Wrongly Assumed Facts by Passengers

Bletchleyite · 29 Jan 2018

swaldman said:
Yes indeed, but as a passenger I don't really care about that - it comes under the category of "not my problem" - and I'd like to be refunded down to the cost of a bus fare (or a reasonable estimate thereof).

Admittedly in many scenarios, at least in England, Delay Repay takes care of it

If the bus fare is higher, and it sometimes is particularly in "PTE" areas where rail fares are subsidised and bus fares are not, are you happy to pay the extra?

RailUK Forums

Bletchleyite · 29 Jan 2018

Bromley boy said:
I suppose the practice of expecting five total strangers to share a small cab seems a little dubious these days, especially if these include youngsters/vulnerable travellers.

I’m not sure if special arrangements are in place for this eventuality.

I doubt they are; the railway does not offer an accompaniment service like some airlines do, only a physical assistance one to those unable to physically use a train (or replacement bus or taxi as provided at the TOC's discretion) without it. Anyone unable to or unhappy to travel by the services offered on their own (because they wouldn't feel safe or wouldn't understand it) needs to travel with someone else.

FWIW, I suspect if this point was pushed too hard, e.g. in Court, we would end up with a minimum age for solo travel, probably of 16, which would cause all sorts of issues as many young people take the train to school alone.

Bletchleyite · 29 Jan 2018

jcollins said:
I used to think that when telesales and internet sales used to issue you with a huge airline style ticket which contained everything, opposed to a separate seat reservation coupon.

At least the new format puts it on the ticket when it is compulsory and on a separate one when it is not.

WelshBluebird · 29 Jan 2018

Dentonian said:
Surely, the number one wrongly assumed fact by passengers, tax-payers and the Media alike remains the 31 year old favourite:

Buses are run by the Council(s)

Those in some places (e.g. cardiff, Newport etc) would not be wrong in that statement!

pompeyfan said:
Keeping it on the bus theme;

Passenger are perfectly entitled to take a different (more expensive) route than what is stated on their ticket if there’s bus replacement on there original route.

Surely it should be common sense? If you have a 2 hour journey, but a rail replacement bus increases that to 4 hours, but you could do it by rail in 2 and a half hours, surely it would sensible to allow the other route? (of course, I realise the railways, and any other industry, sadly does not work on rules based on "what would be sensible"!).

stut · 29 Jan 2018

WelshBluebird said:
Surely it should be common sense? If you have a 2 hour journey, but a rail replacement bus increases that to 4 hours, but you could do it by rail in 2 and a half hours, surely it would sensible to allow the other route? (of course, I realise the railways, and any other industry, sadly does not work on rules based on "what would be sensible"!).

Depends on the infrastructure, surely?

If the 2.5h route involves a single-track branch line with stations that support 2-carriage trains, you might come rather unstuck sending an entire mainline's worth of passengers down there.

swaldman · 29 Jan 2018

Bletchleyite said:
If the bus fare is higher, and it sometimes is particularly in "PTE" areas where rail fares are subsidised and bus fares are not, are you happy to pay the extra?

No. Just like, were I to be put in a taxi, I would not expect to pay a taxi fare.

By analogy: Imagine you've booked an en-suite room in a hotel, and when you arrive there are none available. Maybe they overbooked, or maybe the previous occupant trashed the room. The hotel might upgrade you to a suite, but they could not reasonably charge you the price of the suite. If nothing else was available they might offer you an inferior room - say a non-en-suite one, or one without a window - but you'd expect to get some compensation for this, most likely a partial refund.

It's bad enough that the railways already get a pass for unexpectedly not providing a seat on a long journey[1]; they shouldn't get away with charging full price despite not providing a train at all!

[1] I understand there are all sorts of practical difficulties in doing otherwise with seats - let's not get into that here.

maire23 · 29 Jan 2018

Gareth Marston said:
That another person can get discount when traveling with you if you have a railcard.

If it’s a disabled persons one then yes they can!

Chris M · 29 Jan 2018

Gareth Marston said:
That another person can get discount when traveling with you if you have a railcard.

