Actually a 'discounted fare has a specific definition; it means that a discount has been applied to the 'public' fare.It's twice the full single fare, the £8 you quote on the train line (or indeed any other ticket site, booking office or ticket machine) is an off peak ticket, which counts as a discounted rather than full fare.
It would help if Government was robust and prepared enough to insist that child rate applies to anyone under the age of voting for any goods and services in the country - but they don't do this, hence the confusion.
ok just to reply to few comments
Yes of course she knows she left Torre around 9, the connecting train was either cancelled or delayed so she was between 30 minutes or an hour at newtonnabbot and guard helped her navigate the best train. Yes the UFN has an administrative fee plus highest adult single fare so coming out at just under£40 , an on the spot penalty would have been £20 which I could have paid by phone straight away. Yes children do mature at different ages which is exactly my point re vulnerability and if every 16 year old was as wise as you guys seem to think you were then we wouldn’t be launching information on county lines. I shall log off for good now and thank those who gave helpful information and agree there are some rather sanctimonious people I hope my daughter never has the misfortune to sit next to on a train
There may be benefits to that, but that it's 16 on public transport is VERY well known. Most 16/17 year olds buying child tickets are knowingly trying it on.
A penalty fare would not be allowed to be issued.
In this case OP states that ticket was bought on line ahead of journey, by child, who selected (presumably) child rate fare. But that is not your key point I realise.Can you explain this further?
Generally my understanding is that Penalty Fares are for "genuine mistakes". Whether asking for a child fare when you are not eligible for a child fare is a genuine mistake is moot.
So issuing a PF might not be appropriate but could be allowed?
I also wonder why there's the constant mentioning of county lines? I've seen the Home Office guidance on this, and I am pretty sure that a conversation with train staff has absolutely nothing to do with it - unless she was being coerced into travelling by someone else, and wanted rail staff to call you or the police to get her help. THAT would be considered a safeguarding issue, and I'd hope rail staff would do everything in their power to assist in such circumstances.
Very unlikely.Anyway, my question is - would it ever be the case that if stopped for having the wrong ticket a TOC member of staff would secure the payment on the spot by phoning someone else who can pay on behalf of the individual stopped then and there, ie if that person did not have any cash or payment cards with them?
Torre is not a Penalty Fare station.Can you explain this further?
Generally my understanding is that Penalty Fares are for "genuine mistakes". Whether asking for a child fare when you are not eligible for a child fare is a genuine mistake is moot.
So issuing a PF might not be appropriate but could be allowed?
Torre is not a Penalty Fare station.
Yes it is, has been since 1st April 2019.Torre is not a Penalty Fare station.
I was reading through this thread and noticed a number of comments saying they should have known you have to pay the full fare at 16 - did they? Whilst this is quite correct when you check out the T&C's, can I give my own alternative experience from being this age many years ago (pre-internet days)
It was popular held belief that whilst you were still at school you only paid child fares. (i.e. not having gone beyond 5th form) This was pretty universal and unquestioned across my peer group. Probably all of the people in my 5th form having reached 16, still purchased child tickets blissfully unaware. Nobody I know was ever challenged on it by drivers/inspectors when in school uniform.
No teacher or parent(s) had ever mentioned it, the fact was, nobody really knew that you were supposed to.
This mindset was perhaps reinforced by the fact that many, myself included, had a free bus/train pass which ran to the end of the school year, months beyond our 16th birthdays.
I suspect a similar situation will exist today with many parents/pupils believing as we did, that you only start paying adult fares after you have left school, irrespective of whether you had reached 16 during that period.
Of seem note. I just looked at Trainline website - if you select child it does not ask age but you have to select / it clearly states 5-15 option (presumably so people know under 5 is free)On the train line app when selecting "child" you have to put the age of the relevant children in.
Full single fare quoted at 12.70 plus irregularities settlement at £25 to be more precise. The £20 or twice single fare ( shows as £8 on trainline) is the lower fixed penalty fine which was not “offered” I guess they look to retrieve the highest amount possible
Just gone into train line app and if you tap on the "child" option it asks you to select childs age, see pic. (First time I've uploaded a pic)Of seem note. I just looked at Trainline website - if you select child it does not ask age but you have to select / it clearly states 5-15 option (presumably so people know under 5 is free)
OP did not state if her child selected 5-15 in error (thus suggesting they did not know how old they were), or if they selected it thinking they would 'get away with it'. OP does imply that it was child's first solo trip.
I think it is worth bearing in mind that kids can be very impressionable mostly from their peer group! (ie other kids saying, "don't worry just buy the child ticket it's cheaper, no one will ever know / they never check etc etc") Whereas I'm prepared to think that when challenged the child came clean / was worried enough to come clean etc (so belatedly did the right thing), and indeed the staff member 'did the right thing' by serving the UFN, not issue one of the tougher sanctions that could have been issued - but that's my opinion and the OP may feel differently!
I remain mindful that the nub of OP's query was about the way child was dealt with when 'caught', and general policy on child fare age - not so much about whether child acted dishonestly on purchase etc, which we don't know.
Now that IS good advice!Pay it and ensure you claim delay repay for your daughters delay after the train cancellation. You should get most of the ticket cost back
The OP seems to have disappeared (probably to mumsnet where she’ll get the sympathy she was looking for).
Think nothing has been said recently that requires a reply from them.They were logged in around 2200 last night so are presumably still reading.
Think nothing has been said recently that requires a reply from them.