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Northern Pacer Withdrawals - Info?

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ed1971

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Actually my understanding was that the Hope Valley stoppers were generally worked by heritage units (104s, 108s and latterly 101s after 1992) up until the Summer 2000 time table change, the 101s were the prefered class for the route. After this point there was a reduction in 101 units and they were focused on the Marple/Rose Hill workings (which they already ran anyhow), leaving 142s, 150s and 156s working the New Mills Central and Sheffield diagrams - back in the days of First North Western, I can't speak for after 2004 though.

By the early 1990s the only first generation DMUs working in the North West were 101s and 108s. The final 108s were withdrawn in 1993, following the collision at Hyde North Junction on 22 August 1990, which raised concerns about their structural integrity. http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docsummary.php?docID=867

It had been intended to retain and refurbish the 108s, but following this incident the 101s were retained instead.
 
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ed1971

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Well my picture is certainly a Pacer and it was in 1985. Maybe we were all there to see a new train on some sort of trial run. I can't recall using one, but on the other hand with the infrequent service I'd not have wanted to. In those days if going north I could park free at the back of Sheffield station (where Supertram now goes) and in 1987 would take a first generation DMU to Leeds.

There it goes, as now the Hope Valley train is delaying the mainline service. The boys' eyes are following it which may suggest it was something special at the time. View attachment 67367

If you are absolutely certain that the photo was taken in 1985 and not 1987 or later, then it is looking like this was a indeed a test run. The Cornish Skippers came up north around 1987. Newton Heath and Neville had them at first, but I think that most had settled at Heaton by 1990, leaving 142023 and 142027 at Newton Heath. 142023 was the first 142 painted in Regional railways livery in 1991.
I stand to be corrected, but I seem to recall reading in Motive Power Monthly in late 1990, that 142020 was the final 142 in a livery other than GMPTE orange, to lose it's SCG gearboxes. I believe that it was converted to Voith at the same time as 142001-005. (142010 had been done in September and 142006-009/11-14 were completed by late March 1991).

At this time, Heaton 142s did not operate in the North West and I don't think that they operated around Leeds either. At the time Neville Hill had an allocation of around 27 142s and these regularly appeared on North West services however.
 
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Killingworth

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If you are absolutely certain that the photo was taken in 1985 and not 1987 or later, then it is looking like this was a indeed a test run. The Cornish Skippers came up north around 1987. Newton Heath and Neville had them at first, but I think that most had settled at Heaton by 1990, leaving 142027 at Newton Heath.
I stand to be corrected, but I seem to recall reading in Motive Power Monthly in late 1990, that 142020 was the final 142 in a different livery to the GMPTE orange units, to lose it's SCG gearboxes. I believe that it was converted to Voith at the same time as 142001-005. (142010 had been done in September and 142006-009/11-14 were completed by late March 1991).

At this time, Heaton 142s did not operate in the North West and I don't think that they operated around Leeds either. At the time Neville Hill had an allocation of around 27 142s and these regularly appeared on North west services however.

I have thousands of old negatives and finding these two may require a lot of searching. Currently away from home so will add that to the list of things to do when I get back.

The station had the island platform removed in early 1985 and the surface of the single remaining platform was relaid in the late spring of that year. I think I took the picture to show the platform which looks very new. I may have hit lucky with a Pacer on some sort of test run. The boys seem to be interested in the Pacer.
 

ed1971

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I have thousands of old negatives and finding these two may require a lot of searching. Currently away from home so will add that to the list of things to do when I get back.

The station had the island platform removed in early 1985 and the surface of the single remaining platform was relaid in the late spring of that year. I think I took the picture to show the platform which looks very new. I may have hit lucky with a Pacer on some sort of test run. The boys seem to be interested in the Pacer.

Maybe the Pacer was on a crew training run? I always liked the Cornish Skipper chocolate and cream livery. A variation of It survives in preservation on Class 141 bubble car RB004:
 

Jamesrob637

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How are they being withdrawn? Weekly in small batches or monthly in larger batches?
 

