Regular Double Headers

RichmondCommu · 20 Sep 2019

Hi everyone,

Hopefully the title is reasonably self explanatory. The only rules are trains that ran after the end of steam in August 1968 and no pairs of class 20s on freight workings.

So to kick things off in the early 1980s the 13.05 Sunday service from Nottingham to St Pancras would regularly feature two locomotives on their way down to the 'Smoke.

Thanks for reading this and hopefully there will be a few more suggestions.

Forgot to say triple Headers are also allowed!

RailUK Forums

martinsh · 20 Sep 2019

Prior to electrification to Glasgow in 1974, the WCML expresses north of Crewe (traction changeover) were almost all hauled by 2 x class 50

BRX · 21 Sep 2019

In the 90s I'd regularly enjoy seeing off the london sleeper from Inverness with two 37s on the front.

You'll find most of the nuclear flask trains double headed even today.

delt1c · 21 Sep 2019

In the 70’s the Inverness to Edinburgh and Glasgow were double headed by a mix of 24’s and 26’s. The Southbound sleeper was triple headed

Rob F · 21 Sep 2019

Summer dated services to Skegness, 2x class 20.

alistairlees · 21 Sep 2019

There will be lots! Some examples:
- 12.15 Sundays only Derby to St Pancras. Booked 2*45/1, but could produce quite a variety of things (I once had a 31/4 and a NB 47)
- summer Saturdays only Euston to Aberystwyth, and vice versa. 2*25 from Wolverhampton or Shrewsbury depending on the diagram.
- 06.35 TThO (have I got the data right? It didn’t run double headed every day, just some) Bristol Temple Meads to Plymouth. Double headed to Exeter St David’s. The train loco was booked a 47/4 (or a 50) I think, the pilot loco a 45/0. Got quite a mixture of things.
- I think the brighton to Plymouth / Penzance was booked 2*33?
- there was a Rose Grove (?) - Paignton that was booked 2*31
- the 07.40 (not exact time) Hull - Carlisle and return was booked 2*31

These are all from mid to late 1980s.

Springs Branch · 21 Sep 2019

Worth mentioning on the freight side were Port Talbot - Llanwern iron ore trains. Regularly worked by triple-headed Class 37s in the late 1970s.

BR apparently introduced triple heading in 1976 at the same time as HSTs to South Wales, so the ore trains could run fast enough to keep out of their way. Haulage subsequently went to 2x Class 56, then 1x Class 60.

Some discussion and links to picture are on the RMweb website here.

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/95085-triple-headed-class-37s-on-iron-ore/

randyrippley · 22 Sep 2019

late 60s early 70s............some Paddington-Plymouths were hauled by two Warships in multiple.
The MU jumpers were apparently reinstated on a small subfleet to allow it

Cowley · 22 Sep 2019

randyrippley said:
late 60s early 70s............some Paddington-Plymouths were hauled by two Warships in multiple.
The MU jumpers were apparently reinstated on a small subfleet to allow it

Another one from down our way was an early Newton Abbot to Exeter turn in the 1980s (maybe the 07:25 Newton Abbot to Exeter?) it was a pair of 50s on a West of England set that left Laira and went directly to NA as a way of getting a couple of 50s and a set of coaches in place for the days Waterloo workings.
It became a firm favourite with 50 bashers around then as it wasn’t all that easy getting pairs in those days.
There was also a westbound 50 hauled service that had an extra 50 attached at Exeter around 1986/87 presumably for the same reasons? I can’t remember what the train was though unfortunately.

hooverboy · 22 Sep 2019

st pancras intercities back in the 70's were operated by 2*cl25 if the regular 45 or 47 wasn't available.

Springs Branch · 22 Sep 2019

As well as Class 37 triple-headers between Port Talbot & Llanwern, there were similar iron ore workings in Scotland from Hunterston to Ravenscraig steelworks.

These ore trains were double-headed from Hunterston to Mossend, where a third loco was added for the triple-headed thrash up the hill to Ravenscraig - usually another 37, it seems, but sometimes could be something different like a Class 20 or 47.

The way it used to be:
https://flic.kr/p/dTLdAS

Hellfire departure from Mossend:

This one is actually hauling coal rather than iron ore, but heading for Ravenscraig nonetheless.

