• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Petition to bring back the buffet on GWR

Status
Not open for further replies.

Master29

Established Member
Joined
19 Feb 2015
Messages
1,967
The difference is is that they are much more populated, are bigger and trade flourishes more there. I’ll remind you that Cornwall is NOT in-fact the centre of the universe.
Except for the fact it`s the largest holiday destination in the UK bar Devon and flourishes as such through most of the year and not only in July and August as the class 800 fan club would have you believe. It is also as stated more densely populated than both Scotland and Wales, has plenty of historical as well as current industry and IS recognised as it`s own nation within the Celtic community, and no, I`m not Cornish. Knowledge is a handy thing sometimes.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
Except for the fact it`s the largest holiday destination in the UK bar Devon and flourishes as such through most of the year and not only in July and August as the class 800 fan club would have you believe. It is also as stated more densely populated than both Scotland and Wales, has plenty of historical as well as current industry and IS recognised as it`s own nation within the Celtic community, and no, I`m not Cornish. Knowledge is a handy thing sometimes.

I’m not apart of the “class 800 fans” unlike you to the class 43 protection society, however, I feel that people are u fairly judging them as of present.

We’re getting somewhere now. 2 months down, now finish the next 10 months of the year.
 

irish_rail

Established Member
Joined
30 Oct 2013
Messages
3,813
Location
Plymouth
You have a 30 minute service now, which is deemed as an improvement. Anything else? Make HS2 go to Plymouth?
So because I would like to see GWR market the route to Cornwall harder to increase economic prosperity to one of the poorest parts of Europe you come out with a pointless sarcastic comment. Grow up.
 

al78

Established Member
Joined
7 Jan 2013
Messages
2,400
Except for the fact it`s the largest holiday destination in the UK bar Devon and flourishes as such through most of the year and not only in July and August as the class 800 fan club would have you believe. It is also as stated more densely populated than both Scotland and Wales, has plenty of historical as well as current industry and IS recognised as it`s own nation within the Celtic community, and no, I`m not Cornish. Knowledge is a handy thing sometimes.

Have you got any official figures for that claim? I'm struggling to find anything that states Cornwall is the largest UK holiday destination (assuming largest means most popular).

https://www.housebeautiful.com/uk/l...th-voted-most-popular-uk-holiday-destination/
https://www.mirror.co.uk/travel/uk-ireland/uk-destinations-most-popular-brits-18329926
https://www.prima.co.uk/travel/a28166788/bath-most-popular-uk-summer-holiday-destination/
 

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
So because I would like to see GWR market the route to Cornwall harder to increase economic prosperity to one of the poorest parts of Europe you come out with a pointless sarcastic comment. Grow up.

My point is that GWR are already trying to increase the service into Cornwall. They have began by doubling the frequency, I mean, if they did that on my lines towards Wales, Bristol and Swindon/London that would be brilliant and something which would greatly benefit us. Now you have a doubled frequency do you want it doubled again? Or what exactly do you want?
 

Master29

Established Member
Joined
19 Feb 2015
Messages
1,967
Have you got any official figures for that claim? I'm struggling to find anything that states Cornwall is the largest UK holiday destination (assuming largest means most popular).
https://www.visitcornwall.com/about...-why-cornwall-number-1-uk-holiday-destination
https://www.express.co.uk/travel/ar...t-popular-uk-beach-holiday-spot-by-travelodge.

Just as official as yours.
I’m not apart of the “class 800 fans” unlike you to the class 43 protection society, however, I feel that people are u fairly judging them as of present.

We’re getting somewhere now. 2 months down, now finish the next 10 months of the year
No one is judging anybody. Just pointing out your argument that Cornwall is nothing special is flawed and nowhere do I say I am member of the class 43 society (Now who`s judging who?;)) but if you wish to go down that route then yes, imo it is a far superior train to what we now have for many reasons and romance isn`t one of them.
 
Last edited:

irish_rail

Established Member
Joined
30 Oct 2013
Messages
3,813
Location
Plymouth
My point is that GWR are already trying to increase the service into Cornwall. They have began by doubling the frequency, I mean, if they did that on my lines towards Wales, Bristol and Swindon/London that would be brilliant and something which would greatly benefit us. Now you have a doubled frequency do you want it doubled again? Or what exactly do you want?
You totally misunderstand my point. I was merely saying GWR should exploit and market the 'Celtic' angle as it is popular with overseas visitors and brits alike. The south west relies heavily on tourism, your area less so. I am not asking for any additional services to the South West, merely some marketing, for example maybe a train naming (something other than these ridiculous "great westerners" namings). That's just one example of an idea I'm sure they could come up with others.
 

broadgage

Member
Joined
11 Aug 2012
Messages
1,094
Location
Somerset
Cornwall and other parts of the West country are undeniably very popular holiday destinations, and rail travel thereto is likely to increase as the climate costs of air travel and driving become more widely known.

Leisure travellers AND long distance business users expect that proper long distance trains will have a buffet. It is part of running a train service, even if not directly profitable.
Whilst IETs have their supporters, very few business or leisure travellers regard a single 5 car DMU with no buffet as being an improvement over the inter-city trains used previously.
Even the miserable trolley service is getting worse, if provided at all.
 