GoneSouth

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I just can’t see how Northern can manage without Pacers, they were all over the place when I went from Man Vic - Hudds - Leeds a few days ago.

Remove them = no services
Keep them = political s*** storm from all sides, disability rights campaigners in particular (completely justified in my view given the time they have had to get rid of them)

Lose or lose for Northern. That said, they should have shifted themselves to get new stock in service fasted (and more of it).
 

61653 HTAFC

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Today the Huddersfield to Sheffield line which is usually solid class 144 territory has 2 of the 3 diagrams being operated by 150s. 206 on the pre-2pm arrival into Huddersfield and a FirstGroup purple /1 on the 1315 departure passed at Shepley.

So there are changes in the air, even if the network is still infested with zombie Pacers!
 

Llandudno

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Is there any reason why the retired Pacers can’t be transferred to TfW as a temporary measure to assist with their chronic shortage of DMU’s until the refurbished trains arrive?
 

Ryry

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The Goverment/DFT have decided that Pacers have to stay in service now until they are 75 years old.
Please say this is a joke, they struggle at the best of times with capacity and often sound and feel like they will break into pieces
 

Bertie the bus

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Is there any reason why the retired Pacers can’t be transferred to TfW as a temporary measure to assist with their chronic shortage of DMU’s until the refurbished trains arrive?
There aren't any are there? 142005 was the only official withdrawal and that is reportedly back in service. I thought the others are standby units. Besides, if Northern don't get the 195 door issue resolved and ASLEF black them Northern will need all the units they can get their hands on.
 

61653 HTAFC

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Is there any reason why the retired Pacers can’t be transferred to TfW as a temporary measure to assist with their chronic shortage of DMU’s until the refurbished trains arrive?

There aren't any are there? 142005 was the only official withdrawal and that is reportedly back in service. I thought the others are standby units. Besides, if Northern don't get the 195 door issue resolved and ASLEF black them Northern will need all the units they can get their hands on.

Once units are actually handed back to the ROSCO, the only thing stopping them being leased to any other operator is cost. With TfW crew traction knowledge shouldn't be an issue, just the leasing costs and which organisation or authority foots that bill.
 

Killingworth

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Today the Huddersfield to Sheffield line which is usually solid class 144 territory has 2 of the 3 diagrams being operated by 150s. 206 on the pre-2pm arrival into Huddersfield and a FirstGroup purple /1 on the 1315 departure passed at Shepley.

So there are changes in the air, even if the network is still infested with zombie Pacers!

Meanwhile the Hope Valley line that was seeing very few Pacers now seems to have got them back!
 

davart

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Please say this is a joke, they struggle at the best of times with capacity and often sound and feel like they will break into pieces

I suspect it's pun based on the proposed raising of the state pension age ;)

That said, there is talk of Pacers continuing to work as 'volunteers' as they'll probably find retirement boring...
 

ainsworth74

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Sounds like Boris (fake) news.

It's your choice whether you believe it or not but that doesn't change that the source of the information is impeccable in my estimation and short of someone providing some evidence of 142005 being back in service I'm going to take their word for it.
 

M60lad

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I can officialy state that 142005 isn't back in service (No I don't work for Northern) as I pass Newton Heath Depot on way home from work Mon-Fri and the past couple of weeks its been stabled in the same place still with retirement vinyls on near the line to/from Rochdale
 

J-2739

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Today the Huddersfield to Sheffield line which is usually solid class 144 territory has 2 of the 3 diagrams being operated by 150s. 206 on the pre-2pm arrival into Huddersfield and a FirstGroup purple /1 on the 1315 departure passed at Shepley.

So there are changes in the air, even if the network is still infested with zombie Pacers!
Sadly, we can't quite celebrate. Isn't South Yorkshire meant to be the last area to retain Pacers?
 
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