Trivia: Signals That Never Show Green

edwin_m said:

I think R as a suffix is still quite common. If I recall correctly a new distant or repeater will get its own number.

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Annnnnnnnnd deep breath...... probably a few deviations out there (*RDRR)



*Simpsons joke fyi

Then to muddy the mix you have banner repeaters which have nothing.

ElectroSoldier said:

Then to muddy the mix you have banner repeaters which have nothing.

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Usually a suffix BR I think, although new ones may have their own numbers too.

I don't know if this would count, Signal T888 on the northbound platform at Darlington Railway Station. this picture is looking South. I don't think I have ever seen a movement facing south on this platform, There are shunting Signals attached so I don't think it would be used for that.

AlthoughI don't know if it meets the OP's prerequisite for being able to display green (i.e is it a multi coloured LED).

Serathor said:

I don't know if this would count, Signal T888 on the northbound platform at Darlington Railway Station. this picture is looking South. I don't think I have ever seen a movement facing south on this platform, There are shunting Signals attached so I don't think it would be used for that.

AlthoughI don't know if it meets the OP's prerequisite for being able to display green (i.e is it a multi coloured LED).

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Looks to have a route up to T908 at the southern end of the platform, which in turn will have routes onto either track of the ECML or towards Eaglescliffe. There is no main route over the crossover, hence the lack of route indicator, but it can apparently display yellow or green. Might be used if a train is turned back here, though I don't think that happens often in that platform.

edwin_m said:

Looks to have a route up to T908 at the southern end of the platform, which in turn will have routes onto either track of the ECML or towards Eaglescliffe. There is no main route over the crossover, hence the lack of route indicator, but it can apparently display yellow or green. Might be used if a train is turned back here, though I don't think that happens often in that platform.

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There is also signal 951 on the D'ton to Stockton line, which controls the exit from the Cleveland Bridge site, the track has now gone I believe (the track is still there, to just in front of the signal, and the lead in is still on the main track. but the signal is still there. and as the points are never going to be set. I doubt it's ever going to show green again.

WH496 heading south out of Bedford station platform 3 can only show red or single yellow, it leads onto the down slow in the up direction to Bedford south junction.

rower40 said:

ARS on Edinburgh doesn't set route over Princes Street Gardens for a train stopping at Haymarket, until that train has left Haymarket station. So all stopping trains will never get better than double-yellow on those signals - unless the signaller intervenes to set route "early" over Princes Street Gardens. Non-stop (possibly ECS) trains might get a green there, but there'd have to be nothing needing to use the crossovers at Princes Street Gardens at the same time.

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Not strictly relevant to this thread but a feature of the late 1970’s Waverley resignalling. Shortly before commissioning it was realised that failure of certain lamps in the Multi Lamp Route Indicators (MLRI) on the ‘home signals’ on the approach from Princess Street Gardens presented a safety risk. Loss of two lamps bottom right showing ‘18’ could result in drivers seeing ‘19’. Platform 18 is a short bay, whereas 19 is a through line, a driver expecting to to use platform 19 but discovering buffer stops ahead might be less than amused.

Due to the signals being ground mounted at the exit of the Mound Tunnel, repeaters including MLRI were provided on a gantry immediately before the Tunnel entrance to aid sighting. Yours truly was tasked with coming up with a solution requiring extra lamp proving relays, made even more complex with two different designs of MLRI. These were ground mounted Westinghouse 7x7 lamp units on the tunnel exit with relays in the nearby Apparatus Room and 2 off 7x5 lamp GEC-General Signal units on the repeaters with relays inside the MLRI.

Much head scratching took place, testing to ensure the correct relays were used and ordered, wiring details issued for installation and test, followed by on site testing ensued.

Today with characters using fibre optic or LED technology would eliminate the problem. All Jolly Good Fun (a term used on a totally different railway, no prizes for guessing which!).

rower40 said:

ARS on Edinburgh doesn't set route over Princes Street Gardens for a train stopping at Haymarket, until that train has left Haymarket station. So all stopping trains will never get better than double-yellow on those signals - unless the signaller intervenes to set route "early" over Princes Street Gardens. Non-stop (possibly ECS) trains might get a green there, but there'd have to be nothing needing to use the crossovers at Princes Street Gardens at the same time.

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I commuted to Haymarket for a period, many years before ARS was added, and I don't recall ever seeing green on the platform starter either. So not surprisingly it was set up to replicate what the signalers had proved to be the best approach.

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edwin_m said:

A distant can certainly show a green and any number of yellows but not a red.

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Not unless you’ve got a dozen or so of these beauties of your patch lol

Sunset route said:

Not unless you’ve got a dozen or so of these beauties of your patch lol

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Interesting, but not a distant according to the Glossary I quoted and I'm not sure whether it should have a triangle plate (though it could be grandfathered under earlier versions of standards). It could still be approached at red if, for example, the track circuit beyond it failed.

There is a 3 aspect colour light signal at the end of the southbound platform at Bridge of Allan which never shows yellow. It is an IB home controlled by Dunblane and was installed many years ago in preparation for ROSS2 (Rationalisation of Signalling in Scotland Phase 2). ROSS2 was cancelled so the yellow aspect remained and remains unused.

Sunset route said:

Not unless you’ve got a dozen or so of these beauties of your patch lol

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edwin_m said:

Interesting, but not a distant according to the Glossary I quoted and I'm not sure whether it should have a triangle plate (though it could be grandfathered under earlier versions of standards). It could still be approached at red if, for example, the track circuit beyond it failed.

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They certainly are distant signals and when working that way for the bi-directional signalling they can not display a red aspect. But under normal signalling will display a red aspect.

They do cause problems when required to set trains back due to failure as they will be displaying a red aspect and trains will need to be talked passed them and you have to be aware not to get two trains in a single section when doing so, as they are technically a distant signal and this no separate TD berth.

There is no grandfather rights, from a new installation that replaced our SIMBIDS.

Signal ML 59 on the Up Southport in the Down direction at Bank Hall station.
Two routes from that signal, the first is from the Down Southport to the Up Southport the other is to the Down & Up Goods (Note that the Down & Up Goods is a single track otherwise it would be called the Up Goods and the Down Goods) at Bootle Junction. Neither route will give you a green aspect as both routes are diverging. But I think its only a 2 aspect signal neither of white is green