GodAtum

On Moderation
Joined
11 Dec 2009
Messages
2,633
If that is your perspective then it reinforces my point.

You should plan for the potential situation that it won't be available. Not as was the case of the situation which started this debate, have a 5 hour journey and children crying

Do you consider that the present patchy provision is acceptable? I absolutely do not. If you do, then more fool you; you must have unscrupulous companies taking advantage of you all the time.



This is sensible particularly with kids, but it doesn't mean it's OK for GWR not to provide a service they advertise simply because they can't acquire suitable equipment and recruit suitable staff.

We regularly travel on Virgin which has excellent catering services. Therefore i assumed because this was a long distance service and it was stated there was on-board catering, a trolley would be provided.
 

Busaholic

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Jun 2014
Messages
14,029
The fact that this is #730 shows that it is a subject worth discussing and I'd suggest there is a general consensus that the current situation on the West of England main line is unacceptable, but a less general feeling that anything can or, more importantly will, be done. With a General Election on the horizon, possibly comparatively soon, if anything is to be done then this is the time for it to start. The Cornish Tory MPs in particular are all too aware that most of their seats are susceptible, even if as a bunch they have all the clout of Mr Bean, but they can be got squirming at least, always pleasureable to the eye.
 

Goldfish62

Established Member
Joined
14 Feb 2010
Messages
9,937
I wonder if anyone has complained to the ASA yet about this work of fiction on the GWR website:
https://www.gwr.com/plan-journey/journey-information/on-board/food-and-drink
.
Food and drink
Hungry and travelling in Standard Class on one of our high-speed services?

Then try our new on-board menu with a wide selection of food and drinks, including vegetarian, gluten-free and healthy options.

Breakfast menu (until 11:30)
  • Rolls and breakfast pots
  • Pastries and sweet treats

All-day menu (from 11:30)


  • Sandwiches and hot food
  • Savoury snacks

  • Sweet treats

[paste:font size="4"]Drinks menu
[/paste:font]
  • Hot drinks

  • Soft drinks
  • Alcoholic drinks
 

JN114

Established Member
Joined
28 Jun 2005
Messages
3,346
A small and vociferous contingent on a rather niche corner of the Internet is not an indicator of a broader, general consensus. I think Cornish MPs have a lot more pressing matters to be concerning themselves with than over whether the small fraction of Cornish constituents who actually make use of on train catering facilities get their lukewarm tea from a counter or a trolley. I think they’d likely turn around and say what has been said by realists in this thread all along:-

A catering service is provided. GWR aren’t doing the best job of implementing that at present. We will put pressure on them to at least deliver what they’re meant to be doing now before backing expensive and disruptive modifications to trains that won’t actually fix the problems encountered.
 

takno

Established Member
Joined
9 Jul 2016
Messages
5,038
I think Cornish MPs have a lot more pressing matters to be concerning themselves with than over whether the small fraction of Cornish constituents who actually make use of on train catering facilities get their lukewarm tea from a counter or a trolley.
I'm not convinced they do. I mean everything's on hold pending the point when they give up and have another election anyway. Why not kick up a fuss about something relatively safe like on-train catering. If you can't risk sticking your head above the parapet on Europe then it might at least get you on the old telly.

More importantly though, the whole point of the conversation is that the tea wouldn't *be* lukewarm if it was from the buffet rather than the trolley
 

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
Can we now get back on topic. A reminder that the network consists of all lines from Paddington to Bristol, Wales, Cheltenham, Hereford and Penzance, and we should therefore discuss pratical solutions which will not fair operationally difficult. I think what the RMT want and the general public is not for Penzance to get a buffet service but all of the network to have one back.
 

RealTrains07

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2019
Messages
1,748
First should be stripped of the franchise or just lose it. They’ve had it long enough and way too many extensions later here we are. Poor customer experience as usual. These are High speed trains. Not commuter trains! virgin wouldnt have no buffet in their services
 

Mag_seven

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
1 Sep 2014
Messages
9,994
Location
here to eternity
First should be stripped of the franchise or just lose it. They’ve had it long enough and way too many extensions later here we are. Poor customer experience as usual. These are High speed trains. Not commuter trains! virgin wouldnt have no buffet in their services

So First should be stripped of the franchise for not having buffet cars by the organisation that dictated that the stock would not have buffet cars - how does that work!
 

RealTrains07

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2019
Messages
1,748
So First should be stripped of the franchise for not having buffet cars by the organisation that dictated that the stock would not have buffet cars - how does that work!
Iam talking in General. This is just 1 way of how first is failing its customers. DfT shouldnt be this involved with GWR trains either but their you go
 

irish_rail

Established Member
Joined
30 Oct 2013
Messages
3,813
Location
Plymouth
Can we now get back on topic. A reminder that the network consists of all lines from Paddington to Bristol, Wales, Cheltenham, Hereford and Penzance, and we should therefore discuss pratical solutions which will not fair operationally difficult. I think what the RMT want and the general public is not for Penzance to get a buffet service but all of the network to have one back.
But IF buffets are to have even a miniscule chance of being brought back it will be on the padd to Penzance route . Can't see them coming back on everything, oxfords bristols and all.
 

