynamicspirit said, a 4 car train will fit into 1A as it is, so my concerns are only real concerns if one of the cross country trains breaks down at Bedford. Which I accept is a reasonable risk.
If P1A goes through the station as you suggest it will alleviate more of the problems and future proof services. But at the cost of shunting or destroying some facilities in the station.
Goodness me.
The biggest time issues are often around utilities not on the NR side.I remember about a year ago I had concerns over the Bromham Road bridge and you said its a simple switch over to a new bridge and happens all the time. Network rail have stated the road is now closed for 11 months.
Obviously we do not share the same definition of "simple" and "easy". I certainly do not think 11 months sounds "simple" or "easy". In fact, many people complained recently in the local paper that some bridges are replaced over a weekend with a single beam. So it baffles me why such simple things take so much time. The underground work was complete before the 11 month closure. Looking at it today they haven't even removed any of the old road yet and its been 2 weeks already. I'd love to get some Bedford commuters to come in here and share some of their experiences, like having being crushed into trains whilst EMT run half empty trains whizzing past them.
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I think with what Dynamicspirit said, a 4 car train will fit into 1A as it is, so my concerns are only real concerns if one of the cross country trains breaks down at Bedford. Which I accept is a reasonable risk.
I wonder where the train crew and maintenance depots are?
What acronym describes a hydrogen or bi mode unit? Has it been coined yet?
25minutes are added to the Oxford journey time to represent the option of one service being extended to / from Reading with a Reading –Oxford non-stop.
According to RAIL magazine (See https://www.railmagazine.com/news/network/tender-set-to-be-issued-for-east-west-rail-rolling-stock ) EWR are going for 3 carriage trains initially.
Also EWR are talking about 1tph Bedford to Oxford initially (See https://eastwestrail.co.uk/the-project/western-section).
Hmm, I feel that if this happens they may get uncomfortably full pretty quickly. If a slow uncomfortable coach can maintain a 30 minute frequency, a 3 carriage train definitely can. What is it in this country with failing to build things properly. Seriosly, just electrify and use proper length trains. If done properly this could get very busy.
There is a new version of the Eastern-Section-Prospectus on the eastwestrail.org.uk web site.
https://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/wp-...062018-Item-7b-Eastern-Section-Prospectus.pdf
On Page 13 it has the statement:
"25minutes are added to the Oxford journey time to represent the option of one service being extended to / from Reading with a Reading –Oxford non-stop."
I do hope they start a Reading to Cambridge service. I fear its still a long way off though as the middle part of the line is missing.
That URL is for a prospectus from July 2018.
This is the one for the one from January 2019. It is linked from the new article at www.eastwestrail.org.uk
https://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/wp-...st-Rail-Eastern-Section-Rail-Prospectus-3.pdf
Page 10 of the new document doesn't mention anything beyond Oxford in the list of rail improvement recommendations from the Eastern Section Rail Study.