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The Menace Of Class 150 Rail Travel

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krus_aragon

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Some on here are saying another 10 years+ at least for the 150s. I honestly think their days will be numbered soon. I think Northern have called it correctly, once the Pacers are gone, the 150s are going to stick out like a sore thumb in comparison to the 158s, 170s and 195s and the questions are going to start being asked when are they next.

Assuming Northern's passenger numbers pick up on the introduction of new trains and a reduction in the subsidy as a result (just like TPE's when they got new rolling stock in mid-2000s) I expect the 150s to be replaced by cascaded or new stock as part of the a new franchise agreement in 2025. Potentially TPE to complete inter-city overhaul with new units and the Class 185 fleet to be cascaded to Northern.

I'd agree with that sort of timescale. For context, TfW's 36 150s are intended to be withdrawn by the end of 2023.
 
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Bevan Price

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I'd agree with that sort of timescale. For context, TfW's 36 150s are intended to be withdrawn by the end of 2023.
And I suspect that many will find their way to Northern....., maybe with some used to form 3 coach 150s.
 

ed1971

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I think people tend to enthuse over the trains which are around when they grow up, and as population ages and more of those have childhood memories they may wish to re-live with 150s.

That is not always the case. The 150s and Leyland Atlantean buses were both around when I was growing up and I hated both of them.
 

Mikey C

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That is not always the case. The 150s and Leyland Atlantean buses were both around when I was growing up and I hated both of them.

Similarly I've got no nostalgia for the EPBs (Class 415, 416) or Underground stock like the 59/62/67 and the C stock
 

ed1971

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Similarly I've got no nostalgia for the EPBs (Class 415, 416) or Underground stock like the 59/62/67 and the C stock

I always had a soft spot for the Class 108s. Having been refurbished with fluorescent lighting, they looked pretty modern. I regret never being able to sample a ride on a Class 123 or 124. The Former had B4 and B5 bogies and apparently gave a far better quality of ride than the rest of the first generation DMUs.
 

Bletchleyite

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Why don't Pacers or Sprinters have forward views? Few modern trains seem to. The ICE 3 in Germany being one of the few.

Partly because drivers prefer not to be watched the whole time or annoyed by passengers banging on the glass, partly for crashworthiness reasons, and partly because passengers won't see someone being hit by the train in the sad event of that taking place.
 

trebor79

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That is not always the case. The 150s and Leyland Atlantean buses were both around when I was growing up and I hated both of them.
I have always hated 150s but always liked Atlantean buses. Only time I didn't like them was the ropey ones used for the school bus, which were prone to leaking exhaust fumes into the lower saloon.
 

krus_aragon

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Partly because drivers prefer not to be watched the whole time or annoyed by passengers banging on the glass, partly for crashworthiness reasons, and partly because passengers won't see someone being hit by the train in the sad event of that taking place.
And (in the case of the 150/2) because there's a gangway in the middle of the front window, so there's less of a view anyway.
 

Mogster

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The seat cloth that’s appearing on Northern’s refurbished 150s is completely not fit for purpose...

The seats already look filthy after just a few months, the old stuff never looked this bad, tatty maybe but never so horribly dirty. It’s a complete disaster.
 

js1000

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The seat cloth that’s appearing on Northern’s refurbished 150s is completely not fit for purpose...

The seats already look filthy after just a few months, the old stuff never looked this bad, tatty maybe but never so horribly dirty. It’s a complete disaster.
Northern have abandoned the cloth in favour of a moquette for new refurbs. The cloth looks nice for a few weeks until it inevitably accumulates dirt.
 

F Great Eastern

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Been on a couple of 150s in Wales in past few days. First time for a fair few years.

Horrible things. Terribly cramped seating sweatboxes which are too loud. It made the trio of scuds I was on as well feel like luxury in comparison.
 

danielnez1

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One of the biggest issues is the noisy engines. Later classes using the same engine types have better sound insulation. I went on a Perkins engined 158 this week. Whilst interior engine noise levels are low on any 158, the Perkins was still noticeably quieter. 150s could do with more modern quieter engines, but it probably is not worth spending so much on them as they are approaching 33-35 years of age.

