Upgrading an off-peak ticket to peak?

Howardh · 2 Sep 2019

When I return to Manchester Airport I should be well within off-peak hours and to avoid queuing or a mobile phone's flat battery I have bough an off-peak ticket in advance dated for my arrival.

If, however, my flight is delayed and I land at a time meaning when I get the train (MIA - Bolton) I am in peak hours, what must I do to upgrade the ticket to be valid?

I assume I must queue at the counter, submit my single and exchange for a peak single and add the 40p (or whatever); but are there any other alternatives for me??

Thanks!

RailUK Forums

Merseysider · 2 Sep 2019

If the ticket barriers are open (unlikely from past experience) then the guard onboard can sell you the excess.

I'd sit at the rear and/or notify the guard in advance to ensure you don't have to queue at Piccadilly.

Otherwise, if the barriers are in operation, you'll need to stand in line (for anywhere between 5-15 minutes) at the Airport ticket office to pay the difference.

Joe Paxton · 2 Sep 2019

This is the kind of scenario where if I was uncertain of my ticketing requirements, I wouldn't purchase ahead of time (at least not until I was sure - e.g. waiting at the baggage carousel, via a mobile phone app).

Hadders · 2 Sep 2019

Given that the difference between an Off Peak Day Single and an Anytime Day Single between Manchester Airport and Bolton is only 30p I’d buy the Anytime ticket for the sake of certainty and a hassle free journey.

Starmill · 2 Sep 2019

If there's a long queue for the ticket office when you arrive, and you have missed the last train for several hours on which your existing ticket is valid, you could try speaking to the staff on the ticket gates. They may be able to sell you the excess. If the ticket gates are open, you could go downstairs and locate the guard to ask for permission to board with that ticket. I would say it is quite likely to be granted.

AMD · 3 Sep 2019

Mobile tickets cannot be excessed on train, only at a booking office.

Wallsendmag · 3 Sep 2019

AMD said:
Mobile tickets cannot be excessed on train, only at a booking office.

Depends what type of ticket it is. Flexible cannot be changed at Travel Centres

AMD · 3 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
Depends what type of ticket it is. Flexible cannot be changed at Travel Centres

Mobile tickets cannot be accessed on STARmobile (which Arriva traincrew use). I know - It's the system I use.

yorkie · 3 Sep 2019

Presumably you have to let people travel on the original ticket and advise them to obtain the excess at the destination station (or next train if there is one, or interchange station if there is one and there is time).

scrapy · 4 Sep 2019

AMD said:
Mobile tickets cannot be accessed on STARmobile (which Arriva traincrew use). I know - It's the system I use.

Surely you can just do the excess as though a paper ticket was held? The passenger would then have a mobile ticket plus paper excess.

robbeech · 4 Sep 2019

scrapy said:
Surely you can just do the excess as though a paper ticket was held? The passenger would then have a mobile ticket plus paper excess.

You can. I’ve done an excess at a ticket office from an M ticket. And I’ve done an excess on board with an e-ticket. You just show them your ticket with its restriction and say can i excess this to whatever it is. It’s just the same as having a bit of orange card in your hand.
Of course, there will be many places that refuse or say they cannot do the excess, but that’s also just the same as having a bit of orange card in your hand.
The key here is having a member of staff who is both willing to do the excess and has the ability and knowledge and training to do the excess, it’s no different to a paper ticket.

Wallsendmag · 4 Sep 2019

robbeech said:
You can. I’ve done an excess at a ticket office from an M ticket. And I’ve done an excess on board with an e-ticket. You just show them your ticket with its restriction and say can i excess this to whatever it is. It’s just the same as having a bit of orange card in your hand.
Of course, there will be many places that refuse or say they cannot do the excess, but that’s also just the same as having a bit of orange card in your hand.
The key here is having a member of staff who is both willing to do the excess and has the ability and knowledge and training to do the excess, it’s no different to a paper ticket.

OK so how do they know that your mate isn't on the next train with another copy of the e-Ticket? Do they blacklist your e-Ticket in the e-TVD? You only get one orange card , you can print as many e-Tickets as you like.

Merseysider · 4 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
OK so how do they know that your mate isn't on the next train with another copy of the e-Ticket? Do they blacklist your e-Ticket in the e-TVD? You only get one orange card , you can print as many e-Tickets as you like.

Staple the excess to the phone of course.

robbeech · 6 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
OK so how do they know that your mate isn't on the next train with another copy of the e-Ticket? Do they blacklist your e-Ticket in the e-TVD? You only get one orange card , you can print as many e-Tickets as you like.

It is for the railway to deal with. Why should passengers be penalised for choosing the type of ticket format they want? The contract is the same be it orange card, orange paper, A4 printed at home or an electronic version. There are holes in the security of this as you’ve outlined but why should the passenger suffer just to increase profits for the railway?

Is the whole concept of electronic tickets (in multiple forms) one to increase revenue for the railway or is it to make things efficient for both the railway and the passenger?

kieron · 6 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
OK so how do they know that your mate isn't on the next train with another copy of the e-Ticket? Do they blacklist your e-Ticket in the e-TVD? You only get one orange card , you can print as many e-Tickets as you like.

I may be missing something, but if they don't "blacklist" tickets when they're read on-board a train, then couldn't your mate use another copy of your ticket anyway? Without that ability, would they use e-tickets for flexible tickets at all?

Paul Kelly · 6 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
Do they blacklist your e-Ticket in the e-TVD?

Presumably there is a way to log in the database that the ticket has been excessed, and when checked something will alert the inspector to also check the excess ticket? If not, that system hasn't been thought through very well...

Wallsendmag · 7 Sep 2019

kieron said:
I may be missing something, but if they don't "blacklist" tickets when they're read on-board a train, then couldn't your mate use another copy of your ticket anyway? Without that ability, would they use e-tickets for flexible tickets at all?

At least with ourselves the ticket has an entry in the e-TVD when scanned saying where and when.

Wallsendmag · 7 Sep 2019

Indigo2 said:
Presumably there is a way to log in the database that the ticket has been excessed, and when checked something will alert the inspector to also check the excess ticket? If not, that system hasn't been thought through very well...

No there isn't at present that in our Ticket Offices which is why it isn't done.

yorkie · 7 Sep 2019

Wallsendmag said:
No there isn't at present that in our Ticket Offices which is why it isn't done.

So if someone has a more restrictive ticket, such as a Super Off Peak for travel at a restricted time, or for a cheaper route such as via Chesterfield for travel via a more costly route such as Any Permitted, you don't excess the ticket, and just allow them to travel at the price they originally paid?

(I can't see any other alternative, as it would be unlawful to do anything other than allow them travel or charge them the excess, as stipulated in the NRCoT)

Howardh · 7 Sep 2019

Hadders said:
Given that the difference between an Off Peak Day Single and an Anytime Day Single between Manchester Airport and Bolton is only 30p I’d buy the Anytime ticket for the sake of certainty and a hassle free journey.

I have!

Upgrading an off-peak ticket to peak?

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