From the Network Railcard website:

With your Network Railcard you can take up to three adults with you and they also get up to 1/3 off their rail fare. Plus, you can take up to four children (aged 5 to 15) and save 60% on the child fare.

choochoochoo · 30 Jan 2018

That they aren't responsible for the delay leaving a station because they all decide to board the same carriage on a 12 car through one set of doors because it means they're closer to the stairs/exit at their destination station.

Makes me laugh when that time it takes them to board and delay the departure is longer than the time it takes to walk the length of a platform at their destination.

boxy321 · 30 Jan 2018

That it's important to stand by the doors half way to one's destination. eg: Olton for Solihull, Bordesley for Moor St, Stechford for New St, Tile Hill for Coventry.

Hilarious when we're stopped at a red light for several minutes and I'm still sat reading the paper, and in the case of Virgin, they're stood in the way of the staff cleaning up for the next leg.

stut · 30 Jan 2018

That the fastest way to disgorge a busy inter-city train at its terminus is for those with the largest and bulkiest luggage to block the doors to unload this before all the people without luggage have a chance to get off.

That they don't actually really allocate shared sleeper berths, but that, if they do, getting to the compartment marginally earlier gives you some kind of proprietorial superiority over the person who arrives later.

That holding a season ticket gives you more right to a seat than someone holding a day ticket (ah, the Surrey commuter belt).

That all rural stations have active taxi ranks.

E_Reeves · 31 Jan 2018

That just because the train's stopped, mashing the door open button will magically open it

Puffing Devil · 31 Jan 2018

E_Reeves said:
That just because the train's stopped, mashing the door open button will magically open it

Very tempting though.... has the light boken? Panicking to get off!

185143 · 31 Jan 2018

That DOO is bad and we need guards on trains-until the day that nasty, evil union announces a strike-and then they should sack the guards and run all the trains DOO so they can travel...

DOO is safe.

That the driver makes the announcements (on guarded trains that is).

That they don't need to buy a ticket as they can get out in THAT lift at Lime Street... straight into an RPI block!

TOCs cancel/delay trains for a laugh.

al78 · 31 Jan 2018

185143 said:
That they don't need to buy a ticket as they can get out in THAT lift at Lime Street... straight into an RPI block!

This is true at Redhill. You don't need to buy a ticket if you are travelling from Gomshall (or any other unmanned station). You can just leave through the unmanned rear exit on Platform 3.

This will work travelling from Redhill to Horsham after a certain time at night. Just enter via platform 3 (conveniently where the Horsham bound trains stop), get off at Horsham and walk through the open barrier since the staff have gone home for the night.

Bromley boy · 31 Jan 2018

swaldman said:
It's bad enough that the railways already get a pass for unexpectedly not providing a seat on a long journey[1]; they shouldn't get away with charging full price despite not providing a train at all!

I’m not sure that’s quite right.

Your ticket doesn’t entitle you to a seat (unless it includes a seat reservation).
Therefore not having a seat shouldn’t ever really be unexpected, particularly if you travel at busy times.

Priority seats are provided so that those who need a seat because they are unable to stand for some reason should (in theory at least!) always be able to get one.

AlterEgo · 31 Jan 2018

Chris M said:
If you want to fly from Liverpool to London you can do so via Amersterdam - although why you would want to do that I'm not sure.

Air miles.

al78 · 31 Jan 2018

Bromley boy said:
Priority seats are provided so that those who need a seat because they are unable to stand for some reason should (in theory at least!) always be able to get one.

Which only works properly if it is enforced. If the guard for some reason doesn't want to challenge someone, or is afraid of starting a scene, or the person in the seat pulls the "I've got a disability (invisible) and I need the seat" line which cannot be proved or disproved, it undermines the whole concept of having priority seats.

Bromley boy · 31 Jan 2018

al78 said:
Which only works properly if it is enforced. If the guard for some reason doesn't want to challenge someone, or is afraid of starting a scene, or the person in the seat pulls the "I've got a disability (invisible) and I need the seat" line which cannot be proved or disproved, it undermines the whole concept of having priority seats.

Agreed. They do need to be enforced.

