Class 350/1 refurbishment

xc170 · 9 Oct 2019

So they've removed the guards office and instead of adding extra seats, they've added a luggage rack?

Was the job more difficult than they thought as it looks as if most of the structure of the office remains?

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Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

xc170 said:
So they've removed the guards office and instead of adding extra seats, they've added a luggage rack?

Very much needed.

RealTrains07 · 9 Oct 2019

I think soon someone is gonna have to start following which 350/1s are going into refurb and which are going out like similar threads for TfW, SWR and WMR?

RealTrains07 · 9 Oct 2019

xc170 said:
So they've removed the guards office and instead of adding extra seats, they've added a luggage rack?

Was the job more difficult than they thought as it looks as if most of the structure of the office remains?

The only benefit of having one that i can see is due to the fact LNR serves 2 airports

NewSt · 9 Oct 2019

RealTrains07 said:
The only benefit of having one that i can see is due to the fact LNR serves 2 airports

Well, if we think realistically, we may have lost 2-4 seats by installation of that, but how much capacity do we gain in contrast to that now that there is a designated luggage storage space and people aren't cramming their suitcases under tables with them, meaning that people can't sit down?

Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

RealTrains07 said:
The only benefit of having one that i can see is due to the fact LNR serves 2 airports

Less so airports than the significant number of people travelling to/from London with luggage.

RealTrains07 · 9 Oct 2019

NewSt said:
Well, if we think realistically, we may have lost 2-4 seats by installation of that, but how much capacity do we gain in contrast to that now that there is a designated luggage storage space and people aren't cramming their suitcases under tables with them, meaning that people can't sit down?

True but then again TPE have similar luggage racks which waste space that could be taken by seats

fgwrich · 9 Oct 2019

The irony of this refurbishment vs the SWR one is that LNR/LNWR have finally fitted luggage racks to their Desiro's whereas SWR has chosen not to. I'll also agree about the quality of Standard vs First - SWR First Class looks like it's worth paying the little bit extra for, this does not.

Also interesting to see a mixture of positions for the plug sockets. Some are behind the seat backs (preferred location ala FGW HST) while others are in the annoying SWR position. However, unlike the SWR versions it's nice to see a USB socket included in these.

Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

RealTrains07 said:
True but then again TPE have similar luggage racks which waste space that could be taken by seats

In practice it doesn't waste space because it stops seats being taken up by luggage.

Long distance trains need floor-level luggage racks as well as overheads.

Silverlinky · 9 Oct 2019

NewSt said:
Well, if we think realistically, we may have lost 2-4 seats by installation of that, but how much capacity do we gain in contrast to that now that there is a designated luggage storage space and people aren't cramming their suitcases under tables with them, meaning that people can't sit down?

Realistically........I travelled on this train the other day as the 0924 from Northampton, full and standing thanks to the cancellation of the previous train. There was no luggage on the rack at all! Who is going to use the one rack? Its not like customers are going to put their luggage there and walk back two coaches to find a seat! The rack is only of use to people in the immediate vicinity, even 1st class is behind a closed glass door so they're not going to use it either!
For the most part its a waste of space.....commuter trains do not need luggage racks. They need the 4 extra seats that could have gone there instead.

Off peak long distance maybe there will be a case or two there....but if the only people who can sit next to their luggage are the bay of seats opposite it then again it hardly serves a purpose.

causton · 9 Oct 2019

fgwrich said:
The irony of this refurbishment vs the SWR one is that LNR/LNWR have finally fitted luggage racks to their Desiro's whereas SWR has chosen not to. I'll also agree about the quality of Standard vs First - SWR First Class looks like it's worth paying the little bit extra for, this does not.

Really?!?!

I have had nothing but complaints about the new First Class, on 450s particularly, whenever they have come up in conversation, and when I've travelled on them myself.

Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

causton said:
Really?!?!

I have had nothing but complaints about the new First Class, on 450s particularly, whenever they have come up in conversation, and when I've travelled on them myself.

I'd complain...I like the extra-legroom table being in Standard!

(That table in the end section is definitely far superior to First Class in the 350s).

Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

Silverlinky said:
Realistically........I travelled on this train the other day as the 0924 from Northampton, full and standing thanks to the cancellation of the previous train. There was no luggage on the rack at all! Who is going to use the one rack? Its not like customers are going to put their luggage there and walk back two coaches to find a seat! The rack is only of use to people in the immediate vicinity, even 1st class is behind a closed glass door so they're not going to use it either!

I suppose you could argue that they should have put a bay of 4 there and put a half-sized version of that rack in each of two of the all-Standard coaches?

RealTrains07 · 9 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
In practice it doesn't waste space because it stops seats being taken up by luggage.

Long distance trains need floor-level luggage racks as well as overheads.