GusB · 22 Sep 2019

Springs Branch said:
As well as Class 37 triple-headers between Port Talbot & Llanwern, there were similar iron ore workings in Scotland from Hunterston to Ravenscraig steelworks.

These ore trains were double-headed from Hunterston to Mossend, where a third loco was added for the triple-headed thrash up the hill to Ravenscraig - usually another 37, it seems, but sometimes could be something different like a Class 20 or 47.

The way it used to be:
https://flic.kr/p/dTLdAS

Hellfire departure from Mossend:

This one is actually hauling coal rather than iron ore, but heading for Ravenscraig nonetheless.

That does bring back some memories. My grandparents lived in Kirkwood, Coatbridge and I recall seeing regular double-headed trains going over the viaduct nearby. I clearly remember my grandfather saying that they were heading to Hunterston or Ravenscraig. I was fairly sure that I'd seen some trains being triple-headed. It was mainly 37s that I saw, but there was the occasional 40 or pair of 20s.

Whistler40145 · 22 Sep 2019

In the early 1990s there was a Saturday Only Birmingham New Street to Pwlhelli booked for a pair of Bescot RETB fitted 31/1s.

apk55 · 22 Sep 2019

What about the Woodhead line
Most freight trains right to the end were double headed, initially by O4s or similar, latterly by EM1s.
And on the Worsborough incline these were often banked by a pair of locomotives (apart from a time when the monster LNER garret was used) meaning 4 locomotives on a train!

EbbwJunction1 · 22 Sep 2019

randyrippley said:
late 60s early 70s............some Paddington-Plymouths were hauled by two Warships in multiple. The MU jumpers were apparently reinstated on a small subfleet to allow it

I once saw one of those going through Slough … it was on platform road, and there was an announcement telling everyone to stand well back as the next train wasn't stopping! Very impressive!

xotGD · 22 Sep 2019

Whistler40145 said:
In the early 1990s there was a Saturday Only Birmingham New Street to Pwlhelli booked for a pair of Bescot RETB fitted 31/1s.

Before that the summer Saturday Cambrian Coast services were pairs of 37s and before that pairs of 25s.

Before 56s were allocated to Gateshead pairs of 37s worked mgr coal trains in the North East.

Pairs of 86s still work liners on the WCML. Back in the day it used to be a mixture of 86s and 87s.

alistairlees · 22 Sep 2019

Pairs of class 24s used to work the Tyne Dock to Consett iron ore trains. I think they (the 24s) must have finished working these in the mid to late 70s. After that was it 37s?

Bevan Price · 22 Sep 2019

Summer Saturdays:
Manchester - Yarmouth: 2xClass 25 to Lincoln (or later just Sheffield, when it ceased to run via Lincoln)
Walsall/Birmingham - Yarmouth & Derby - Yarmouth: Both 2xClass 25 as far as Norwich; Walsall locos returned to Derby, etc.
Derby - Skegness & Leicester - Skegness: Both 2xClass 25, later replaced by 2xClass 20.
In some years, Derby service started back from Burton on Trent; Leicester service started from Nuneaton.
Usually unadvertised Leicester - Skegness relief also 2x25, then 2x20.
Scarborough - Sheffield was 2x20 (York depot) in early 1970s.
Nottingham - Llandudno was 2x25 - but later reduced to a single 25; downgraded to suburban dmu in its final years, and I think starting from Derby in some years.
Sheffield - Nottingham - Skegness. Also 2x20 in some years.

Taunton · 22 Sep 2019

The longest established double headers must have been on the Highland main line, on most trains, the Class 24 and 26 (and indeed the same individual locos) from dieselisation in 1960 until well into the 1980s.

Always seemed illogical that the main line with the biggest climb in the country had the smallest locomotives. They even had the original small Sulzers, never changed for the mainstream type, of which there were hundreds, with another 100hp.

The Western had two shots with double heading their fastest services, 2 x 37 on South Wales trains and 2 x Warships to Plymouth. Both didn't last long, a single Western pretty much could handle the timings.

The coal trains from Wath over Woodhead were surely the only quadruple loco trains, two electric locos on the front and two pushing at the back.

gg1 · 23 Sep 2019

Taunton said:
The longest established double headers must have been on the Highland main line, on most trains, the Class 24 and 26 (and indeed the same individual locos) from dieselisation in 1960 until well into the 1980s.