The problem of course is how to do this. In the end the system relies on people doing the decent thing.

In fact there was a recent thread on this.

MP33 · 14 Feb 2018

MP33 said:
I have a claim outstanding with Greater Anglia that my train arrived short formed and with the carriage containing 1st class locked out for some reason. I requested that the difference is refunded as the advertised facilities were not provided and it would be impossible to get to the other set of carriages in time and then push through 4 coaches of standing passengers. Also their website did not advise any problem and if that had been the case I would have got an earlier service. As mentioned earlier I am sure that these grounds are not generally known.

I believe that there also used to be rare instances when a class 321 was replaced by a 315.

As for wrongly assumed facts I am sure that some passengers believe that holding a 1st class ticket means that you cannot sit in standard if for instance you meet someone you know.

I have now received confirmation from Greater Anglia that my claim was successful and I will be refunded the difference betweeen the two classes.

londonbridge · 23 Aug 2019

whhistle said:
I don't understand why some passengers think a platform will be printed on the ticket. My airline ticket doesn't always have the gate printed on it. That's the only connection I can think.

Similarly, my National Express coach ticket doesn't have the gate on it.

Esker-pades · 23 Aug 2019

E_Reeves said:
That just because the train's stopped, mashing the door open button will magically open it

Or, as I see frequently with ScotRail HSTs, that yanking the door handle harder and harder will make the door open. Wait for the big, yellow light to come on before you start trying to open the door.

Bletchleyite · 23 Aug 2019

FelixtheCat said:
Or, as I see frequently with ScotRail HSTs, that yanking the door handle harder and harder will make the door open. Wait for the big, yellow light to come on before you start trying to open the door.

We clearly need the "It's fruitless if it's not orange" posters back!

https://picclick.co.uk/Intercity-We...uitless-If-Its-362705573116.html#&gid=1&pid=1 contains a leaflet on the matter.

Esker-pades · 23 Aug 2019

Bletchleyite said:
We clearly need the "It's fruitless if it's not orange" posters back!

https://picclick.co.uk/Intercity-We...uitless-If-Its-362705573116.html#&gid=1&pid=1 contains a leaflet on the matter.

Not one I've seen before, but a good one.

Terry Tait · 24 Aug 2019

Passengers between Ashford and Tonbridge thinking that rail replacement buses are free.

Peter C · 24 Aug 2019

That the phrases "station" and "platform" are interchangeable.
I heard someone at Kingham the other week say "I hope we are arriving at Paddington station 1 because that one doesn't have ticket barriers", after he got onto the platform at Kingham (which doesn't have barriers) without a ticket due to the ticket office being closed. The Kingham ticket office is always open when you don't need it, but is closed when you need it!

-Peter

plymothian · 24 Aug 2019

stut said:
That holding a season ticket gives you more right to a seat than someone holding a day ticket (ah, the Surrey commuter belt).

"But I've paid £x thousand pounds a year to use the train and it's a disgrace." Yeah pal, but divide your season ticket by 363 and you've paid a lot less than anyone whose bought a regular ticket on this train.

BigCj34 · 24 Aug 2019

Terry Tait said:
Passengers between Ashford and Tonbridge thinking that rail replacement buses are free.

Never seen ticket checks when they ran between Newbury Park and Ingatestone. Could have quite easily used Oyster to Newbury Park and bought a ticket from Ingatestone to travel further East if I was feeling mischievous. (I didn't, before anyone things about calling the cops!)

tonysk14 · 24 Aug 2019

Clip said:
Your boarding pass will though.

Not nessaccarily, I have had boarding passes with no boarding gate printed on it and "check the information screens".

plugwash · 24 Aug 2019

185143 said:
That DOO is bad and we need guards on trains-until the day that nasty, evil union announces a strike-and then they should sack the guards and run all the trains DOO so they can travel...

DOO is safe.

Safe is not a binary thing.

If you cancel trains then you force people out on to the roads. How do the risks of emergency DOO compare to the risks of road travel?

Wrongly Assumed Facts by Passengers

Veteran Member

RailUK Forums

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Member

Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Member

Member

Member

Established Member