Exactly LNR do need luggage racks then arguably. Especially for their liverpool - london 4 hour train especially :lol:

BucksBones · 9 Oct 2019

Looks great I think. My only criticism is the baggy, loosely-reupholstered moquette in 1st - it’ll look awful in no time.

(Also, it really doesn’t matter but I’m quite surprised they couldn’t find any new stickers and I’d have thought they might have painted over the Central/Silverlink blue panels near the doors!)

Full marks for standard class, the sockets and the luggage rack - absolutely the right thing to do with that space.

causton · 9 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I suppose you could argue that they should have put a bay of 4 there and put a half-sized version of that rack in each of two of the all-Standard coaches?

I don't think seats can be put in that part of the carriage (from a reputable source, but half remembered) so it is either luggage space or wasted space. (Maybe they should have left it empty for a crush-loading-standing-luggage-wheelchair-bike-rubbish-storing-facility!)

Bletchleyite · 9 Oct 2019

causton said:
I don't think seats can be put in that part of the carriage (from a reputable source, but half remembered) so it is either luggage space or wasted space. (Maybe they should have left it empty for a crush-loading-standing-luggage-wheelchair-bike-rubbish-storing-facility!)

I wonder why not? There are seats there on the /2 and /3.

RealTrains07 · 9 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
I wonder why not? There are seats there on the /2 and /3.

And the 450s

387star · 10 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Looks good to me. The new seat covers make Standard look even more vastly superior to 1st than it already was!

Seat covers look a bit uninviting isn't that flat cloth?

F Great Eastern · 10 Oct 2019

Saw my first passenger with head resting against the screen, he was bloody tall but that's the problem with having the screens directly above the seat, should be a clearence zone

RealTrains07 · 10 Oct 2019

387star said:
Seat covers look a bit uninviting isn't that flat cloth?

By flat you mean no pattern? Standard and first have a similar pattern on part of their seats.

swt_passenger · 10 Oct 2019

xc170 said:
So they've removed the guards office and instead of adding extra seats, they've added a luggage rack?

Was the job more difficult than they thought as it looks as if most of the structure of the office remains?

Removing the office structure should have been a simple case of copying what was done on the 450s, it’s not as though they’d be doing anything more difficult on 350s...

Bletchleyite · 10 Oct 2019

F Great Eastern said:
Saw my first passenger with head resting against the screen, he was bloody tall but that's the problem with having the screens directly above the seat, should be a clearence zone

He must be VERY tall. I'm quite tall and I can rest my head on the headrest of Grammer E3000s. It's one reason I like them over lower-backed seats.

supervc-10 · 10 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
He must be VERY tall. I'm quite tall and I can rest my head on the headrest of Grammer E3000s. It's one reason I like them over lower-backed seats.

Ditto. I'm 6'2, and I'm miles away from sticking my head out the top of the Grammer seats. Maybe he was sitting on a cushion? My grandmother used to do that so she could see over the steering wheel, but she was 4'10 on a good day :lol:

F Great Eastern · 10 Oct 2019

supervc-10 said:
Ditto. I'm 6'2, and I'm miles away from sticking my head out the top of the Grammer seats. Maybe he was sitting on a cushion? My grandmother used to do that so she could see over the steering wheel, but she was 4'10 on a good day

Haven't sat in one yet, was only on it for one stop so couldn't judge the height of those seats to the monitor yet properly!

NewSt · 10 Oct 2019

RealTrains07 said:
By flat you mean no pattern? Standard and first have a similar pattern on part of their seats.

No, by flat cloth he means the sort of material that GWR use on their IETs and Northern use on their 331 and 195 seats, rather than moquette.

NewSt · 10 Oct 2019

BucksBones said:
My only criticism is the baggy, loosely-reupholstered moquette in 1st - it’ll look awful in no time

It looks awful already!

NewSt · 10 Oct 2019

Silverlinky said:
I travelled on this train the other day as the 0924 from Northampton, full and standing thanks to the cancellation of the previous train. There was no luggage on the rack at all!

And I travelled on an unrefurbished Class 350/1 from Birmingham International to Liverpool (via South Parkway) and had to stand for part of the way because all of the seats were taken up by luggage, as there was nowhere else for it to be put. I think that if they made passengers aware of its location and presence, in the long run t would be a great asset to have.

Bletchleyite · 10 Oct 2019

NewSt said:
And I travelled on an unrefurbished Class 350/1 from Birmingham International to Liverpool (via South Parkway) and had to stand for part of the way because all of the seats were taken up by luggage, as there was nowhere else for it to be put. I think that if they made passengers aware of its location and presence, in the long run t would be a great asset to have.

Were the overheads full? In my experience they usually aren't - people are simply too bone-idle to put bags up or use them as a means of getting a double seat.

NewSt · 10 Oct 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Were the overheads full? In my experience they usually aren't - people are simply too bone-idle to put bags up or use them as a means of getting a double seat.

No, they weren't, but I'm mainly talking about suitcases.

Class 350/1 refurbishment

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