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
Iam talking in General. This is just 1 way of how first is failing its customers. DfT shouldnt be this involved with GWR trains either but their you go

I hope you understand how franchising works, and the topic of this thread. Now please think before you speak next time on here..

But IF buffets are to have even a miniscule chance of being brought back it will be on the padd to Penzance route . Can't see them coming back on everything, oxfords bristols and all.

I think that this would prove difficult for GWR because ultimately they struggle to have perfect allocations and the RMT would kick their toys out their prom if it was only on certain routes.
 

Darandio

Established Member
Joined
24 Feb 2007
Messages
10,674
Location
Redcar
I hope you understand how franchising works, and the topic of this thread. Now please think before you speak next time on here.

Don't worry, it's just one of those generic 'Love Virgin - Hate First!' posts that appear time and again. They fade away.
 

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
Don't worry, it's just one of those generic 'Love Virgin - Hate First!' posts that appear time and again. They fade away.

Train fan not Railway it seems, nothing. wrong with that but shouldn’t bother commenting about the operational side of things when they know zilch about it.
 

Master29

Established Member
Joined
19 Feb 2015
Messages
1,967
Can we now get back on topic. A reminder that the network consists of all lines from Paddington to Bristol, Wales, Cheltenham, Hereford and Penzance, and we should therefore discuss pratical solutions which will not fair operationally difficult. I think what the RMT want and the general public is not for Penzance to get a buffet service but all of the network to have one back.
You do seem to have a particular beef concerning the RMT. It seems to be a bandwagon on this forum at times.

Don't worry, it's just one of those generic 'Love Virgin - Hate First!' posts that appear time and again. They fade away.
Maybe if they actually provided a decent buffet service which Virgin although far from perfect at least do. Nothing generic about it.
 

RealTrains07

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2019
Messages
1,748
You do seem to have a particular beef concerning the RMT. It seems to be a bandwagon on this forum at times.


Maybe if they actually provided a decent buffet service which Virgin although far from perfect at least do. Nothing generic about it.
At least someone sees where iam coming from :s virgin is another service which is arguably just as much as a commuter service as people are arguing GWR to be. And considering that the IET and Pendalino have more similarities in the services they run and yet 1 is without a buffet?
 

CharlesR

Member
Joined
11 Apr 2019
Messages
236
At least someone sees where iam coming from :s virgin is another service which is arguably just as much as a commuter service as people are arguing GWR to be. And considering that the IET and Pendalino have more similarities in the services they run and yet 1 is without a buffet?

Possibly because they were built for completely different routes at completely different times. DfT didn’t allow buffets onto the GWR 800s and GWR chose to not install them onto the 802s either. Secondly, GWR is not similar to Virgin. They operate along many different lines with very different populations. Virgin are able to operate a lot of fast services along the West Coast where as GWR serve intermediate stations which generate a lot of their revenue. Will you come back to this thread with something logistical to back your points?

You do seem to have a particular beef concerning the RMT. It seems to be a bandwagon on this forum at times.

I don’t have “beef” with the RMT. I stated what the RMT would say about it being deployed onto a particular route, which at no point involved me saying that I dislike the RMT. They do a brilliant job at protecting their workers, however sometimes I feel they go too far.
 

Mountain Man

Member
Joined
15 Jun 2019
Messages
311
Can we now get back on topic. A reminder that the network consists of all lines from Paddington to Bristol, Wales, Cheltenham, Hereford and Penzance, and we should therefore discuss pratical solutions which will not fair operationally difficult. I think what the RMT want and the general public is not for Penzance to get a buffet service but all of the network to have one back.
On what basis do you claim to speak for the general public?
 

FGW_DID

Established Member
Joined
23 Jun 2011
Messages
2,724
Location
81E
DfT didn’t allow buffets onto the GWR 800s and GWR chose to not install them onto the 802s either.

As has been mentioned at various points in this thread and in the now locked 800 thread and clarified countless times by Clarence Yard. It wasn’t that GWR chose not to fit buffets, DFT wouldn’t have authorised the Class 802 order if the internal specification didn’t match the IEP procured Class 800.
 

RealTrains07

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2019
Messages
1,748
Possibly because they were built for completely different routes at completely different times. DfT didn’t allow buffets onto the GWR 800s and GWR chose to not install them onto the 802s either. Secondly, GWR is not similar to Virgin. They operate along many different lines with very different populations. Virgin are able to operate a lot of fast services along the West Coast where as GWR serve intermediate stations which generate a lot of their revenue. Will you come back to this thread with something logistical to back your points?

Theirs nothing logistical to say about an argument like this its based on opinion only
 

Goldfish62

Established Member
Joined
14 Feb 2010
Messages
9,937
What exactly will the ASA find issue with? All those items are indeed on the menu (subject to availability); and available on request from the trolley.
So it's acceptable that "subject to availability" means never? These items are not available. I've had it confirmed by traincrew who state that the menu on the website is complete fiction.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top