Mountain Man
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An incorrect comparison, plenty of people have had issues with slam doors for years, they cause major issues for a portion of society. As far as I am aware, no one can say the same for stored bikes
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Virgin Restricting Access to Cycle Area on Pendolinos
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bramling
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Presumably it was a case of making compromises in order to squeeze as much passenger space out of a 2-car unit (against a background of 2 new carriages for 3 old ones).
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Which was pretty much never, though I did more than once in the 90s get told "don't fall out, and if you see anyone getting too close to the door warn them" while the driver went for a chat on the SPT.
Mountain Man
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A set up that has existed for decades, long before Pendolinos
cjmillsnun
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indeed. Want a bike stored in a Mk3 or Mk4 set? In the DVT it goes. Want to be in the DVT to be with your bike? You’re out of luck.
Want a bike stored in an HST? That’ll go in the TGS or in the back of a power car. They aren’t public access either.
ashkeba
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They carry fewer bikes per journey on average than multiple units, don't they? I thought train design was intended to improve, not remain stuck repeating old mistakes - or in this case, be modified to add old mistakes back in!
Mountain Man
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If it is such a mistake, why are people only moaning about it now?
Because more people take bikes, more people travel by train, increase in social media, many more people will actively complain.
How do you know they are only moaning about it now? Just because you are only hearing the moaning now, doesn't mean there wasn't moaning in the past.
cjmillsnun
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Do they? They are long distance trains. I'm sure they take plenty of bikes on the ECML and GEML.
Ideally. We need BG style vehicles travelling on the WCML. The trouble is that empty cars earn no money in the world of privatisation, yet add to the cost of accessing the track. Would cyclists and excess baggage users pay the difference? A TOC paying a hefty premium will far sooner have seats in that empty space. What’s the difference with someone like EasyJet who want to maximise the £ per m2 occupied on a plane with as many seats as possible?
... yet another reason to abandon our current railway structure...
It's a network and it stands or falls as one. Management accounting might have its uses, but this sort of quibble or decision shouldn't be left to a route manager or TOC chief accountant. The bottom line of a localised franchise (or whatever) shouldn't over-ride a national policy: if you want people to buy long-distance tickets to start a cycling holiday at the other end of the country then you take the decision to offer them, and don't penalise the long-distance routes which carry the bulk of the bike-miles.
Equally, if you want to encourage active travel and get people out of their cars you help people to commute by bike and train, and some of them will need to take their bikes with them. National congestion and clean-air policies require rail use to be increased, and in my mind giving our [possible] future one railway a slightly more generous settlement to compensate them for the extra space needed on trains is a price worth paying.
Perhaps trains should have a BSO instead then...
Anyway, when trains were very busy I have been quite happy to sit on the floor of a brake van (quite a few times, in fact.)
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
How's the big van area at the end of a Pendolino under discussion here not "a BG style vehicle"?
ashkeba
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A typical 0.5m x 1.8m triangle isn't a big space and I think many people would gladly pay a reasonable amount if it improved that space. BR got this wrong when it abolished the charge.
Ecausr it’s not meant to store anything else other than a bike which can be tied up. Loose luggage is something that a driver can insist on being removed so isn’t meant to be there.
@AndrewE i fully agree with your stance, it’s just that I’m not sure if you’re thinking that I’m agreeing with the privatisation thinking. Just saying that’s the current way of thinking in TOC-land. I personally would go back to a one railway offering like you say. The railway needs to entice people on it. One of my mates was saying he was quoted £46 for his family to get to Blackpool from St Helens. That’s outrageous when it is about a tenner in fuel and similar for parking if just a day trip. Forget railcards and whatever, £25 as he said is more competitive for a turn up and go family ticket. That similar sort of thinking should apply with the bikes and such if we are not going to enforce excess luggage carrying. (Speaking as someone who once watched a bloke carry a 50” TV on his back on a train, various families carrying 5-6 32kg sized suitcases, and even someone try and get a bush of some kind on the train)
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I haven't made a note of, let alone remembered your position on privatisation. While I can (mostly) understand what the profit/shareholder return-focussed TOCs are doing and why, I just can't resist pointing out the stupidity of a lot of the outcomes, when our railway (single) needs to be responding to all sorts of national needs. These range from shifting more car-less people, cutting pollution in our city centres, enabling cities to function when road transport clearly cannot do the job... You get the idea. Shareholder return should not trump the national need. An article/editorial in today's Guardian https://www.theguardian.com/busines...twork-companies-raise-questions-profits-power makes almost the same point about the National Grid.
Bikes are a lot more bulky than the average large suitcase. They'll take up two seats of space... probably about four people could stand in that space, also. Personally, I think there should be a small fee for them; I'm aware it would discourage people from doing it and you're not meant to say things like that nowadays because it isn't 'green' or whatever, but still. We all know they sell more tickets than there are seats on a train, so it's annoying when space is taken by a bike.
ashkeba
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I await a picture of you and three good friends standing inside a kite-shaped outline 1.8m long by 0.5m wide. You'll need to be very good friends or used to commuting on SWR.
The train I get most frequently (TFW Rhyl to Birmingham International) is usually rammed full of holidaymakers who think their little sprogs should get seats even though they haven't paid, as they're under 5. Believe me, I've been made to squeeze into smaller than that.
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