Having been 16 at the time of the Robbery, living not too far away I have followed the story on and off ever since with interest. I watched the programme but didn't think it lived up to the pre showing hype. I thought the new information was scarce apart from the one new name. I hope the book is better.
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Untold truths-Great Train Robbery
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g.satchwell
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Dear LMS 4F, Some people seemed to have enjoyed the Ch.4 programme, and that's great. But some others have written to me saying they thought it said little that was new and essentially, agreeing with you. I AGREE WITH YOU TOO. Unlike my book, I could not control the 'approach and content' of the Ch.4 production.
I can promise you this without reservation. The book contains a great deal of powerful new material, much of it from from former BR personnel (as well as confidential sources) and 'open' sources that have not previously been properly 'mined'. If you have any doubt, wait and see the reviews that will certainly follow publication. I am completely confident that the TV prog and the book are poles apart.
I fully appreciate that TV companies are a law unto themselves and often are strangers to the truth, particularly in fictional programmes. That is why I am very selective about watching anything about the Army or Police work, both of which I have considerable experience of. It does of course limit my viewing but so be it. Good luck with your book.
g.satchwell
Member
I can't watch (most) British crime drama for the same reason. Thank you your best wishes.
70014IronDuke
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Fiction is, well... fiction. So we can't really go there. But, having worked in media, including some TV much of my life, I can see both sides. Yes, it is true that many reporters come straight out of college and have no specialised knowledge on any subject except journalism and associated legal matters.
But then these days their audiences are often no different.
I have not watched the Train Robbery report, but you have to realise that the reporters and producers have to aim at a pretty dim-witted audience whose only specialised knowledge is who is likely to get thrown out of Love Island next. (I'm guessing here, I have never seen Love Island and I don't know if you get thrown off it - but you see what I mean, I hope.)
Unlike the hundreds of contributors in here, the vast majority of TV viewers will have no real idea how signalling works (like traffic lights, innit?) or even how mail was carried in the 1960s. And if they are the slightest bit bored, they will do the unmentionable, and switch off. I was shocked to realise, about two months ago, that my own wife did not really understand how a train is guided via the rail-flange system (though she did, at least, realise trains don't have steering wheels). She has a degree, speaks 6 languages and is no fool - but didn't know what a flange is, and struggled to understand when I did a simple engineering drawing of a wheelset. That part of life has just passed her by.
g.satchwell
Member
That about sums it up Iron Duke.
I am sure you are correct but my worry is that these same people assume what they see on TV in particular is true, whether from fiction or not. Then when they do have reason to use or contact one of these services and it isn't what they have been led to expect then the problems really begin.
g.satchwell
Member
That's a 'biggy' LMS. You are right of course, it's a complicated issue and not easily resolved even conceptually.
70014IronDuke
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And I'm sure you're correct too! But I'm afraid that this is the risk from any kind of fiction, and I fear we are all susceptible to reading or watching something and taking it on board as 'truth' through a blurring in the memory.
It is even worse when the subject is "based on a true story" - the writer (as opposed to historian or serious journo) then has carte blanche to invent as he or she sees fit around a genuine story or person. Shakespeare probably has a lot to answer for in terms of distorting foiks' opinions of a number of historical characters. As for Holocaust films, the camp inmates invariably look miserable and are treated roughly for sure, but most of them have proper bodies, with some fat on the faces. In reality, most were barely walking skeletons with a bit of skin around them.
BTW, I should say that there are, of course, editors and publishers who encourage sensational and extreme interpretations of 'factual reporting'. Best avoided, IMO.
g.satchwell
Member
Agreed.
g.satchwell
Member
I had a look at Ian Allan bookshop in Waterloo today. They've closed for good! Seems like a book launch is considered a good idea. I will do it in the Waterloo area or not too far from. 6-8pm at a friendly pub.
ChiefPlanner
Established Member
The Bham shop is being liquidated - was there today and got a good pile of hard core reading for the winter, am told the Waterloo shop stays open. Unless things have changed for the worse. In the words of the "Control" - keep us advised (please)
g.satchwell
Member
I definitely will, Chief Planner. According to the website the Waterloo branch is no more/. I will phone today and check. Otherwise I am open to suggestions about a 'relevant' Waterloo area location.
ChiefPlanner
Established Member
An unreformed and suitably old school pub (undescribable "Train Spotting" standard toilets) , but good beer is the "Hole in the Wall" - underneath the 4 tracks into Charing Cross station.
g.satchwell
Member
you were right about the bookshop, only the Birmingham one has closed. I have to phone back to see if they are interested in a book signing. 'The Hole in the Wall', I will call them too.
