Caledonian Sleeper

47271 · 13 Jul 2019

@alistairlees - only this morning I've had this subject highlighted to me locally on Speyside.

The current arrangement on the Highlander whereby all berths are made up as 'Classic' twins is generating quite a bit of irritation amongst Flexipass regulars who have been summarily re categorised from First Class to Classic with no alternative product available. Cramped two berth cabins, no inclusive breakfast and no lounge access, a fine end to many years of loyal travel and a ticket that costs £1550 a go.

By contrast if they book on the Lowlander they get automatically upgraded to Club with all of those benefits as a 'thank you". The problem is, they need to use the Highlander on a weekly basis.

It's probably not thought through in the circumstances of delayed introduction of the new stock, rather than deliberately punitive, but it isn't a great recipe for retention of their best customers.

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Bald Rick · 13 Jul 2019

marks87 said:
An early arrival into Waverley.

I managed a decent nights sleep. I woke up a couple of times, once when I could have sworn we’d already reached Carstairs because I was sure we were going the other way. We hadn’t because we weren’t

One gripe was the tap in the room losing pressure, but otherwise pretty uneventful. I’d definitely do it again.

Glad you enjoyed it - I did too, and will use it again when the Highlander goes over to the new stock.

My “wow” was about the size of a hotel room. I’ve never been in one that small!

paul1609 · 13 Jul 2019

47271 said:
@alistairlees - only this morning I've had this subject highlighted to me locally on Speyside.

The current arrangement on the Highlander whereby all berths are made up as 'Classic' twins is generating quite a bit of irritation amongst Flexipass regulars who have been summarily re categorised from First Class to Classic with no alternative product available. Cramped two berth cabins, no inclusive breakfast and no lounge access, a fine end to many years of loyal travel and a ticket that costs £1550 a go.

By contrast if they book on the Lowlander they get automatically upgraded to Club with all of those benefits as a 'thank you". The problem is, they need to use the Highlander on a weekly basis.

It's probably not thought through in the circumstances of delayed introduction of the new stock, rather than deliberately punitive, but it isn't a great recipe for retention of their best customers.

Surely that's how demand marketing works? The lowlander has serious competition from the airlines for business the few regulars from the Highland mainline (who are buying heavily discounted tickets anyway) are a captive market.

47271 · 13 Jul 2019

paul1609 said:
Surely that's how demand marketing works? The lowlander has serious competition from the airlines for business the few regulars from the Highland mainline (who are buying heavily discounted tickets anyway) are a captive market.

Fair enough if CS know that the Highlander is going to be jammed full year round, which it isn't, but you would think that they could've come up with a more expensive Flexipass product as an alternative at the same time as withdrawing benefits.

Furthermore Flexipass passengers bought a product based on a range of advertised benefits being available and those benefits have been withdrawn unannounced, would you describe that as fair demand marketing?

Would you be happy with this however discounted your ticket had been at time of purchase?

Bletchleyite · 13 Jul 2019

I'd call it bait and switch.

MrEd · 13 Jul 2019

Crepello said:
Sheesh, maximum respect! I can only assume both were accomplished at yoga, or had good physiotherapists.......

I do believe that a yoga mat and folding mattress were used in an attempt to make a double bed out of a Mk3 first class berth... I happened to be in the berth next door (G19) so heard their nocturnal antics for most of the way from Crewe to Edinburgh... the poor lady (a first-time traveller on the Sleeper) then fell asleep and was none the wiser until she woke up near Ardlui, became disorientated, wondered where her breakfast was (which had probably been delivered at 6.30 to an empty room on the Aberdeen section) and asked the Fort William team leader in the lounge what time she’d be in Aberdeen!

The look on her face when she was told that ‘the train she was on didn’t go to Aberdeen...’ was priceless...

Bald Rick · 13 Jul 2019

MrEd said:
I do believe that a yoga mat and folding mattress were used in an attempt to make a double bed out of a Mk3 first class berth... I happened to be in the berth next door (G19) so heard their nocturnal antics for most of the way from Crewe to Edinburgh... the poor lady (a first-time traveller on the Sleeper) then fell asleep and was none the wiser until she woke up near Ardlui, became disorientated, wondered where her breakfast was (which had probably been delivered at 6.30 to an empty room on the Aberdeen section) and asked the Fort William team leader in the lounge what time she’d be in Aberdeen!