Always seemed illogical that the main line with the biggest climb in the country had the smallest locomotives. They even had the original small Sulzers, never changed for the mainstream type, of which there were hundreds, with another 100hp.

Perhaps a single type 2 of any class would have had insufficent power anyway.

RLBH · 23 Sep 2019

Springs Branch said:
As well as Class 37 triple-headers between Port Talbot & Llanwern, there were similar iron ore workings in Scotland from Hunterston to Ravenscraig steelworks.

These ore trains were double-headed from Hunterston to Mossend, where a third loco was added for the triple-headed thrash up the hill to Ravenscraig - usually another 37, it seems, but sometimes could be something different like a Class 20 or 47.

I have it in my head that Mossend to Ravenscraig was normally two on the front and a banker on the rear, I think for reasons of bridge loading but it may have been operationally simpler. Even when the banker went on the front, I believe it was still driven independently rather than being under MU control.

RichmondCommu · 24 Sep 2019

Another example were the class 03s (and later on the class 08s) which worked in tandem on the former Burry Port and Gwendraeth railway. Complete of course with cut-down cabs and in the case of the 03s dinky little head lamps.

delt1c · 24 Sep 2019

curlcurlimp said:
Another example were the class 03s (and later on the class 08s) which worked in tandem on the former Burry Port and Gwendraeth railway. Complete of course with cut-down cabs and in the case of the 03s dinky little head lamps.

The 03 worked in multiple with a very basic connection between cabs

ElectroSoldier · 24 Sep 2019

Springs Branch said:
As well as Class 37 triple-headers between Port Talbot & Llanwern, there were similar iron ore workings in Scotland from Hunterston to Ravenscraig steelworks.

These ore trains were double-headed from Hunterston to Mossend, where a third loco was added for the triple-headed thrash up the hill to Ravenscraig - usually another 37, it seems, but sometimes could be something different like a Class 20 or 47.

The way it used to be:
https://flic.kr/p/dTLdAS

Hellfire departure from Mossend:

This one is actually hauling coal rather than iron ore, but heading for Ravenscraig nonetheless.

xotGD said:
Before that the summer Saturday Cambrian Coast services were pairs of 37s and before that pairs of 25s.

Before 56s were allocated to Gateshead pairs of 37s worked mgr coal trains in the North East.

Pairs of 86s still work liners on the WCML. Back in the day it used to be a mixture of 86s and 87s.

It was normal to see the 37/0 working doubles and on the steel trains in Wales triple was the norm until the 37/7 which could taken on those trains double headed.

Buxton, Great Rocks, Peak Dale etc saw a vast number of stone trains with double 37s. It was normal to see them refuel in pairs at Buxton refueling depot.

Iskra · 24 Sep 2019

Caledonian Sleeper Inverness portion was (is?) regularly double-headed under Serco.

ElectroSoldier · 24 Sep 2019

Freightliner regually run a pair of Class 86s on their liner runs up and down the mid portions of the WCML in and around Crewe.
We also double up the Class 90s too on some runs.

DRS always run the nuclear flask with a pair of something too

30907 · 24 Sep 2019

gg1 said:
Perhaps a single type 2 of any class would have had insufficent power anyway.

Quite. ScR presumably took a decision not to order a small batch of Type 4s because there were very few passenger trains that a single Type 2 couldn't handle, and it would have been difficult to diagram the larger locos effectively. The Highland line carried comparatively few trains back then.

alistairlees · 24 Sep 2019

curlcurlimp said:
Another example were the class 03s (and later on the class 08s) which worked in tandem on the former Burry Port and Gwendraeth railway. Complete of course with cut-down cabs and in the case of the 03s dinky little head lamps.

The 03s sometimes worked in threes, with two being in multiple and one independently crewed, according to https://www.2d53.co.uk/South Wales/BPGV 2.htm

Ken H · 24 Sep 2019

Didnt tinsley yard have some 08's that were paired up, with one cab removed, for hump shunting? Cl13

do the pairs of Cl27 on each end of the Edinburgh - Glasgow push pulls count?

And do an ex Cl25 converted to an ETHEL* + the actual loco count as double header?

*Electric train Heating Ex Locomotive

AJM580 · 24 Sep 2019

Summer Saturdays in Anglia land used to see plenty of pairs of 31s on holiday trains. Usually it was the Birmingham - Yarmouth that would produce as well as trips from Liverpool Lime Street later in the 80s

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