Dr_Paul
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I've just had a look at the Ian Allen website. There's nothing listed under the categories, nothing under 'new' or 'bargains', the whole thing seems to be shutting down. There's a thing under 'about us' that I didn't know: 'Today the company no longer produces transport titles but still publishes Masonic books and the quarterly magazine The Square under the Lewis Masonic imprint.' So unless the Lower Marsh shop is moving into Masonic regalia, I guess it's on its way out too.
duffield
Established Member
I guess this might explain why my Amazon order of the S.K. Baker "Rail Atlas of Great Britain and Ireland" 15th edition didn't arrive (I haven't been charged for it but it's still in the system). It looks like an alternative publisher may have been found because it now says "This title will be released on September 30, 2019.".
Quite lucky for me that I've seen this because I've just realised it was going to be sent to my work address - and I retired a month ago!
So I've been able to change it to my home address.
But obviously a shame for Ian Allen and staff; probably a reflection of the general decline in traditional 'paper' publishing particularly in certain genres.
You still can't beat having a traditional rail atlas, because you'll typically want your mobile to be displaying realtimetrains or similar!
Anyhow, apologies for wandering well off topic, I'll stop now.
Wivenswold
Established Member
Ian Allen lives but under new management. http://www.crecy.co.uk/
"Crécy Publishing Ltd announced that it has acquired the railway, transport and military history publishing interests of Ian Allan Publishing Ltd, including the ‘OPC’ railway imprint."
g.satchwell
Member
BOOK LAUNCH, Freemasons, Dr. Emil Savundra, etcetera. I only turned away from my desk for an hour! First of all, let me say that a book launch has been arranged for Wednesday 9th October, in a quiet old pub near Waterloo Station. Obviously, I need to keep a handle on the
numbers attending, so if anyone interested would like to drop me an email at [email protected] it would be helpful.
numbers attending, so if anyone interested would like to drop me an email at [email protected] it would be helpful.
ChiefPlanner
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A great shame as I will be overseas - hope it goes well.
WesternLancer
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Think all the Ian Allen stuff was taken over by Crecy Publishing - or much of it
http://www.crecy.co.uk/
My local bookshop was after an Ian Allen book for me that was out of print and new edition came from Crecy
g.satchwell
Member
I'm sorry to hear that you won't be able to make it, Chief Planner, thank you for all your help.
70014IronDuke
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Ha! Just my luck - but it's the other way round from C Planner. I'm not normally in the country, but I have to be a week later. Shame to just miss this.
g.satchwell
Member
Perhaps I could do the bookshop event whilst you are here?
70014IronDuke
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Dear GS, you are too kind - but you can never please all of the people all of the time. You have to do your book launch when you can and when you think it will attract the best crowd, including the railway press. I'm a nobody, and it's possible even though I will not be far away, family concerns will prevent me from being there in any case. But (as I suppose you will) post when the final time and place is confirmed - it is is when I'm in UK and near Waterloo, I will plan to attend.
g.satchwell
Member
Dear Iron Duke, It was a pleasure to read your message in every respect but one, you are certainly not ' a nobody'. If ever we needed proof that that there is no 'elite', that every human being is subject to the same needs and weaknesses, then all we need to do is look around, nationally and internationally. I have no idea whether you are rich or poor, an Oxbridge Ph.d, or former 'secondary modern', and neither mean anything to me in judging another's person's worth. Good luck with everything, and thank you again for your input. I will keep you posted.
g.satchwell
Member
BOOK LAUNCH for 'GREAT TRAIN ROBBERY CONFIDENTIAL' will take place between 6-8pm on Wednesday 9th Oct near Waterloo. Places are limited, so will those who would like to attend and obtain a signed copy, or have their copy signed, please contact me for more information at [email protected]
There have been many useful contributions from this thread and I am thankful for your help.
There have been many useful contributions from this thread and I am thankful for your help.
Busaholic
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Re Ian Allan. I'm sad that the name will disappear, having bought (or been bought) their bus fleetbooks from the early 1950s, in particular the London Transport one, which were stocked in a local newsagent as I remember, then Buses Illustrated magazine in 1958, from which date I've basically been buying it every month. My entry into bookselling as a full-time occupation in 1986 saw me buying copious amounts of Ian Allan books over the years to stock my small bookshop, mostly bus and rail titles, and I had a good relationship with the sales rep who, in this particular case, had a much higher role in the organisation. I tended to steer clear of the Masonic titles, being fundamentally sceptical to say the least about it, but was always aware that they were part of the 'mix' which was confirmed in an obituary I read of Ian Allan himself a few years ago, which revealed his involvement in the 'movement.' The magazine titles were sold off years ago, Pen and Sword Books took over some of the forthcoming bus titles, with mixed results, although I understand didn't buy any from Ian Allan. Crecy were involved too years ago, before I ceased involvement (almost!) in bookselling a couple of years ago. I never went into an Ian Allan bookshop (coals to Newcastle?) but now regret not going into the Waterloo one, from which on principle I would almost certainly have bought a title, at full price too, otherwise I'd loathe myself for ever more!
Bevan Price
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Last time I was in the Ian Allan Birmingham shop, another customer said that one of the shop staff had told him that the new owners were not interested in retail shops. All very sad, for staff and customers.
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