One thing in particular I like abort the Perkins fitted 158s is that they don't have that whining sound that you hear with the Cunnins fitted 158s.
 

dubscottie

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Partly because drivers prefer not to be watched the whole time or annoyed by passengers banging on the glass, partly for crashworthiness reasons, and partly because passengers won't see someone being hit by the train in the sad event of that taking place.

I believe it was mainly to do with night running (the light from the interior would reflect off the windscreen if the blinds were broken) and it provided a private area for the guards as there was no brake compartment.
 

delticdave

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I believe it was mainly to do with night running (the light from the interior would reflect off the windscreen if the blinds were broken) and it provided a private area for the guards as there was no brake compartment.
AFAIK, all the modernisation plan DMU's had a Guards Brake & Luggage compartment, including the bubble-cars.
 

Terry Tait

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I find it very strange that 150s are not as nice as 317s despite having pretty much the same body shell and speaking as a southerner I think it's deeply unfair that people in the North have to put up with so many inadequacies of awfully thought out designs for rolling stock as opposed to the comfortable long trains that exist in most parts of the South.
 

Bletchleyite

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And the arrangement of seats (i.e. 3+2 airline).

If they'd just take a row out I wouldn't mind that arrangement. It's too cramped, but I'd prefer a seat back than a game of kneesie.

Of course 150/1s other than some in the West Midlands have all-facing seating anyway, which is the same as most Mk3 EMUs except some ex-Thameslink units.
 

yorksrob

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If they'd just take a row out I wouldn't mind that arrangement. It's too cramped, but I'd prefer a seat back than a game of kneesie.

Of course 150/1s other than some in the West Midlands have all-facing seating anyway, which is the same as most Mk3 EMUs except some ex-Thameslink units.

I must admit, I'd have to have a lot of leg room to be comfortable, third furthest from the aisle. Enough to walk past the other two occupants without them getting up.

I know I sit in airline hemmed in by another stranger, but two just seems too many.
 

Bletchleyite

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I must admit, I'd have to have a lot of leg room to be comfortable, third furthest from the aisle. Enough to walk past the other two occupants without them getting up.

I know I sit in airline hemmed in by another stranger, but two just seems too many.

Fair point. I suppose the place I used to mostly encounter 150/2s with that layout on most services (the Marston Vale) typically has loadings such that if you don't get a row to yourself you'll get a whole coach.
 

ic31420

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Mk3 EMUs and DMUs are basically the same. The key differences are the diesel racket, fug of fumes and vibration and being long enough.

Is it fumes as in burned diesel or more a vapour of hot diesel fuel, various oils and coolant? I'd always thought the latter.

Exhaust leaks can and should be remedied quickly.
 

yorksrob

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Fair point. I suppose the place I used to mostly encounter 150/2s with that layout on most services (the Marston Vale) typically has loadings such that if you don't get a row to yourself you'll get a whole coach.

This is a fair point.

The 333's have a good compromise in that the 3 seats are facing, whilst the 2 seats are airline, for those who don't want to play footsy with a stranger.

It is a really good layout and should be more prevalent than it is.
 

Bletchleyite

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This is a fair point.

The 333's have a good compromise in that the 3 seats are facing, whilst the 2 seats are airline, for those who don't want to play footsy with a stranger.

It is a really good layout and should be more prevalent than it is.

It's not a particularly unusual layout - Classes 350/2, 360, 450 and 323 all have it. 350/2s have particularly good legroom in the facing bays.
 

yorksrob

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Another 150 and another bog out of use.

Bring back the dropper loos. The vacuum ones aren't fit for purpose.
 

talltim

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There is some wibble bordering on hyperbole posted on this thread! The class 150's are good, solid, simple trains. Most of the issues could be fixed with a decent internal refurb.
The point is, they haven’t had one
 

yorksrob

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Its taken a while to get here, but I curse 150's. I truly hate them.

I've only myself to blame because I denigrated the pacers, but in those days the 150's didn't have the dreaded vacuum toilet that locks itself out of use at the drop of a hat.
 
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