The look on her face when she was told that ‘the train she was on didn’t go to Aberdeen...’ was priceless...

Crewe to Edinburgh? Tip of the hat for stamina.

leightonbd · 13 Jul 2019

When it takes you all night to do, what you used to do all night ...

Caleb2010 · 13 Jul 2019

RIP Fred Wedlock

If you book into the accessible berth and ask for the top bunk to be stowed away for you to utilize the space more effectively with your wheelchair/ walker the request goes in one ear and out of the other, and has done since Serco took over - even when it was classed as a first class berth.

marks87 · 13 Jul 2019

The top bunk itself wasn't an issue for me last night, but the ladder did make things difficult, especially with the table folded out.

I guess, though, making the ladder removable by passengers opens the risk of it being put back incorrectly then used, leading to injury.

greaterwest · 13 Jul 2019

marks87 said:
The top bunk itself wasn't an issue for me last night, but the ladder did make things difficult, especially with the table folded out.

I guess, though, making the ladder removable by passengers opens the risk of it being put back incorrectly then used, leading to injury.

The ladder folds away into the wall effortlessly and conveniently on the GWR sleepers.

Caleb2010 · 13 Jul 2019

I usually chuck the ladder and my bag on the top bunk, hang something over both the hangers to stop them banging against the wall and jam my walking aid up against the cupboard to stop it shooting out when cornering.

Swap the pillows from one end to the other - so I don't roll out of bed on braking/ accelerating (depending weather we're before of after Edinburgh)

Then all I have to do is hope that the door locks!

Bald Rick · 13 Jul 2019

marks87 said:
The top bunk itself wasn't an issue for me last night, but the ladder did make things difficult, especially with the table folded out.

I guess, though, making the ladder removable by passengers opens the risk of it being put back incorrectly then used, leading to injury.

The ladder on the new stock is easily removable. It is held in by two clips at the bottom and two locating lugs at the top. Just pull it away from the bed at the bottom, and then carefully lower it out of the lug put it on the spare bunk. Easy.

ainsworth74 · 13 Jul 2019

Let's leave some passengers nocturnal antics behind us now shall we? I think it's been explored quite enough and I do feel compelled to remind members that the Forum Rules do require that we keep content family friendly

Peter Mugridge · 13 Jul 2019

This talk about the upper bunk... well, when I went in April on the Mk3s out to Edinburgh and back from Glasgow, in both directions - different carriage each way - the upper bunk was stowed away, so this may be something more to do with the individual crews than a general policy?

trebor79 · 13 Jul 2019

Peter Mugridge said:
This talk about the upper bunk... well, when I went in April on the Mk3s out to Edinburgh and back from Glasgow, in both directions - different carriage each way - the upper bunk was stowed away, so this may be something more to do with the individual crews than a general policy?

Was that on the new stock though? It's only the Mk3s that have the top bunks down all the time.

Steve Harris · 13 Jul 2019

trebor79 said:
Was that on the new stock though? It's only the Mk3s that have the top bunks down all the time.

Well.

If you care to actually read what you quoted...

Peter Mugridge said:
This talk about the upper bunk... well, when I went in April on the Mk3s out to Edinburgh and back from Glasgow, in both directions - different carriage each way - the upper bunk was stowed away, so this may be something more to do with the individual crews than a general policy?

So, no it was not on the new stock (the new stock being Mk5).

trebor79 · 14 Jul 2019

Oh yes, I missed that!

Essexman · 14 Jul 2019

Flexipass passengers on Highlander are getting £20 refund as it is old stock. I’ve still had free breakfast on my recent journeys (from Upper Tyndrum in June & Inverness in July).

It was never clear whether Flexipass would give Club or Classic berth and the Club they are allocating on Lowlander is good value I think.

My concern is how much the Flexipass will go up at the next review.

47271 · 14 Jul 2019

Essexman said:
Flexipass passengers on Highlander are getting £20 refund as it is old stock. I’ve still had free breakfast on my recent journeys (from Upper Tyndrum in June & Inverness in July).

It was never clear whether Flexipass would give Club or Classic berth and the Club they are allocating on Lowlander is good value I think.

My concern is how much the Flexipass will go up at the next review.

I don't think that any of my contacts have been offered a refund, but I'll check. I'm sure that they would've said if they had been, a large part of the complaint is one of a lack of communication after all.

I agree that the Club upgrade on the Lowlander is good value, it's a shame that things have got so muddled on the Highlander.

jagardner1984 · 14 Jul 2019

I would have thought given recent events, and given how easily business travellers might be tempted to air or day train, locking the Flexipass with Club Room at current prices (which are hardly for the faint hearted anyway) would be the very LEAST they could do for a long suffering core user base.

InOban · 14 Jul 2019

If there are people prepared to pay the top fare during the summer peak, it seems reasonable to reserve these berths for these high rollers. But out of season these valuable regular passengers should be offered an upgrade to the premium berths, as they would on an airline.

FQTV · 14 Jul 2019

47271 said:
@alistairlees - only this morning I've had this subject highlighted to me locally on Speyside.

The current arrangement on the Highlander whereby all berths are made up as 'Classic' twins is generating quite a bit of irritation amongst Flexipass regulars who have been summarily re categorised from First Class to Classic with no alternative product available. Cramped two berth cabins, no inclusive breakfast and no lounge access, a fine end to many years of loyal travel and a ticket that costs £1550 a go.

By contrast if they book on the Lowlander they get automatically upgraded to Club with all of those benefits as a 'thank you". The problem is, they need to use the Highlander on a weekly basis.

It's probably not thought through in the circumstances of delayed introduction of the new stock, rather than deliberately punitive, but it isn't a great recipe for retention of their best customers.

So do I understand that, between now and the introduction of the new stock on The Highlander, no rooms are being sold as ‘First Class’? Apologies if I’m getting the wrong end of the stick!

DarloRich · 14 Jul 2019

FQTV said:
So do I understand that, between now and the introduction of the new stock on The Highlander, no rooms are being sold as ‘First Class’? Apologies if I’m getting the wrong end of the stick!

No. It seems not. Both of mine this week were classic berth solo occupancy.

Both bunks were made up

47271 · 14 Jul 2019

FQTV said:
So do I understand that, between now and the introduction of the new stock on The Highlander, no rooms are being sold as ‘First Class’? Apologies if I’m getting the wrong end of the stick!

Yes, that's it, the whole train is being run with twin berths without anyone bothering to communicate about it. If you try to book Club then it comes up as 'sold out'.

It wouldn't be so bad if regulars had been contacted and reassured that, whilst the cabins are twins, everything else such as breakfast and lounge access continues as normal, and crews would be informed of that. But from what I'm hearing they've been left to argue it out on a train by train basis.

Also to confirm as of today that no refunds have been offered to any of the Flexipass holders I'm in touch with. This is particularly irritating when you can go online and buy an identical Classic cabin on the Highlander for £140, £15 less than a Flexipass trip.

It really isn't great in amongst everything else that's going wrong.

Gems · 14 Jul 2019

Never took a blind bit of notice of the 'Cali sleeper' until recently when we had a go on it. £70 for two of us priv from Fort William to Euston. Even Ryanair would struggle to beat that.

Shame it was the old stock. It's in a terrible state isn't it? but the bunks are quite comfy.

31160 · 14 Jul 2019

Would I be right in thinking 92044 is the sole 92 that hasn't had the ETH enhanced for the MK5s so that's the only one that can still do the MK3 rakes or can they still work the older stuff

ScottDarg · 14 Jul 2019

31160 said:
Would I be right in thinking 92044 is the sole 92 that hasn't had the ETH enhanced for the MK5s so that's the only one that can still do the MK3 rakes or can they still work the older stuff

92032 and 044 are the only 2 out of 12 92s not being modified for Mk.5 work, but they can still work with the old Mk.2/3 stock if required.

The 10 modified are 92006, 010, 014, 018, 020, 023, 028, 033, 038 and 043.

superkev · 14 Jul 2019

ScottDarg said:
92032 and 044 are the only 2 of 12 92s not getting modified for Mk.5 work, but they can still work with the old Mk.2/3 stock if required.

The 10 modified are 92006, 010, 014, 018, 020, 023, 028, 033, 038 and 043.

Wow, I didn't realise it needed so many electric locos to haul just daily 4 trains.
K
K

ScottDarg · 14 Jul 2019

superkev said:
Wow, I didn't realise it needed so many electric locos to haul just daily 4 trains.
K
K

7 required each night:

4x for the runs Up/Down the WCML.
1x for Carstairs - Edinburgh
2x for the ECS moves in Glasgow and London

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